Film Noir Conventions? (3 Viewers)

[aussiechica]

Hi! Im doing The Big Sleep as a text. However, the fact that Film Noir is not a genre is spinning me out (yes, I know that there are arguments to the contrary saying that noir is a genre, but Im saying that its a cinematic style. But if anyones reading this and going OMG i thought it was a genre, dont flip out, youre still right )

Which conventions should I be speaking about then? Crime fiction conventions only? Is this right?
Please help- feel free to add anything you thinkd be useful
Thankyou !

 

[iambored]

i'd say it's not a genre, it's part of the crime fiction genre in a way, and probably others, yeah it's a cinematic style

conventions -
sluth hero
'dark' setting
obtrusive shadows
the p.i. is a loner

speak about crime fiction, AND ALSO particular film noir conventions. for example, the obtrusive shadows is characteristically for film noir (although u may also find it in other film types)

 

[McLake]

iambored is on the right track ...

 

[iambored]

woo-hoo! thanks mclake.. it's good i know 'something', now i have to just get right on track before the hsc - there's no time!!

 

[aussiechica]

Okay, Thanks very much Iambored (and McLake)
Reading over my notes, here is my final cunning plan- please tell me if its okay:

If I speak about the Big Sleep as a subgenre of cf,the subgenre being hard-boiled cf. I discuss the conventions of hardboiled cf and then blather on about the style of film noir. Is this all good?

Also, are most classic noirs hard-boiled cf?

Thanks!

 

[McLake]

Introduce TBS as a Hard-Boild text. Once you have established the conventions associated with that mention hoe it is film noir.

Not all noir is Hard-boiled CF, not all HBCF is noir ...

 

[iambored]

mmm.. but you can't just blather on about film noir. you need more substance than that.

 

[aussiechica]

Introduce TBS as a Hard-Boild text. Once you have established the conventions associated with that mention hoe it is film noir.

Will do. Thanks

mmm.. but you can't just blather on about film noir. you need more substance than that.

Okay, well maybe 'blather' wasnt the best way for me to describe what I was going to do . I was planning to go over the general values of film noir (ie. wealth corrupting, crime as an epidemic etc) as well as the elements which helped create it (ie. the popularity of pulp fiction, which would prolly be my link, as well as the influx of german directors and postwar pissiness etc)

Please, oh wise ones-what other substance do you think I should include?

Thanks very much for your help so far

 

[coroneos]

seedy blinds, dark shadows....etc.

 

[Constip8edSkunk]

Originally posted by aussiechica
Will do. Thanks

I was planning to go over the general values of film noir (ie. wealth corrupting, crime as an epidemic etc) as well as the elements which helped create it (ie. the popularity of pulp fiction, which would prolly be my link, as well as the influx of german directors and postwar pissiness etc)

i thought all of these elements were of hardboiled cf? ie the hb genre was evolved from the pulp mags eg black mask, and they are set in a corrupt decrepid world. film noir doesnt even have to be about crime, there are alot of horror flicks, eg attack of the cat people, that are film noir, and their stylistic features include, correct me if im wrong, stark distinctions between light and dark, shadowy sets, moving frames and unconventionally cut/jilted frames.

 

[coroneos]

hmm there is tonnes of information on the internet --

film noir -- tonnes and tonnes!!

you can even find essays!!

 

[timmii]

I think u should refer to film noir merely as being a means by which the hbcf is expressed, rather than focussing on film noir itself.

My general stance was that the genre of CF developed as a response to society and reflected societal attitudes. Thus The Big Sleep reflected post-war disillusionment with humanity. I said then that the elements of film noir were utilised and manipulated in order to depict this, such as obscured faces to imply obscured motives, shadowy figures and the darkness of humanity in the darkness of the filmshots etc etc... Remember, its about *how* meaning is conveyed not only *what* is conveyed.

 

[Doc_Savage]

I wrote my extension 2 piece on film noir and neo noir. I could send it to you if you like.

 

[ladypenelope85]

there's also the moody soundtrack. something u only get in the form of film noir, not in any of the hardboiled pulps, etc. (seems obvious but often forgotten). the soundtrack that creates meaning through crescendos at those vital moments, creates a contrast with the criminal/romantic atmosphere (those aspects of society also make it into big sleep, cf vs other genres, cf incorporating other genres).

 

[Gregor Samsa]

To briefly add to the above;
-The focus on a criminal underworld, the 'underbelly of society'..
-The cinematography of film noir was influenced by German expressionistic films of the early 1920's, such as The Cabinet Of Dr Caligari and Nosferatu..
-Film Noir generally seems to follow a web-like plot, often with a small crime serving as the catalyst for a progressing investigation. (Such as in The Big Sleep; It started out as a blackmail case, and all of a sudden, things began to happen.)

 

[ameh]

what is film noir?

 

[_muse_]

Definitions of film noir on the Web:

("dark film")A term applied by French critics to a type of American film, usually in the detective and thriller genres, with low-key lighting and a somber mood. Film noir was most prevalent in the 1940s and 1950s, though it was revived occasionally later.
highered.mcgraw-hill.com/sites/0070384290/student_view0/glossary.html


"Dark film," a term applied by French critics to a type of American film, usually in the detective or thriller genres, with low-key lighting and a somber mood.
www.mhhe.com/socscience/art-film/bordwell_6_filmart/student/olc/glossary.mhtml


French phrase meaning "black film"; refers to a genre of film whose subject matter bleak, usually an urban theme of corruption (e.g., Last Tango in Paris)
gs.fanshawec.on.ca/users/josephda/glossary/glossary_F.htm


French phrase meaning "black film"; refers to a genre of film whose subject matter bleak, usually an urban theme of corruption (e.g., Orson Wells' Touch of Evil(1958), Ridley Scott's Blade Runner (1982) and L.A. Confidential (1998))
gs.fanshawec.ca/jda/glossary/glossary_F.htm


a critical term used to describe cynical Hollywood thrillers and melodramas of the 1930s and 1940s. More specifically, it refers to the high-contrast, deeply-shadowed lighting style of such films
www.megweb.uct.ac.za/doh101f/glossary film & TV.htm


overstyled (see "aesthetic") depiction of archaic film archetypes--such as existential private detectives and thugs--shot in moody black and white
www.thestranger.com/2001-05-24/siff4.html

 

[_muse_]

hehe sorry i have more

Primary Characteristics and Conventions of Film Noir:

The primary moods of classic film noir were melancholy, alienation, bleakness, disillusionment, disenchantment, pessimism, ambiguity, moral corruption, evil, guilt, desperation and paranoia. Heroes (or anti-heroes), corrupt characters and villains included down-and-out, conflicted hard-boiled detectives or private eyes, cops, gangsters, government agents, socio-paths, crooks, war veterans, petty criminals, and murderers. These protagonists were often morally-ambiguous low-lifes from the dark and gloomy underworld of violent crime and corruption. Distinctively, they were cynical, tarnished, obsessive (sexual or otherwise), brooding, menacing, sinister, sardonic, disillusioned, frightened and insecure loners (usually men), struggling to survive - and in the end, ultimately losing.


*cough* taken from this site:
http://www.filmsite.org/filmnoir.html

 

[ameh]

thanks for that

 

[Dragie]

Focus more on the hard-boiled side of things instead of revolving all the techniques around film noir. Because TBS happens to be both a film noir and a hard-boiled text, you can connect the two and say how one relates to the other. Also you might like to describe HOW film noir helps TBS with the whole cri fi thing.