Finance Postgrad - which uni? (2 Viewers)

[Ryuuzaki]

So I have completed a BSc (Actuarial Science) degree and got sick of anything actuarial. I managed to get accepted into an honours program in finance this year (finishing in november 2009), and so far I'm enjoying it.

I'm thinking of heading off next year to do a Masters in Finance or a MPhil in Finance (eventually leading to a phd) but I'm not too sure which university to go to. Currently I'm considering University of Melbourne, University of Sydney, UNSW and ANU.

Does anyone have any recommendations on which university to choose?

My areas of interest for research is in financial econometics, asset pricing models and financial modelling. And I don't intend to be an academic, will probably head out and find a real job after the phd (probably as a quant analyst or in risk managing).

 

[Studentleader]

Don't do a PhD if you only want a job out of it

M.Quant Finance @ UTS

 

[yoddle]

Wait, does MPhil mean a Master of Philosophy?

...in finance?

 

[Ryuuzaki]

Don't do a PhD if you only want a job out of it

M.Quant Finance @ UTS

Yeah, I've had people say the same thing about PhDs being for academics only. My view remains that research will be beneficial regardless and I might as well do it before I hit the workforce.

Wait, does MPhil mean a Master of Philosophy?

...in finance?

Yeh, from what I gather, there's a masters in coursework (a normal masters) and a masters in research (MPhil).

Future Students - Postgraduate - Master of Philosophy

 

[Ben1220]

Don't do a PhD if you only want a job out of it

M.Quant Finance @ UTS

Actually, the top quant jobs like you to have phd's.

from
http://www.ms.unimelb.edu.au/~mscareer/pdf/ANZ_talk.pdf

"The Ideal Quant
Education
– PhD in a numerate discipline
• Maths, Physics, Engineering, Computational Finance"

That's the kind of job you are looking for? Most people don't even know jobs like this exist lol.

 

[Studentleader]

Actually, the top quant jobs like you to have phd's.

from
http://www.ms.unimelb.edu.au/~mscareer/pdf/ANZ_talk.pdf

"The Ideal Quant
Education
– PhD in a numerate discipline
• Maths, Physics, Engineering, Computational Finance"

That's the kind of job you are looking for? Most people don't even know jobs like this exist lol.

Over the last few years masters degrees have become more and more valid in the quant world due to little improvements made by PhD student research.

4 Years is a LONGGGGGG time to hope at the end you will have a job - if you are going to do a masters try do a masters by research - that'll tell you if you are ready for a PhD or not more than your BSc

Edit: Also if you want to be a quant a Maths PhD would be ALOT more respectible than a finance one.

 

[Ryuuzaki]

Actually, the top quant jobs like you to have phd's.

from
http://www.ms.unimelb.edu.au/~mscareer/pdf/ANZ_talk.pdf

"The Ideal Quant
Education
– PhD in a numerate discipline
• Maths, Physics, Engineering, Computational Finance"

That's the kind of job you are looking for? Most people don't even know jobs like this exist lol.

Thanks for the link Ben !

Over the last few years masters degrees have become more and more valid in the quant world due to little improvements made by PhD student research.

4 Years is a LONGGGGGG time to hope at the end you will have a job - if you are going to do a masters try do a masters by research - that'll tell you if you are ready for a PhD or not more than your BSc

Edit: Also if you want to be a quant a Maths PhD would be ALOT more respectible than a finance one.

I understand that a Maths PhD would be better, but I guess whilst I enjoy more complex maths, my interest still lies in applying maths in financial models. If anything, I'd consider a PhD in Stats more interesting than Maths, but at the end of the day, I'd still choose Finance. If I don't get a job as a quant, it's not the end of the world .

I do envy you tho! Wish I did Maths and Computing at the bachelor level (and at UWA rather than Curtin) and then moved onto finance... would've been better than an actuarial degree.

 

[Studentleader]

I do envy you tho! Wish I did Maths and Computing at the bachelor level (and at UWA rather than Curtin) and then moved onto finance... would've been better than an actuarial degree.

I think you'll get into a post-grad finance program alot easier than me: pretty much all post grad econometrics courses require an economics undergraduate degree and I'd assume the same with finance.

Are you sure your not looking for a PhD in financial mathematics (as opposed to finance)? I'm not sure how the Government helps in regards to scholarships but I think if your PhD is through a mathematics school as opposed to a business school you'll end up with more money (due to the national priority scheme.)

