Compulsory uni service fees to be reintroduced (3 Viewers)

[banco55]

I dont agree much at all old friend. The fee aligns well with tax we'll all later pay, if we're not already. It provides a safe environment to lobby for how we want these pooled funds used for the collective benifit. It allows us to apply these valuable lessons not only to state and federal political campaigns, but also to other interactions with authority. It makes us demand more quality, earlier on. This in turn breeds better authority!

Funny you should mention "quality". I suspect that the lack of competence in administering the funds and some of the stupid stuff the funds were spent on didn't help the left's image in the CSU days.

 

[katie tully]

IDK, I remembered Kate Ellis/someone saying we could exclude our money being spent for political purposes and all that shit.

True?

Kate Ellis doesn't know!!!!!!!!!!

 

[withoutaface]

IDK, I remembered Kate Ellis/someone saying we could exclude our money being spent for political purposes and all that shit.

True?

It's all just so much accounting. If the Uni has a pool of $x for student organisations and gets $y of that through compulsory fees, it can still give $(x-y) to the SRC and it won't matter.

 

[Iron]

I still don't see how me paying to "forcibly interact" with people I don't like is going to make me want to interact with them anymore than if I didn't pay. Like, if I have to be civil I will.. But I just do not comprehend how paying to do it is going to make me resent them less.

Do not compute.

Because it allows you the chance to defeat them and their ideas? It does you both a favour by polishing your debating skills? The free market is applied to politics, instead of a apathetic competition between two stale and sluggish parties

 

[katie tully]

I would hate to go to ANU it would seem.

At CSU, we don't much care for the Ag students. But we tolerate them because they get drunk and do unusual things to each other/inanimate objects/animals. Not being made to pay the union hasn't made us less tolerant towards them.

I think I understand though... If we're made to pay money, we're going to feel begrudged to participate in some social activities to feel as though we're getting something for our $$$???

 

[xeuyrawp]

The fee aligns well with tax we'll all later pay, if we're not already. It provides a safe environment to lobby for how we want these pooled funds used for the collective benifit. It allows us to apply these valuable lessons not only to state and federal political campaigns, but also to other interactions with authority. It makes us demand more quality, earlier on.

I agree almost 100%!

This in turn breeds better authority!

Disagree. Maybe it's because I've dealt with some of the worst examples of student leaders on Earth (Asians with Victor Ma, and idiotic gays who have one agenda), but in my experience, the money is just wasted as there is zero ownership.

It's exactly the same situation as public housing - people don't look after it because they don't own it, there's no psychological/emotional/financial view that "this is mine, I'll look after it". With CSU, people just say "hoorah, moneys!"

 

[katie tully]

Because it allows you the chance to defeat them and their ideas? It does you both a favour by polishing your debating skills? The free market is applied to politics, instead of a apathetic competition between two stale and sluggish parties

But
Iron
I don't much care for student politics and neither do 99% of university students. Bar a handful of people (who are going to be involved, with or without compulsory student unionism), nobody else cares. Seriously, it's not such a foreign concept to understand.

Some people go to uni to further their education. Nothing else.

Shocking. I know.

 

[Iron]

Funny you should mention "quality". I suspect that the lack of competence in administering the funds and some of the stupid stuff the funds were spent on didn't help the left's image in the CSU days.

For sure! That's why I think that the basic problem with this is that the right has dropped the ball, so now they've taken it and gone home. I hate the status quo of Labor-right members swanning through student politics, never being seriously challenged, and coming out the other end as the most experienced young leaders in the country.
Wecandobetter,wemustdobetterandwewilldobetterTHANKYOUArndGodBless

 

[xeuyrawp]

But
Iron
I don't much care for student politics and neither do 99% of university students. Bar a handful of people (who are going to be involved, with or without compulsory student unionism), nobody else cares. Seriously, it's not such a foreign concept to understand.

Some people go to uni to further their education. Nothing else.

Shocking. I know.

I really really really think that this is a reflection of his context, Katie.

 

[katie tully]

I think if he wants to buy his way into having a say, go nuts... But does that not defeat the purpose of politics?

Tainted milK! Alert the authorities! But the authorities are Chinese

 

[Iron]

I agree almost 100%!


Disagree. Maybe it's because I've dealt with some of the worst examples of student leaders on Earth (Asians with Victor Ma, and idiotic gays who have one agenda), but in my experience, the money is just wasted as there is zero ownership.

It's exactly the same situation as public housing - people don't look after it because they don't own it, there's no psychological/emotional/financial view that "this is mine, I'll look after it". With CSU, people just say "hoorah, moneys!"

But that's why we have yearly elections? Granted, they probably dont have a deep sense of committment to the well-being of university students, but they care a hell of a lot about their reputation and impending career

 

[Iron]

But
Iron
I don't much care for student politics and neither do 99% of university students. Bar a handful of people (who are going to be involved, with or without compulsory student unionism), nobody else cares. Seriously, it's not such a foreign concept to understand.

