Cheating trials. (1 Viewer)

help him cheat or no


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unsw no good :(

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Hi,
so I have a friend who currently is still in yr 12 and has his trials in a week or so. He recently messaged me out of the blue (we're not that close) and asked me to help him with his trials. I agreed, thinking he meant asking questions and stuff. But rather, he wanted me to do his trial exams with him since everything is all online. Now I'm in a dilemma on whether to help him cheat or just reject him and I don't know what to do.
 

DheerChoudhury

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Hi,
so I have a friend who currently is still in yr 12 and has his trials in a week or so. He recently messaged me out of the blue (we're not that close) and asked me to help him with his trials. I agreed, thinking he meant asking questions and stuff. But rather, he wanted me to do his trial exams with him since everything is all online. Now I'm in a dilemma on whether to help him cheat or just reject him and I don't know what to do.
Honestly, I'm disappointed in your friend. Without a doubt, you should deny his request.
However, you can help me if you're up for it ;)
 

DarkOperator618

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Hi,
so I have a friend who currently is still in yr 12 and has his trials in a week or so. He recently messaged me out of the blue (we're not that close) and asked me to help him with his trials. I agreed, thinking he meant asking questions and stuff. But rather, he wanted me to do his trial exams with him since everything is all online. Now I'm in a dilemma on whether to help him cheat or just reject him and I don't know what to do.
youre not that close lol

you can see where this goes
 

jimmysmith560

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Do not engage in cheating under any circumstances. You are in no way obliged/responsible for someone else's preparations (or seemingly lack thereof) or their performance. Your friend's performance in his trial exams is something he needs to worry about, not you.
 

DarkOperator618

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Do not engage in cheating under any circumstances. You are in no way obliged/responsible for someone else's preparations (or seemingly lack thereof) or their performance. Your friend's performance in his trial exams is something he needs to worry about, not you.
i think the more important question is

is your trials weighted @unsw no good :(
 

jazz519

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Hi,
so I have a friend who currently is still in yr 12 and has his trials in a week or so. He recently messaged me out of the blue (we're not that close) and asked me to help him with his trials. I agreed, thinking he meant asking questions and stuff. But rather, he wanted me to do his trial exams with him since everything is all online. Now I'm in a dilemma on whether to help him cheat or just reject him and I don't know what to do.
I've had messages like that from people randomly out of the blue as well before asking to do their quiz or help with exam questions, not for HSC but at uni, but it's still the same kind of thing in terms of someone asking you to do something that they should be doing. It can be awkward saying no to someone that you know like a friend, but if it's something that you are uncomfortable with morally or for whatever other reason it's not something you should engage in.

In terms of morally speaking, it's bad to be trying to cheat an exam for someone (it's essentially like doing plagiarism on a hand in report). It is unfair to other students in that class as their rankings might be impacted and as a past HSC student you can probably understand how hard it is to get a good atar.

It's already obvious from the message you wrote that you are in a dilemma and not comfortable with the situation. It is okay to say no to someone, you don't have to always do what people ask you, which is something you will learn as you do more stuff in life. Aside from that someone who just messages you like that out of the blue who isn't even close with you, is not someone I would personally associate with being a friend. They are not messaging you because they are your friend but because they want to take advantage of you and your potential willingness to help and I doubt you are the only one they have messaged asking for this. Already sounds sus at the point of messaging out of nowhere and is further sus by not actually disclosing what they wanted help in the first place. So you probably ended up replying saying yeah I can help and then they drop the do my assessment for me, which is quite manipulative behaviour in my opinion. Also, later on probably they will keep asking for stuff and it won't end when you've done it once, because that's what the kind of people who cheat do, they will keep pushing it and make you do other things.

The way I handled this is not to straight up say those things to them, even if you might think that because it's not your responsibility to outline to them why you don't want to do it and creates unnecessary drama. I just said to them something like I am too busy at the moment and then just list x,y,z random reasons.
 

DarkOperator618

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I've had messages like that from people randomly out of the blue as well before asking to do their quiz or help with exam questions, not for HSC but at uni, but it's still the same kind of thing in terms of someone asking you to do something that they should be doing. It can be awkward saying no to someone that you know like a friend, but if it's something that you are uncomfortable with morally or for whatever other reason it's not something you should engage in.

In terms of morally speaking, it's bad to be trying to cheat an exam for someone (it's essentially like doing plagiarism on a hand in report). It is unfair to other students in that class as their rankings might be impacted and as a past HSC student you can probably understand how hard it is to get a good atar.

It's already obvious from the message you wrote that you are in a dilemma and not comfortable with the situation. It is okay to say no to someone, you don't have to always do what people ask you, which is something you will learn as you do more stuff in life. Aside from that someone who just messages you like that out of the blue who isn't even close with you, is not someone I would personally associate with being a friend. They are not messaging you because they are your friend but because they want to take advantage of you and your potential willingness to help and I doubt you are the only one they have messaged asking for this. Already sounds sus at the point of messaging out of nowhere and is further sus by not actually disclosing what they wanted help in the first place. So you probably ended up replying saying yeah I can help and then they drop the do my assessment for me, which is quite manipulative behaviour in my opinion. Also, later on probably they will keep asking for stuff and it won't end when you've done it once, because that's what the kind of people who cheat do, they will keep pushing it and make you do other things.

