accounting/finance salaries (1 Viewer)
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Numero Uno
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Kutay
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my acro reader aint working so whats the average ammount?
redruM
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Capitalist
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Actually yes, working in London or New York generally pays better then say Sydney.
seremify007
Junior Member
What an intangible and untaxable asset =]stazi said:Laz's loving
Yeh my sister got quite a pay rise when she moved abroad for Secondment. But even though she pays local taxes, the cost of living in UK is much higher. A lot of the things we pay for in dollars, is the same as what they pay but with a pounds sign in front!what971 said:
You'd think as accountants.. there'd be a way to get around it now wouldn't you?Capitalist said:
seremify: so do you mean when you sister got sent overseas for her firm, she STILL pays Australian taxes or she pays the overseas working tax?
And also Capitalist I still fail to see your point. Regardless of the progressive tax rate, if you are in the same income bracket (and I'm sure lawyers are mostly ni the highest income bracket with bankers) the more income you earn the more cash you have. Yes, after taxes.
I would much rather earn 200K as an M&A Analyst then 100K as an M&A Lawyer. Regardless of how it works out to be more money is never a disadvantage, unless of course you really don't have a point.
The ironic thing is your name is capitalist and your against the most capitalist industry that exists in the world.
And also Capitalist I still fail to see your point. Regardless of the progressive tax rate, if you are in the same income bracket (and I'm sure lawyers are mostly ni the highest income bracket with bankers) the more income you earn the more cash you have. Yes, after taxes.
I would much rather earn 200K as an M&A Analyst then 100K as an M&A Lawyer. Regardless of how it works out to be more money is never a disadvantage, unless of course you really don't have a point.
The ironic thing is your name is capitalist and your against the most capitalist industry that exists in the world.
seremify007
Junior Member
I believe she pays both UK and Australian taxes.
UK because she lives there and her income is earnt there- their tax is considerably lower from memory; but whilst her income is high (after currency conversion), the cost of living over there is so much greater that any savings from tax and a higher income are pretty much mooted.... I also wonder what it must be like for the other people who are on much lower (than her) salaries in UK because she doesn't live that great yet earns a respectable salary.
Australian because she also has investment properties and so on in Australia, and I'm not sure if she finished repaying her HECs.
UK because she lives there and her income is earnt there- their tax is considerably lower from memory; but whilst her income is high (after currency conversion), the cost of living over there is so much greater that any savings from tax and a higher income are pretty much mooted.... I also wonder what it must be like for the other people who are on much lower (than her) salaries in UK because she doesn't live that great yet earns a respectable salary.
Australian because she also has investment properties and so on in Australia, and I'm not sure if she finished repaying her HECs.
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All I was saying is that if the avg. salary is, say $120 000, you aren't actually getting that much. That was all.
I wasn't saying that lawyers earn more or are not subject to the same taxes. In fact, as someone noted, accountants would most likely be able to minimise their taxes.
If I had the choice, I would take the job as the M&A Analyst over the lawyer as well, even if the pay was the same.
I wasn't saying that lawyers earn more or are not subject to the same taxes. In fact, as someone noted, accountants would most likely be able to minimise their taxes.
If I had the choice, I would take the job as the M&A Analyst over the lawyer as well, even if the pay was the same.
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Seremify mate from alot of your previous messages you seem like you have alot of talent.
I am dumbfounded tho by your decision to go into accounting, but even more so to take on a cadetship with a big 4 firm.
Maybe you are Asian and your parents recommend that you take a role with good job security but that is so Industrial Age thinking and it applies to very mundane average achievers.
I've met so many bankers in just one firm that have CAs (mostly), a few with CPAs and all of them say never to get into accounting. All of them basically put forth the idea that there is no money whatsoever until you reach partner and every CA/CPA graduate earns the degree in the hope of reaching that level. Add on the fact that whether you become partner really has no relation to how hard working/smart you are but is solely decided on whether the exisiting partners like you and they want you in the old boys club. I've heard horror stories of peoples careers being ruined because they crossed a partner/delayed a job for them once and because of that basically one partner can veto ur promotion to the job.
Aside from that, I've gotten feedback from CA's that now work in stockbroking but have had experience as a CA at a big4 firm for 15, some for 20 years and still say the work you do is the most boring shit you will ever come across in your life, day in day out mundane tasks where your renumeration is no reflection on your performance and quite frankly, for example, you cannot audit a P&L statement better then another guy.. you're either wrong or your right. Basically you get no bonuses and you lead a shitty life until your a partner.. which every other dude thinks they will be when they graduate from uni and attempt to get a professional degree.
kudos to all the other people determined to become an accountant with the aim of getting a CA/CPA and eventually being a partner.. I respect their decision and its good they have their own goal but I think, you being a yr 12 graduate with little clue on how the work environment really is and where the serious dollars are really at, I just can't stand by and watch you make a stupid career decision and get owned like all the other cadets that I personally know have.
