Calls to move Australia Day (2 Viewers)

[rasengan90]

I think Mabo just turned in his grave

I was trolling. And if you knew anything, you would know that Mabo would not have considered himself Aboriginal, but Torres Strait Islander. The islanders are quite different culturally than mainland peoples and yes, they had a concept of land ownership, people on the mainland did not usually.

 

[guff]

I don't think it is feasible to move Australia Day, although it is regretably also Invasion Day for the Indigenous population. Another day of Australian National celebration would be good, sadly Federation took place on the 1st January...
There should probably be a national holiday for the anniversary of Reconciliation (we have something like the 2nd smallest number of holidays in the Western world), which is both a day of celebration, but also of sombre reflection - much in the same way as ANZAC Day.

I believe that the more pressing issure, compared to moving Australia Day is moving forward to becoming a Republic, and divorcing our current Flag. Also, moving forward to becoming a Republic will open up another date to celebrate Australia Day, a date which will neither seem arbitrary and sensless (which a random date would at the moment), and actually celebrates a shared milestone between our Indigenous and our (because we all are in one way or another) Immigrant population.

 

[Empyrean444]

The abos can go fuck themselves. Its the best day of the year, now we can insult the abos by celebrating the day they lost their land and no one cares.

Good to see that enlightenment and tolerance are thriving within the yobbo community.

Its no different from any other holiday, except for the fact that it allows a bunch of jingoists to drape our awful flag over their shoulders and thus make fools of themselves.

 

[guff]

You're right about Mabo rasengan90. The Torres Strait peoples owned their land, and also Farmed it, and it was this farming that allowed the High Court to overrule Terra Nullius

 

[Empyrean444]

I believe that the more pressing issure, compared to moving Australia Day is moving forward to becoming a Republic, and divorcing our current Flag..

Agreed. Even if we don't become a republic, we should replace our flag. Its utterly lame...

 

[guff]

It's deffinately a time for a change. Our flag no longer represents us as a people, and, i find sometimes, reminds me of the Cronulla Riots... Just because something like that takes place doesn't mean we should rush out and change our flag, but we should have changed it before then, now the riots are just another reason to do so.

 

[zstar]

Aboriginies came from Asia and migrated to Australia just like everybody else.

 

[Empyrean444]

Yeah, fair enough; I just thought it looked like crap!

 

[Craven]

You're right about Mabo rasengan90. The Torres Strait peoples owned their land, and also Farmed it, and it was this farming that allowed the High Court to overrule Terra Nullius

If this was the case why would the High Court rule the terra nullius void for the Australian mainland? One of the main reasons why the concept of "terra nullius" was successful at the time was that Aboriginals did not 'cultivate' the land (in the way that European societies did). The High Court's ruling is basically that despite this fact, it was still theirs, and if they can show evidence that they utilised the land (hunted/gathered/lived there) and it is crown land then they may receive native title to the land.

It doesn't make much sense to say they don't own the land just because they don't have the same concepts of land ownership... they still own(ed) the land!

 

[sonyaleeisapixi]

also

australians are tragically ignorant of their own indigenous peoples' cultures

i bet everyone itt could name at least 2 native american tribes

but doesn't know the name of their local aboriginal group, or any of their language

gumbaynggirr.

mt areas actually pretty respectful of the indigenous peoples. all public events have reconigition of land ownership spoken in both english and gumbayngga and theres a fair bit of cooperative with traditional land owners, national parks, and tourism.

lightening ridge is also very well educated as to its indigenous knowledge. the elders with the help of the school composed their local dialect dictionary and published it, and gave everyone a copy with the local directory.
kinda cool

 

[rasengan90]

If this was the case why would the High Court rule the terra nullius void for the Australian mainland? One of the main reasons why the concept of "terra nullius" was successful at the time was that Aboriginals did not 'cultivate' the land (in the way that European societies did). The High Court's ruling is basically that despite this fact, it was still theirs, and if they can show evidence that they utilised the land (hunted/gathered/lived there) and it is crown land then they may receive native title to the land.

It doesn't make much sense to say they don't own the land just because they don't have the same concepts of land ownership... they still own(ed) the land!

Mainland Aboriginals usually have no concept of personal land ownership; only tribal boundaries. They make claims to portions of land used for food/resources rather than personal/familial land claims. Mabo was claiming a portion of land which belonged to him personally rather than belonging to the whole tribe.

 

[Craven]

Yes but... like I said, it doesn't mean they don't own the land now do they?

 

[hollyy.]

also

australians are tragically ignorant of their own indigenous peoples' cultures

i bet everyone itt could name at least 2 native american tribes

but doesn't know the name of their local aboriginal group, or any of their language

darkunjung. (although sp?)

 

[rasengan90]

It definitely means that they DID on the land. They lost it when the British moved in and they got pwned. Its crown land now, bitches.

 

[guff]

However, this was the case for the overturning of Terra Nullius. Whether or not the Aboriginal or Torres Strait peoples had a concept of ownership had nothing to do with the ruling. Because TN was applicable if there were no people, if the people did not farm and finally if the people had no acknowledged legal system.
Australia's indigenous people have a concept of ownership, although the Aboriginal peoples' was very different than the Europeans - they believe/d that the land owned them, just as they believed the land owned the trees on it and the animals etc on it. That they were part of the environment, and the land owned the environment.
The Torres Strait Islander's concept of ownership was closer to a European form.
But, the reason for the overturning of TN was that the TSI people had been farming their land for hundreds of years. This applied to all of the country because TS was included in the original British Court approval of the application for TN.

 

[random-1005]

um, does anyone care about the thoughts of abos?

lol mad racist

 

[Craven]

This is all suprisingly beside the point, isn't it?

 

[guff]

Yeah... everything evolved... It was still interesting tho

 

[sxcmathschick]

also

australians are tragically ignorant of their own indigenous peoples' cultures

i bet everyone itt could name at least 2 native american tribes

but doesn't know the name of their local aboriginal group, or any of their language

It is surprising, I have no care for native american tribes, but i know of tharawal and i think it is darawhal also....both local to me. I have no problem with aboriginals, I just wonder how everyone can sit and criticize these people, without them or white australians we would not have the country or freedoms we have today. Yes there was suffering, yes there was wrong, but australia as a nation said sorry, and australia day now is so much more than celebrating when white man colonised. It is more about our rich cultural diversity, and how we have come from a penal colony to one of the greatest nations on earth. I dont think it should be moved, because it is not celebrated for the reasons in which offend aboriginals anymore. When was the first australia day anyway? did they celebrate it every year since they came? Because they suffered quite a bit when they came so the holiday probably didnt come round till quite some time after?

 

[Iron]

Although a boon for ANU law, Dodson was a bit of a bummer for Australian of the year. To slag off the celebrations like that was poor form; a real gnawing of the hand that fed you. All this guilt shit wont work. Reconcilliation has to entail some concessions on the indigenous side. They must submit to the idea that European settlement has been ultimately positive for their quality of life. They have a sympathetic government working full pelt to close the gap - it's about time that they take up their share of the responsibilities entailed in being Australian citizens

I mean, where would African-Americans be if they stubbornly retained their tribal customs? Where would they be if they stuck with the pre-Obama guilt politics? It's a dead road