I'm dropping commerce next year so hopefully I can survive 2 more years of maths before I can actually start the econometrics/financial mathematics degree that I want to do!

 

[velox]

I think you'll get into a post-grad finance program alot easier than me: pretty much all post grad econometrics courses require an economics undergraduate degree and I'd assume the same with finance.

Are you sure your not looking for a PhD in financial mathematics (as opposed to finance)? I'm not sure how the Government helps in regards to scholarships but I think if your PhD is through a mathematics school as opposed to a business school you'll end up with more money (due to the national priority scheme.)

I'm dropping commerce next year so hopefully I can survive 2 more years of maths before I can actually start the econometrics/financial mathematics degree that I want to do!

You should know better. There are no fees for PHD positions for australian residents.

If he gets 1st class honours he should get an APA with a top up. $~25 000 p.a.

 

[Studentleader]

You should know better. There are no fees for PHD positions for australian residents.

If he gets 1st class honours he should get an APA with a top up. $~25 000 p.a.

Just assumed there was some grant system - too used to looking up USA/Europe PhDs ><

 

[Ryuuzaki]

I think you'll get into a post-grad finance program alot easier than me: pretty much all post grad econometrics courses require an economics undergraduate degree and I'd assume the same with finance.

Are you sure your not looking for a PhD in financial mathematics (as opposed to finance)? I'm not sure how the Government helps in regards to scholarships but I think if your PhD is through a mathematics school as opposed to a business school you'll end up with more money (due to the national priority scheme.)

I'm dropping commerce next year so hopefully I can survive 2 more years of maths before I can actually start the econometrics/financial mathematics degree that I want to do!

I'm actually considering a PhD in financial econometrics or quantitative finance. Financial mathematics sounds interesting... I'll look up more on it. Cheers~

 

[Ryuuzaki]

Hey guys,

So I've narrowed my choices down to Financial Mathematics @ UNSW and Quantitative Finance @ University of Sydney.

I guess my question really is, which of the two is a better choice? I'm leaning more towards the University of Sydney as they're number 2/3 in Australia... but ultimately it'll come down to which uni has the better (more well known) professors in the field

 

[Studentleader]

Hey guys,

So I've narrowed my choices down to Financial Mathematics @ UNSW and Quantitative Finance @ University of Sydney.

I guess my question really is, which of the two is a better choice? I'm leaning more towards the University of Sydney as they're number 2/3 in Australia... but ultimately it'll come down to which uni has the better (more well known) professors in the field

UTS is more practical and apparently one of the best Quant Finance programs in the world.

Heres some threads that may help you:
Quant Finance books forum &bull; View topic - Sydney
Quant Finance books forum &bull; View topic - PhD a necessity to be a quant + misc career advice
Wilmott Forums - Australia UTS quantitative finance, HELP

Goodluck!

 

[Ryuuzaki]

I'll be honest, I'm not really looking at UTS atm since it's not one of the top universities around. I am willing to be swayed if you have a good argument tho...

 

[akqjt]

I'll be honest, I'm not really looking at UTS atm since it's not one of the top universities around. I am willing to be swayed if you have a good argument tho...

UTS is not one of the worlds top uni's (true) but the MQF is Aus's only true quant fin degree and is very 'respected' - the UNSW masters is purely theoretical, if you just look at the course descriptions, whereas the UTS masters covers practical topics encountered in industry.

This is info I've gathered second hand from various forums.

 

[Ryuuzaki]

UTS is not one of the worlds top uni's (true) but the MQF is Aus's only true quant fin degree and is very 'respected' - the UNSW masters is purely theoretical, if you just look at the course descriptions, whereas the UTS masters covers practical topics encountered in industry.

This is info I've gathered second hand from various forums.

What about the University of Sydney tho?

The reason I'm asking is cuz I don't wanna get tricked into signing up again for a less prestigious university just because they are the "only true" degree in that field like I've done for my bachelor degree only to find out later that the lecturers were under-qualified and the entire degree was a joke.

 

[akqjt]

What about the University of Sydney tho?

The reason I'm asking is cuz I don't wanna get tricked into signing up again for a less prestigious university just because they are the "only true" degree in that field like I've done for my bachelor degree only to find out later that the lecturers were under-qualified and the entire degree was a joke.

