How much does school ranking impact on ATAR? (2 Viewers)

[dangerouss]

can someone just clarify what I'm saying is right or wrong.

Let's say my assessment mark for English is crap due to harsh marking and I'm in the bottom part of the class but in the HSC exam I get in the high 80's or 90's, and the highest mark is 95 and the lowest mark in the exam was 80's. Does that mean the moderated assessment mark everyone gets in the class is in between 80 and 95. If so, how do they allocate the assessment mark to each person. Sorry I was abit confused with the video


atar goal:91 but will be happy with 85+

You're really confusing me but how assessment marks are allocated is by internal rank with the draw of marks coming from how your internal cohort performs in the hsc.

Say you are ranked 4th internally for mathematics and your hsc mark is 88. You keep this mark since everyone must keep their external mark.

However the external marks within your class are as follows (from lowest to highest)

67, 73, 82,84, 87, 88 and 90

Since your internal rank is 4th your assessment mark for your hsc will be the 4th highest mark scored by your peers in your class. In this instance it is 84.

Therefore your assessment will be 84 and external mark will be 88, giving you a hsc mark of 86.


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[funnytomato]

also found this:

read more at:

http://www.boardofstudies.nsw.edu.au/hsc-results/moderation.html

 

[beaubrah]

You're really confusing me but how assessment marks are allocated is by internal rank with the draw of marks coming from how your internal cohort performs in the hsc.

Say you are ranked 4th internally for mathematics and your hsc mark is 88. You keep this mark since everyone must keep their external mark.

However the external marks within your class are as follows (from lowest to highest)

67, 73, 82,84, 87, 88 and 90

Since your internal rank is 4th your assessment mark for your hsc will be the 4th highest mark scored by your peers in your class. In this instance it is 84.

Therefore your assessment will be 84 and external mark will be 88, giving you a hsc mark of 86.


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so if you're ranked last internally you'll get the last external mark as your moderated assessment mark


atar goal:91 but will be happy with 85+

 

[funnytomato]

You're really confusing me but how assessment marks are allocated is by internal rank with the draw of marks coming from how your internal cohort performs in the hsc.

Say you are ranked 4th internally for mathematics and your hsc mark is 88. You keep this mark since everyone must keep their external mark.

However the external marks within your class are as follows (from lowest to highest)

67, 73, 82,84, 87, 88 and 90

Since your internal rank is 4th your assessment mark for your hsc will be the 4th highest mark scored by your peers in your class. In this instance it is 84.

Therefore your assessment will be 84 and external mark will be 88, giving you a hsc mark of 86.


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not necessarily, think about these 2 (extreme) scenarios with the same total (hence the same mean), top and bottom marks:

1. coming 4th in these assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 92, 71,70

2. coming 4th in these assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 82, 81, 70

Would it be fair if they're treated the same way?

I think that's what they mean by "shape of the distribution"

 

[dangerouss]

so if you're ranked last internally you'll get the last external mark as your moderated assessment mark


atar goal:91 but will be happy with 85+

Correct


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[funnytomato]

so if you're ranked last internally you'll get the last external mark as your moderated assessment mark


atar goal:91 but will be happy with 85+

From the information given by BOSTES, if some one is ranked last internally, his/her moderated assessment mark would be the lowest but DO NOT necessarily correspond to the bottom exam mark obtained by the school's cohort.

Or in general, the person with Nth internal rank would get a moderated assessment mark that is Nth highest but this does NOT necessarily have to be the Nth highest exam mark in the group. (Unless N=1, i.e. the person ranked 1st internally will definitely get the highest exam mark )

 

[dangerouss]

not necessarily, think about these 2 (extreme) scenarios with the same total (hence the same mean), top and bottom marks:

1. coming 4th in these assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 92, 71,70

2. coming 4th in these assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 82, 81, 70

Would it be fair if they're treated the same way?

I think that's what they mean by "shape of the distribution"

Well. That's where the question of a low school rank impacting hsc marks and therefore the overall atar comes from.

I think it's fair and even if it's not. It's how the hsc marks and respective atars are determined anyway.

Regardless, these things are all scaled and moderated by the board and what all 2015ers should be doing is attempting every paper to the best of our ability.


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[dangerouss]

I don't think we should be worried about this at all tbh haha

Just do your best, guys


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[funnytomato]

Well. That's where the question of a low school rank impacting hsc marks and therefore the overall atar comes from.

I think it's fair and even if it's not. It's how the hsc marks and respective atars are determined anyway.

Regardless, these things are all scaled and moderated by the board and what all 2015ers should be doing is attempting every paper to the best of our ability.


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I don't think we're on the same page. I get what you're talking about but that's not my main point.

What I am trying say is that both the internal ranking AND the relative gaps between assessment marks are taken into account.
Therefore coming 4th internally in the following scenarios would be treated differently. (from what's given by BOSTES)

1. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 92, 71,70

2. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 82, 81, 70

 

[dangerouss]

I don't think we're on the same page. I get what you're talking about but that's not my main point.

