Should there be an Aboriginal voice to parliament? (5 Viewers)

[SylviaB]

Yeah my hope is that I'm right and that if/when the voice fails, it prompts the left go into pro-aboriginal overdrive in response and that this further alienates people

But yeah, Australia is absolutely done as a country, I think all of this stuff is basically just changing the speed and manner in which it is completely ruined. Even the ostensibly pro-australia stuff of resisting china is clearly going to be pivoted into being pro-india. And I doubt there will be a sufficiently precipitous decline in living standards to wake people up. Just gradual decline to ever more shitiness that can easily blamed on old white people

 

[cosmo 2]

the precipitous decline in living standards is already here imo, its just two speed. like i said before, boomers live it up while a lot of younger people are packing into share homes or living at home with their parents, but young people are so mentally captured and distracted by bullshit like LGBT or BLM they dont care about economic issues. and even if they do they never point the finger at immigration, which is the direct cause of a lot of their despair.

i see a lot of the so-called housing affordability debate being channeled into bullshit about YIMBYs vs NIMBYs and 'planning' rules which is clearly all one big psyop by the property development lobby. notice how it's always 100% supply side, busted land markets can only ever be fixed by addressing the supply side but never the demand side. follow the money where a lot of these discourses are originating and it always leads back to cashed up developers etc who want to build more skykennels for migrants on the cheap and run away with the profits.

 

[cosmo 2]

.

 

[unhealthyharold]

Yeah my hope is that I'm right and that if/when the voice fails, it prompts the left go into pro-aboriginal overdrive in response and that this further alienates people

But yeah, Australia is absolutely done as a country, I think all of this stuff is basically just changing the speed and manner in which it is completely ruined. Even the ostensibly pro-australia stuff of resisting china is clearly going to be pivoted into being pro-india. And I doubt there will be a sufficiently precipitous decline in living standards to wake people up. Just gradual decline to ever more shitiness that can easily blamed on old white people

how are you still on this thread at your big age? i think you should get a job. pay some taxes. find a hobby.

 

[cosmo 2]

 

[SylviaB]

how are you still on this thread at your big age? i think you should get a job. pay some taxes. find a hobby.

Don't worry so much about me. Worry about if people start deciding to kill orientals. That's a quote.

 

[unhealthyharold]

Don't worry so much about me. Worry about if people start deciding to kill orientals. That's a quote.

wah wah wah you're a 30 something year old arguing with teenagers on a forum about high school

 

[cosmo 2]

wah wah wah you're a 30 something year old arguing with teenagers on a forum about high school

who cares

youre a zoomer hanging out on a dead internet communication medium

 

[tired___]

who cares

youre a zoomer hanging out on a dead internet communication medium

damn she wasn't even talking to you and u're mad... also address Indigenous Australians/First Nations People with respect no matter what your opinion is incorrectly naming a group of people is disrespectful.

 

[cosmo 2]

lmaooo

 

[SylviaB]

damn she wasn't even talking to you and u're mad... also address Indigenous Australians/First Nations People with respect no matter what your opinion is incorrectly naming a group of people is disrespectful.

I don't remember ever agreeing to be called a 'white dog', so......

 

[cosmo 2]

3 abo kids spat on me in the kfc car park the other day

there is 100% a regional crime wave and its out of control

 

[cosmo 2]

 

[cosmo 2]

99999

 

[SylviaB]

'less than 30'

 

[dan964]

Just seeing what your views on this are. I'm only seventeen so I miss out on the vote by a year. The actual proposed question is "A Proposed Law: to alter the Constitution to recognise the First Peoples of Australia by establishing an Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Voice. Do you approve this proposed alteration?"

While I agree with a lot of what enoilgam has said. I lean towards No for the following reasons:

• Vagueness of the proposal and the details. I was listening to the Senate inquiry in this, and a lot of the questions were answered that it was a matter for the Parliament. So there is not confidence or clarity in the following:
  • How the body will be ensured to be fair and representative of Aboriginal people?
  • Will the representations made by the Voice be binding? If so, then what measures are in place, to ensure scrutiny of the voice; if not, then what power does the voice have and what is the point of putting in the constitution if it is an ineffective means to the end?
  • It is not clear how the Voice will represent the range of views held by Aboriginal Australians including those that dissent from left wing views.
  • There are other ways to achieve this end - why weren't these considered?
  • So basically the implications could be nothing or monumental and far reaching. And if you are asking us to make an informed decision on no information, then I'm inclined to vote no in the absence of information.
• On the surface it seems like a disruption to democratic process. Aboriginal Australians have the ability to make their views held the same way as any other Australian through their local member. I don't see why a specific voice is needed in black and white writing in the constitution.
• While I support recognition of Aboriginal Australians in the constitution as Australia's first peoples - Australia is now a mixed country, and the implications of giving any group more power over another does not resolve the issues at hand neither does writing the past injustices involve creating a perceived or uncertain at the very least imbalance. Not to mention current issues.
• The reality is if treaty is the end goal why is that not discussed and enshrined into the constitution instead?
• Why is the rush to push this through without the usual checks and balances?

The majority think that’s a good idea though. Some people forget that the whole idea came from the uluru statement from the heart

Actually not necessarily. It doesn't have as much support as in regional Australia as would have you think. Its going to be a tight one. Again does it solve the issues? Does it lead in the right direction? (Not all Australians support the radical ideas suggested in the Uluru statement not the Critical race theory assumptions that sometimes flavours the debate - I should clarify the Uluru statement isn't necessarily radical but its implications are far reaching when understood properly and that is something that should not be rushed through)

 

[cosmo 2]

im surprised this might actually lose

still unsure how it will go

absolutely expected it to slip on or even romp in really

 

[enoilgam]

While I agree with a lot of what enoilgam has said. I lean towards No for the following reasons:

• How the body will be ensured to be fair and representative of Aboriginal people?

On this point, how do we determine Aboriginality for the purposes of the Voice? The current criteria for being considered an Aboriginal person is very vague. Essentially, the elements are being of Indigenous descent, identifying as Indigenous and being accepted by the Indigenous community. My fear is that people with limited Aboriginal ancestry who haven't grown up with much disadvantage will be elected to the Voice at the expense of those with stronger Aboriginal ancestry who have suffered immense disadvantage.

Whenever points like the above are raised, you are immediately branded as racist which is utterly ridiculous. If we are going to have a constitutional body for which Aboriginality is a pre-requisite to join, surely there must be a stringent test to determine said Aboriginality (much like we do for Citizenship).

Honestly, the more I hear and think about it, the deeper my concerns run. Im becoming more of a stronger No as time continues.

im surprised this might actually lose

still unsure how it will go

absolutely expected it to slip on or even romp in really

If the polls continue to track this poorly, I dont think we will have a referendum. The government cannot allow the referendum to fail because it would set reconciliation back years and just be a disaster in terms of optics. Even as a likely No voter, seeing this fail would bring no joy and would actually be quite sad.

 

[cosmo 2]

you really think theyll back out?

i thought about it too but that'd be a serious self-own if albo tried to do that he'd never live it down

at leas tif he takes it to ref and it loses he can try to push the barrow it was sabotaged by the lnp etc which some will buy

 

[SylviaB]

oh yeah almost no chance it gets cancelled

if it fails, the armies of left-wing psychos in the australian media, think tanks, academics etc will simply say this proves australia is a white supremacist country etc. and that the no campaign won by promoting racist disinformation

and then albo will push ahead with a bunch of aboriginal policies anyway. The liberals can much more easily push back on a constitutional amendment than they can the vast majority of aboriginal policies (without being completely shouted down as racist).