Are you referring to USYD's honours/PhD financial math programs? I don't think USYD offer a Masters in any 'financial maths' disciplines (not 100% sure, just never read/heard about). I can't really comment, as I said I haven't read/heard much about USYD. If you're talking about honours/PhD programs I think USYD is on par with UNSW, maybe USYD has a slightly higher prestige factor etc but I think they are the same (find someone more knowledgeable to ask).

A piece of anecdotal evidence I can offer is that a friend of mine knows a guy doing a PhD in financial maths at UNSW, who did his bachelors/honours at USYD. He went to UNSW for his PhD because he felt that UNSW had a stronger financial maths department as a professor (whos significance or importance I don't know) had recently (at the time) retired from USYD. This is just the opinion of 'that person'.

 

[Ryuuzaki]

Are you referring to USYD's honours/PhD financial math programs? I don't think USYD offer a Masters in any 'financial maths' disciplines (not 100% sure, just never read/heard about). I can't really comment, as I said I haven't read/heard much about USYD. If you're talking about honours/PhD programs I think USYD is on par with UNSW, maybe USYD has a slightly higher prestige factor etc but I think they are the same (find someone more knowledgeable to ask).

A piece of anecdotal evidence I can offer is that a friend of mine knows a guy doing a PhD in financial maths at UNSW, who did his bachelors/honours at USYD. He went to UNSW for his PhD because he felt that UNSW had a stronger financial maths department as a professor (whos significance or importance I don't know) had recently (at the time) retired from USYD. This is just the opinion of 'that person'.

Alrighty, thanks for your input! I will consider it.

And yes, Usyd does offer an MCom (Quant Finance) major. Currently leaning towards university of sydney, but I'm having a hard time justifying why

 

[Studentleader]

Heres a blog for you to have a look at How to get a Job in Quantitative Finance
It is written by a Quant Headhunter who gives quite good advice - here is the post you should read
How to get a Job in Quantitative Finance: Ranking Finance Courses

Unless you get someone who would rather hire someone who went to UWA than Curtin purely on the basis that UWA ranks higher they will understand the reputation of the quant finance parts of the universities themselves as opposed to 'lol UNSW is Go8.' Considering you went to Curtin as opposed to UWA though I doubt prestige is that much of a factor

My question for you is do you want to work in Australia?

If you do want to stay in Australia every firm that hires you will know what UTS is.

If you want to work overseas remember that more people worldwide would rather go to Stanford university than Australian National University even though ANU is ranked higher ( QS Top Universities: Top 100 universities in the THE - QS World University Rankings 2007 .) Lets now assume you apply for an entry quant job to Firm X in London/USA - the person who ultimately decides whether you are bright enough will be a Quant not some UG from HR. If this Quant doesn't know anything about the programs offered in Australia he can google "quant finance australia" to get the top result:

25 May 2009 ... Welcome to the Quantitative Finance Research Centre at the University of Technology, Sydney which is located in Sydney, Australia.
www.qfrc.uts.edu.au/ - Cached - Similar -

Then after more UTS a USA link then MU - this isn't fair because UTS's course is named Quant Finance - so googling "mathematical finance australia" we get
1. All Masters courses
2. UNSW
3. USA
4. UTS
Now I bet your thinking I'm a dickhead for using Google to justify that UTS has some rep and I probably am (serves you right for taking advice from a 08er.)

Lets have a look at this article on 'The Top 10 Quant Schools, According to the Street' ( http://www.advancedtrading.com/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=209102204 )
I'll list the top 10 schools with their world uni ranking from the link I used beforehand:
Carnegie Mellon University 21
Columbia University 10
Cornell University 15
New York University 40
Princeton University 12
Rutgers University 151
Stanford University 17
University of California at Berkeley 30?
University of Chicago 8
University of Michigan 18
Honourable mentions:
Baruch College (Not listed)
Boston University 46
Georgia Institute of Technology 83
University of Toronto 41

I personally have only heard of 7 of these unis.

I'm probably going a bit overboard now but if uni ranking is really that important to you do an online masters with one of those unis (UCA Berkeley is the one I'd go for though it is aimed for people who have finished a maths PhD.)

EDIT: In the time that it took me to finish this post 4 more came up - I feel like this post is pretty crap now I've finished it

 

[Casmira]

Do
not
go
to
unsw
for
finance