Some people go to uni to further their education. Nothing else.

Shocking. I know.

This is fine for the accountant or the engineer - those who are bound to be the pawns of greater designs - but think of the doctors and lawyers and arts students. Spare a thought for those who will soon be entrusted to not just stoke the engine of society, but take the wheel. They are screaming bloody murder for this experience.

The tradition of retail politics like this is older than ancient Greece and we are robbing the next generation of its chance to hone its leadership skills. Rather, any old vested-interest tart will be slapped in front of a camera - as long as their dress/suit is beautiful, their teeth white and hair well done, the plebs will buy it.

Palin2012! Woo, the West Will Rise Again

 

[katie tully]

It doesn't cost money for the artfags, doctors and lawyers to sit in a circle jerk and argue politics. And if it does, and if that's their prerogative, they should feel free to pass the hat around.

I don't wear hats.

 

[Iron]

Yes but the financial incentive forces all potential leaders out of the woodwork. It offers redemption to the politically minded who commit the sin of a commerce degree. Without this incentive, our talent pool is left to stagnate.
See communism

Also Hitler would probably have had an opinion on this, one way or another
HE wore hats

 

[banco55]

This is fine for the accountant or the engineer - those who are bound to be the pawns of greater designs - but think of the doctors and lawyers and arts students. Spare a thought for those who will soon be entrusted to not just stoke the engine of society, but take the wheel. They are screaming bloody murder for this experience.

The tradition of retail politics like this is older than ancient Greece and we are robbing the next generation of its chance to hone its leadership skills. Rather, any old vested-interest tart will be slapped in front of a camera - as long as their dress/suit is beautiful, their teeth white and hair well done, the plebs will buy it.

Palin2012! Woo, the West Will Rise Again

I'm still not sure if you are being entirely serious but in any case I think you can make a good argument that student politics is NOT a good preparation for political office. It's a very cloistered world with issues that have little resonance outside uni (as Pwaryuex mentioned gay rights takes up an inordinate amount of the student politics agenda). If you were a budding politician you'd learn much more relevant skills through toastmasters (ability to speak without notes, rhetorical skills etc.). If you think handing out how to vote sheets in the uni quadrangle and arguing with butch lesbians about whether or not $100 000 should be pissed away on sending them to conferences on "lesbians in the public sphere" is a good use of union money is going to give you the skills to talk to a building labourer about the economy/mortgage rates you are kidding yourself.

 

[Will Shakespear]

the fact is, real politics has a very real impact on our lives as citizens

student politics has NO impact on our lives as students

until that changes (and it won't), the general student population will NEVER give a shit

 

[jb_nc]

Gay rights.

Rights of gays.

 

[moll.]

"Labor would not reintroduce compulsory student union membership but the fee that accompanied the membership and funded services."

Revolution on campus



UPDATE: Bill introduced into parliament (11/02/09)

Higher Education Legislation Amendment (Student Services and Amenities, and Other Measures) Bill 2009
Explanatory memoranda

Sup first stages of communism.

 

[Iron]

I'm still not sure if you are being entirely serious but in any case I think you can make a good argument that student politics is NOT a good preparation for political office. It's a very cloistered world with issues that have little resonance outside uni (as Pwaryuex mentioned gay rights takes up an inordinate amount of the student politics agenda). If you were a budding politician you'd learn much more relevant skills through toastmasters (ability to speak without notes, rhetorical skills etc.). If you think handing out how to vote sheets in the uni quadrangle and arguing with butch lesbians about whether or not $100 000 should be pissed away on sending them to conferences on "lesbians in the public sphere" is a good use of union money is going to give you the skills to talk to a building labourer about the economy/mortgage rates you are kidding yourself.

Why? If you cant convince fellow students that 100k on 'Lesbians in the public sphere' is folly, then what experience, or right, do you have to talk about the economy to fellow Australians? If you couldnt persuade students when you were a student, how dare you try to persuade the vast range of working families when youre an adult. It's an insult to our intelligence and a denigration of the quality of our democracy

Toastmasters is all good and well, but all universities have debating societies that should be well funded by fellow students. My point is that the debate should have a direct and immediate application to the individual - not a trifling affair soley, casually concerned with improving communication skills. There must be actual, relevant application to everyday life.

the fact is, real politics has a very real impact on our lives as citizens

student politics has NO impact on our lives as students

until that changes (and it won't), the general student population will NEVER give a shit

Students will care when we have their monies - that's the impact on their lives. Until then, untold talent is lying dormant - flowers rotting off the stem

 

[Iron]

Theft is an unkind word. It's an investment in the quality and vitality of our democracy, plain and simple and I applaud it