What I am trying say is that both the internal ranking AND the relative gaps between assessment marks are taken into account.
Therefore coming 4th internally in the following scenarios would be treated differently. (from what's given by BOSTES)

1. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 92, 71,70

2. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 82, 81, 70

My bad. Yes, you are correct. I guess my careers advisor was half right haha.

Thanks for the info!


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[Librah]

I don't think we're on the same page. I get what you're talking about but that's not my main point.

What I am trying say is that both the internal ranking AND the relative gaps between assessment marks are taken into account.
Therefore coming 4th internally in the following scenarios would be treated differently. (from what's given by BOSTES)

1. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 92, 71,70

2. internal assessment marks: 95, 94, 93, 82, 81, 70

Yup, the bolded parts, just another example for my MX2 class, class of 6.

Internal assessments raw- 97, 81, 79(me, don't judge lol), 74, don't recall last 2, but <70 >50.
External exams- 93(1st internally),93(me), 79(2nd internally), 73, mid 60s, 59. Last 3 are in order from internals.
Moderated assessment mark- 93, 81(me), 83(2nd internally) etc don't remember the rest.

 

[unforlornedhope]

It's up to you.

I've seen people who go to comprehensive schools with no tutoring getting a higher ATAR than those who transferred to a selective school in Years 11 and 12.
It's you yourself being motivated, studying everyday, utilising your teacher's help, and coming first in everything instead of which school you go to.

 

[aceer]

Just come first in all of your subjects and you'll be fine. Study hard, don't let your friends bring you down and befriend the good teachers (if there's any at your school) because they can help a lot.

My school is always ranked 450+ and I got 99.5

 

[Constantine]

Just come first in all of your subjects and you'll be fine. Study hard, don't let your friends bring you down and befriend the good teachers (if there's any at your school) because they can help a lot.

My school is always ranked 450+ and I got 99.5

Well done you!!

 

[milkytea99]

Low ranked school: teachers don't have faith in students achieving a band 6.

You have to be positive that you can achieve a band 6 and not be affected by others opinions

 

[enigma_1]

Low ranked school: teachers don't have faith in students achieving a band 6.

You have to be positive that you can achieve a band 6 and not be affected by others opinions

To an extent yeah. Another thing for low ranked schools is that sometimes due to the students being in that type of environment, they might unfortunately be unaware of some important things, which could affect their performance/potential from being reached.

Eg in my school, most of the ppl were unaware that MIF is a bad textbook, they were unaware that 64739202447466436627 past papers exist for maths (or any subject for that matter), they were also unaware of scaling/aligning and how ranks affect your final mark etc. So if you do your research at a low ranking school then you're set. It's only an issue when you're not aware of this stuff because the ppl you're surrounded with are unaware aswell, hence you'd have no way of finding out. But that's where this forum can you help you

 

[milkytea99]

To an extent yeah. Another thing for low ranked schools is that sometimes due to the students being in that type of environment, they might unfortunately be unaware of some important things, which could affect their performance/potential from being reached.

Eg in my school, most of the ppl were unaware that MIF is a bad textbook, they were unaware that 64739202447466436627 past papers exist for maths (or any subject for that matter), they were also unaware of scaling/aligning and how ranks affect your final mark etc. So if you do your research at a low ranking school then you're set. It's only an issue when you're not aware of this stuff because the ppl you're surrounded with are unaware aswell, hence you'd have no way of finding out. But that's where this forum can you help you

Yeah haha. I'm highly informed, is just that I have to be mentally strong and not be affected by the opinions of "band 5 is the max you can get".

I hope to break the record with all band 6's and be the first student in my schools history to get all rounders lol and also be dux and get 99+ atar

Atm, none of the previous duxes has got above 99

 

[enigma_1]

Yeah haha. I'm highly informed, is just that I have to be mentally strong and not be affected by the opinions of "band 5 is the max you can get".

I hope to break the record with all band 6's and be the first student in my schools history to get all rounders lol

You have to make sure that the opinions of other students don't negatively affect you. Just believe in your abilities and you'll be able to achieve your goal. I can imagine the deep satisfaction you would receive after breaking the school record. If there are any times that you feel as though you are lacking motivation or anything, just remind yourself of the reason why you really wanted it in the first place. Good luck!

 

[milkytea99]

You have to make sure that the opinions of other students don't negatively affect you. Just believe in your abilities and you'll be able to achieve your goal. I can imagine the deep satisfaction you would receive after breaking the school record. If there are any times that you feel as though you are lacking motivation or anything, just remind yourself of the reason why you really wanted it in the first place. Good luck!

Lol, it's not the opinions of other students. It's the teachers who think that we can't get band 6

 

[enigma_1]

Lol, it's not the opinions of other students. It's the teachers who think that we can't get band 6

that's r00d of them