Aganist abortion (3 Viewers)

[Cabenson]

Why don't you try and consider what I have to say, read it and think about. I have done the same with yours. I have read everything that all of you has to said to me, I have also provided multiple times logical reasoning. I'm not willfully ignoring it, I'm taking it in. But no matter how many times I read it, I am not convinced that what is in the womb of a mother is her son/daughter and is a human being.

Whilest still in the Mothers womb it is clear that it is a distinct, person. Although its cells were recieved by the mother and the father and it is dependant on the mother. It has 2 hands, 2 feet, 10 toes and fingers, it has a heart beat, unique finger prints. It's a baby and it makes you think of how beautifully life was formed in the mothers womb. It has forty-six chromosones, distinct DNA structure which makes it unique. It's a person. It reacts to sounds around, reacts to the mothers emotions. It's clear that it is a human being.

You say you're taking it in. But you persist in calling a foetus a baby and using the term "murder" although, by definition, a foetus cannot be murdered. What abortion is doing is terminating a foetus. Killing it. But this poses no ethical problem, as I have written before.

In the womb of a pregnant mother would be her potential son/daughter. But it is just that: potential. It is a distinct entity but it is physically dependant (which I've just had the pleasure of explaining to you!) on the mother, and therefore she has the choice whether to decide to kill the foetus. You're completely right. It has hands, feet, toes, fingers and other characteristics of people because it is genetically a human being. But no, it is not a person. You're right! It is entirely clear that it is a human being! But consider if it is a person. And even if it is a person, it is physically dependant upon the mother so it is her choice to veto it.

I found the following passages interesting.

"Much of what we are, even physical traits like fingerprints, is not determined by DNA. An embryo may or may not split into twins or more. Twins, identical or fraternal, may join during development, leading to a single person with more than one set of DNA. Environment counts for much of what we are.

"Whether the fetus is declared a person from a scientific, religious, or legal perspective, this would not necessarily mean that abortion is wrong. A woman could assert a right to control her body such that even if the fetus is a person, it has no legal claim to use it. Could an adult claim a right to being hooked up to someone’s body? No — it might not be ethical to refuse the use of one’s body to save the life of another, but it couldn’t be forced by the law.

"It is assumed that if the fetus is a person, then abortion is murder. This position is incompatible with what most people believe, even most anti-choice activists. If the fetus is a person and abortion is murder, then those involved should be treated like murderers. Almost no one says that either abortion providers or the women should go to jail for murder. Making exceptions for rape, incest, and even the mother’s life are also incompatible with the idea that abortion is murder."
Fetus, Humanity, Personhood: When Does a Fetus Become a Human Person with Rights?

 

[Chemical Ali]

I take offence in what you say about my God, you should respect Him, you should respect the Christian faith the same way you respect other faiths, the same way you respect your family. The same way we respect yours.

I love my faith, I love my religion. Because of its rich tradition. The Pope being a person of a line Popes beginning with St. Peter who Jesus himself made the earthly leader of the Church. I love our sacrements, Reconciliation is one, the fact that God allows people to repent, to say sorry for their sins the fact that he willingly wants us to forgive them. God even allows those who commit abortions to say sorry. He forgives them. I love our sacrament of the Eucharist, recieving Jesus every Sunday, experiencing the Paschal Mystery is beautiful. I love the richness of our tradition, the richness in scripture. I love the Catholic faith.

 

[_Duck_]

The truth about religion though, regardless of its truth, is that (the majority of) religions preach tolerance, kindness and empathy and a world in which every single person displayed these three qualities would be a perfect world.

 

[Lipin]

are you serious

 

[_Duck_]

Yes, i honestly believe that non fundamental religion is a good thing. You despise religion based on what you hear in the news and the news only reports intolerance while in real life the majority of religous people are tolerant.

 

[bio_nut]

The truth about religion though, regardless of its truth, is that (the majority of) religions preach tolerance, kindness and empathy and a world in which every single person displayed these three qualities would be a perfect world.

This isn't true at all. I used to be a Christian and have studied the Bible closely. Have you even read it?

I find it hilarious how many Christians haven't read the entire Bible actually. You're basing your whole life on this book and you haven't fucking finished it? lol

 

[_Duck_]

Following the Bible to a tee is a form of fundamentalism and i think that as society has evolved Christianity has evolved despite the Bible obviously remaining stagnant. I base my beliefs about Christianity on what i was taught, not on scripture. For the record, i no longer consider myself Christian but neither do i reject the idea of religion.

 

[bio_nut]

The fact that what you can be taught about it varies and that there is no consistency in this method showed how fundamentally flawed it is however.

One person says if you do this, you go to hell, another says it's ok.

Pffft.

 

[_Duck_]

By that token everything is flawed. Education is flawed because somewhere in the world a child is being taught to murder, the entire tax and welfare system is flawed because there is one person who bludges off the dole and democracy is flawed because someone donkey voted. Exceptions exist in every facet of society, it is what the majority do that is important and i personally believe that the majority of Christians i have met are exemplary citizens. Obviously this is impossible to prove, however, so i accept if your experience of Christianity or religion as a whole is entirely different to mine.

 

[bio_nut]

That's the opposite experience to mine. And most things are flawed, yes.