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Halving the interval (2 Viewers)

Aysce

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I am confused about how to find an approximation to the root and I kinda only know how to find where the root lies between.

Like for example,

Q. x^2 - x -7 has a root between x=3 and x=4. By halving the interval twice, find an approximation to the root.

I already halved the interval twice but I don't know what value the root actually is =.=. Help please, thanks.
 

Carrotsticks

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What are the new bounds for the root? Whatever those bounds are, the approximation is the midpoint of them.
 

Aysce

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What are the new bounds for the root? Whatever those bounds are, the approximation is the midpoint of them.
So after the second time i half the interval and gain the new bounds, its just the midpoint?
 

Carrotsticks

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So after the second time i half the interval and gain the new bounds, its just the midpoint?
You have your initial bounds 3 and 4. The midpoint is 3.5, which is your first approximation.

After a bit of calculating to determine whether 3.5 yields pos or neg, you find that the new bounds become 3 and 3.5.

Halving this yields 3.25, which is your second approximation.
 

Aysce

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You have your initial bounds 3 and 4. The midpoint is 3.5, which is your first approximation.

After a bit of calculating to determine whether 3.5 yields pos or neg, you find that the new bounds become 3 and 3.5.

Halving this yields 3.25, which is your second approximation.
Oh okay tyvm !
 

talisman

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Key things to remember for approximation of roots:

- the root is always between two x values, one of which is a positive y value and one which has a negative y value (makes sense if you draw a picture)

- the best approximation for a root is the x value closest to ZERO that you have found so far. This makes sense too if you think about it because the root, which is an x-intercept exists when y = ZERO. (In this question, you should have evaluated f(3), f(4), f(3.5) and f(3.25). The f(x) value closest to ZERO out of these is your answer.

- When halving an interval more than once, you need to make the appropriate evaluations. So for example, in this question, you should have evalued

f(3) = - 1

f(4) 5

We don't need to state why it is between x = 3 and x = 4 here. The question already implies that it does

f(3.5) = 1.75 *This is the first halving that you apply. You probably already know how to do this

Since f(3) < 0 and f(3.5) > 0, then the root must lie between x = 3 and x = 3.5 *This goes back to the first dot point. When there is a negative and positive y value, the root lies between these

We have now narrowed down the possibilities of where the root is. We're only required to halve the interval twice, so we halve the interval between x = 3 and x = 3.5 because we know this is where the root is

f(3.25) = 0.3125

Since f(3) <0 and f(3.25) >0, then the root must lie between x = 3 and x = 3.25 *We've narrowed it down once again

f(3) = - 1

f(3.25) = 0.3125

THEREFORE THE APPROXIMATION FOR THE ROOT IS 3.25 *0.3125 IS CLOSER TO ZERO THAN - 1

So that's how you would do this question. Remember those key points at the top, and all the italicised stuff, keep that running through your mind.

The BEST thing you could do to help yourself is to draw a diagram. I've attached one. The red dots show where the value of the function would be.

Hope this helps

Untitled maths.png
 

Aysce

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Okay so I tried another question.

f(x) = x^3 + 4x^2 + 1 between x=-5 and x=-4

I already found that a root is between x=-5 and x=-4 so halving the interval,

f( -9/2) = -73/8 < 0 Therefore the root is between x=-4.5 and x=-4

Halving again f(-17/4) = -225/64

Since <0, there is a root between x=-17/4 and x=-4

So you would then find the midpoint of the bounds above and then thats your second approximation?
 

Carrotsticks

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f( -9/2) = -73/8 < 0 Therefore the root is between x=-4.5 and x=-4
When you concluded the bolded part, did you actually show that f(-4.5) and f(-4) give opposite signs, or did you just guess this?

Your first approximation was -4.5 by halving interval once.

You obtained a new bound.

Then you halved the interval again to acquire 4.25 (or 17/4 as you said). This is the second approximation.

You then tested this point and deduced that the root lies between -4.25 and -4. If you had halved the interval again, then this would have been your third approximation, since you halved the interval 3 times to acquire it.
 

Aysce

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When you concluded the bolded part, did you actually show that f(-4.5) and f(-4) give opposite signs, or did you just guess this?

Your first approximation was -4.5 by halving interval once.

You obtained a new bound.

Then you halved the interval again to acquire 4.25 (or 17/4 as you said). This is the second approximation.

You then tested this point and deduced that the root lies between -4.25 and -4. If you had halved the interval again, then this would have been your third approximation, since you halved the interval 3 times to acquire it.
It says in my textbook that there are two roots, a and b. If f( (a+b)/2) < 0 , the root lies between x= (a+b)/2 and x=b. If f((a+b)/2) > 0 , the root lies between x=a and x= (a+b)/2. I don't even know why halving intervals is so confusing for me...
 

nightweaver066

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It says in my textbook that there are two roots, a and b. If f( (a+b)/2) < 0 , the root lies between x= (a+b)/2 and x=b. If f((a+b)/2) > 0 , the root lies between x=a and x= (a+b)/2. I don't even know why halving intervals is so confusing for me...
Haha don't worry.. The method was very confusing at first for me as well. No textbook sufficiently explained it for me and showed proper working out for a question.
 

Carrotsticks

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linny808 gave a pretty good explanation as to why this is the case. Try reading her post.
 

talisman

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This diagram should explain everything. If you need any more help, feel free to PM me.

approximation of roots.png
 

Aysce

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This diagram should explain everything. If you need any more help, feel free to PM me.

View attachment 24666
Alright, I'm starting to understand it. Gonna go do some. So this is how you do it:

1. Prove there is an existing root.
2. Half the interval - get first approximation, sub into function.
3. Check to see if positive or negative.
4. Find new bounds.
5. Half interval again and that is the 2nd approximation.

(Just for a question that specific 2 halvings).
 

Aysce

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Ermm how do you do 10x = 2sinx + 5 between x=0.6 and x=0.7? I'm testing to see for roots but they're both the same sign
 

Aysce

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Nah I don't know why im getting these results O.O
 

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