I've got many friends who have come out of the HSC coming op of the state, chosen to followm an accounting firm because 'they are massive' and 'one day they will become partners' and all they do when they see me nowadays is complain and whinge about the shit poor pay and the long hours they work all for nothing... and the fact everyone else is advancing on their degrees and graduating into graduate, proper jobs with proper salaries whilst they're practically being abused into slave labour. thats what it is if you did some financial calculations and worked out what you got for the hours you spend at your accounting firm... cheap, university labour. Do you really think the firms are priming and grooming you to be the enxt senior partner or CEO?
The idea that people on cadetships have told me is that tis a scam on high school graduates to harvest a source of cheap labour. Add on the fact that you are doing part time uni and have nowhere else to run for the 4 or 5 years you take to complete your common commerce degree and what that means is that you are comiitted and stuck with the firm (no other firm wil really hire a no degree 'accountant' with a little bit of work experience)
uit's probably too late now, but I hope at least you see some value from my rant and investigate further with real graduates and guys that have worked withing accounting and thought otherwise. I genuinely hope it helps.
My 2 cents.
I am dumbfounded tho by your decision to go into accounting, but even more so to take on a cadetship with a big 4 firm.
Maybe you are Asian and your parents recommend that you take a role with good job security but that is so Industrial Age thinking and it applies to very mundane average achievers.
I've met so many bankers in just one firm that have CAs (mostly), a few with CPAs and all of them say never to get into accounting. All of them basically put forth the idea that there is no money whatsoever until you reach partner and every CA/CPA graduate earns the degree in the hope of reaching that level. Add on the fact that whether you become partner really has no relation to how hard working/smart you are but is solely decided on whether the exisiting partners like you and they want you in the old boys club. I've heard horror stories of peoples careers being ruined because they crossed a partner/delayed a job for them once and because of that basically one partner can veto ur promotion to the job.
Aside from that, I've gotten feedback from CA's that now work in stockbroking but have had experience as a CA at a big4 firm for 15, some for 20 years and still say the work you do is the most boring shit you will ever come across in your life, day in day out mundane tasks where your renumeration is no reflection on your performance and quite frankly, for example, you cannot audit a P&L statement better then another guy.. you're either wrong or your right. Basically you get no bonuses and you lead a shitty life until your a partner.. which every other dude thinks they will be when they graduate from uni and attempt to get a professional degree.
kudos to all the other people determined to become an accountant with the aim of getting a CA/CPA and eventually being a partner.. I respect their decision and its good they have their own goal but I think, you being a yr 12 graduate with little clue on how the work environment really is and where the serious dollars are really at, I just can't stand by and watch you make a stupid career decision and get owned like all the other cadets that I personally know have.
I've got many friends who have come out of the HSC coming op of the state, chosen to followm an accounting firm because 'they are massive' and 'one day they will become partners' and all they do when they see me nowadays is complain and whinge about the shit poor pay and the long hours they work all for nothing... and the fact everyone else is advancing on their degrees and graduating into graduate, proper jobs with proper salaries whilst they're practically being abused into slave labour. thats what it is if you did some financial calculations and worked out what you got for the hours you spend at your accounting firm... cheap, university labour. Do you really think the firms are priming and grooming you to be the enxt senior partner or CEO?
The idea that people on cadetships have told me is that tis a scam on high school graduates to harvest a source of cheap labour. Add on the fact that you are doing part time uni and have nowhere else to run for the 4 or 5 years you take to complete your common commerce degree and what that means is that you are comiitted and stuck with the firm (no other firm wil really hire a no degree 'accountant' with a little bit of work experience)
uit's probably too late now, but I hope at least you see some value from my rant and investigate further with real graduates and guys that have worked withing accounting and thought otherwise. I genuinely hope it helps.
My 2 cents.
Emily.
Pro-VSU
you cant possibly understand what youre talking about unless youre in the industry yourselfmashi said:
im with pwc newcastle and owe nothing to them, in that i can leave at any time i want throughout my traineeship without having to pay anything back. i think that starting a traineeship after highschool with them was the best decision i ever made. my degree will take less than 4 years as i am doing 3 subjects at a time and one over summer each year and working full time the whole way through and while i will graduate with not only a degree but 4 years worth of accounting experience, all my friends will graduate with just a degree and will start off on base level salaries. i am in audit and enjoy my job, i could never have a desk job where i am in the same place week in week out. i get to see many different types of companies, get a broad view on the finance and accounting areas in all kinds of different industries. i really think i have made a great decision and most of my colleagues are of the same view as me. honestly, the opportunities are endless. yeah i may get paid a little less, but the opportunities that a big 4 firm offers are unmatched. i can transfer to another office in australia or anywhere in the world, which is what i plan on doing. my friends all envy me because i am earning more than they are, get paid study leave and have a stable income rather than living on casual peanuts which has no guarantee of continuance.