The way I handled this is not to straight up say those things to them, even if you might think that because it's not your responsibility to outline to them why you don't want to do it and creates unnecessary drama. I just said to them something like I am too busy at the moment and then just list x,y,z random reasons.
is it bad if i offered for me and my mates to do our business trials together on a zoom call?

our trials aren't weighted btw
 

jazz519

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is it bad if i offered for me and my mates to do our business trials together on a zoom call?

our trials aren't weighted btw
It's not weighted so it won't impact ranks but it's still not really a smart idea in my opinion for other reasons. Trials is the first time most students do a 3 hr exam in timed conditions and the feedback here in how you answer questions is important. If you are writing what your friends know or the other way around, then how are you going to improve, if the feedback you get isn't based on your own work. If it's not weighted then that's an even more good reason to do it without cheating because you get to have a whole exam marked and know where your strengths and weaknesses are in the syllabus without any impact on your grades. In the actual HSC exam no one is going to help you and so you have to be able to do it yourself. Important aspects of doing exams are not just knowing all the content, but doing exams in timed strict conditions, trains your brain to allocate time based on the marks and also develops strategies you use on questions you don't understand the first time because they are difficult, which you might revisit later in the exam. If someone just gives you the answers for those, then chances are you might end up panicking in the actual HSC exam when you don't how to stay calm and think through it when you don't understand the question right away.

Also, keep in mind teachers are not dumb. I don't know what repercussions there could be since it's not weighted, but being someone who marks a lot of exam papers as a tutor, it's very obvious when a student is cheating, copying things that they don't understand or just getting the answer without any working. I will give you an example from my own tutoring and marking. I marked the homework of 2 students, one of them answered all the questions with working, even if some of the answers were wrong. The other student magically has the same answers in basically every question and hasn't shown any working. Pretty obvious if you see it what's going on.
 
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DarkOperator618

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It's not weighted so it won't impact ranks but it's still not really a smart idea in my opinion for other reasons. Trials is the first time most students do a 3 hr exam in timed conditions and the feedback here in how you answer questions is important. If you are writing what your friends know or the other way around, then how are you going to improve, if the feedback you get isn't based on your own work. If it's not weighted then that's an even more good reason to do it without cheating because you get to have a whole exam marked and know where your strengths and weaknesses are in the syllabus without any impact on your grades. In the actual HSC exam no one is going to help you and so you have to be able to do it yourself. Important aspects of doing exams are not just knowing all the content, but doing exams in timed strict conditions, trains your brain to allocate time based on the marks and also develops strategies you use on questions you don't understand the first time because they are difficult, which you might revisit later in the exam. If someone just gives you the answers for those, then chances are you might end up panicking in the actual HSC exam when you don't how to stay calm and think through it when you don't understand the question right away.

Also, keep in mind teachers are not dumb. I don't know what repercussions there could be since it's not weighted, but being someone who marks a lot of exam papers as a tutor, it's very obvious when a student is cheating, copying things that they don't understand or just getting the answer without any working. I will give you an example from my own tutoring and marking. I marked the homework of 2 students, one of them answered all the questions with working, even if some of the answers were wrong. The other student magically has the same answers in basically every question and hasn't shown any working. Pretty obvious if you see it what's going on.
fair enough

i didn't actually proceed with doing the exam with my friends tho lol
 

nourished.

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Hi,
so I have a friend who currently is still in yr 12 and has his trials in a week or so. He recently messaged me out of the blue (we're not that close) and asked me to help him with his trials. I agreed, thinking he meant asking questions and stuff. But rather, he wanted me to do his trial exams with him since everything is all online. Now I'm in a dilemma on whether to help him cheat or just reject him and I don't know what to do.
I totally understand where he's coming from. Also understand that people generally reach out to cheat as the very last resort.

So, he's probably very, very stressed.

If you want to help him out, send him a few good resources.

If you don't want to help him out, send him a few good resources anyways. But, be clear that you're firm on not helping him cheat.
 

icycledough

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is it bad if i offered for me and my mates to do our business trials together on a zoom call?

our trials aren't weighted btw
I'm sure you've heard of the saying 'Too many cooks spoil the broth', and I think this analogy can be used in this situation. Especially for business studies where a lot of questions will be extended responses, there are 2 issues which can arise.

1) Will you all have enough time to get your own exams done and submitted in time, as well as helping out each other (will make it harder if it is too big of a group)?

2) The likelihood of being caught for cheating will increase a lot for extended response style questions (not so much for MC questions).

At the end of the day, it's up to you as to what you choose to do, but to be used to what your HSC exams will be like, I would recommend doing it properly on your own, as collaborating in the HSC isn't allowed anyway.
 

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