also as a trainee, i may start on a nothing wage, but its what i expected. as i am gaining experience as well as book knowledge through university, my pay will increase exponentially and will be on a much higher salary when i complete my degree than a comparable graduate. also, working at the same time as studying means i can see the practical application of what i am learning first hand, whcih enhances the content better than any amount of study possibly could.
plus, i dont have to be with the firm for life, i could go into being an internal accountant, or completely change industries. frankly, i enjoy what i do now, and think that any kind of internal accounting position would be incredibly dull.
this is my FIRST HAND experience. dont bag something which you have basically no knowledge of. youre putting potential trainees off, when they should be asking people with first hand industry experience.
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seremify007
Junior Member
Haha~ he probably does raise valid points because I've heard all those stories before and I know that in the past, a lot of cadetships have had students doing mundane and repetitive tasks, but in the more modern time, firms are being forced to not only recruit but retain staff. Whilst the uni/work balance may not be everyone's idea of an ideal way to experience university, I think it all comes down to personal preference as to what the individual wants to achieve, and also how they gauge their job opportunities in the future. I'm not sure about others who are doing cadetships, but I did a lot of extra curricular activities in high school, and I had a feeling that in university, I would be no match in comparison to those who join billions of clubs and societies to look good on their resume, and academically-speaking, my results were really good leading up to the end of high school but I am unsure of whether or not I can maintain such results in university competition against students who are of equal calibre (ie. 90+ UAIs) to myself.
As for what Emily said, it's also very true in the sense that after gaining so much work experience, especially in a firm such as PwC (or any big4 firm), there are many opportunities to work in other industries and around the World. For some of us, the work experience offered is much more useful than working at McDonalds, and can help speed things up later on if one would want to pursue a CA/CPA. A lot of people who are nearing the completion of their CA apparently get bomboarded with job offers without even applying for them so I wouldn't say that accounting is a restrictive field since a lot of the knowledge and experience can definitely be translated into other career paths.
Btw, I PM'd you (mashi) in response to your post.
As for what Emily said, it's also very true in the sense that after gaining so much work experience, especially in a firm such as PwC (or any big4 firm), there are many opportunities to work in other industries and around the World. For some of us, the work experience offered is much more useful than working at McDonalds, and can help speed things up later on if one would want to pursue a CA/CPA. A lot of people who are nearing the completion of their CA apparently get bomboarded with job offers without even applying for them so I wouldn't say that accounting is a restrictive field since a lot of the knowledge and experience can definitely be translated into other career paths.
Btw, I PM'd you (mashi) in response to your post.
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seremify007
Junior Member
I presumed it meant a university graduate who was undertaking or has completed the CA/CPA program because usually people who work in accounting firms (ie. the actual revenue-generating staff) have post-graduate qualifications. I've also heard that in some firms, if the graduates continuously fail the post-graduate exams, then they can be asked to leave the firm.redruM said:
Sorry for missing your question earlier- I didn't notice it.
Emily.
Pro-VSU
you cant have started CA or CPA without any experience in a certified firmseremify007 said:
i know at least for CA you need 11 months experience to start, and im sure CPA is similar in that respect.
accountants dont generally pursue post graduate qualifications until they are in a position, not only because of the experience factor, but also because the employer pays for the tutition fees, which are pretty expensive compared with uni from what i hear.
redruM
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For CA, you need 1 year experience to start the Technical modules. Upon completion of them, you need 2 years experience.
For CPA, you need to complete the modules and then have 3 years of experience under a mentor.
You can complete CA within 3 years. But you need at least 4 for CPA.
For CPA, you need to complete the modules and then have 3 years of experience under a mentor.
You can complete CA within 3 years. But you need at least 4 for CPA.
Emily.
Pro-VSU
yeah and theyre all technical modules for CA now, Foundations no longer exists
and why do you need four for CPA? surely you can study and be mentored concurrently?
and why do you need four for CPA? surely you can study and be mentored concurrently?
seremify007
Junior Member
I thought CA was only 9 months now.Emily. said:
Ref: http://www.icaa.org.au/entry/index.cfm?menu=318&id=A106359684
Sorry about my mistake- I just realised I was thinking of people who were cadets and already had the work experience under their belt.
I also think you're right when you say the tuition fees are very expensive- but I also heard that if you fail (not sure how many times), some firms will not pay for the fees for you to repeat the module (and it'll come out of your own pocket).