Chiropractic medicine, Homeopathy, Spiritual healing? (1 Viewer)

[Not-That-Bright]

Many i mean millions of people take homeopathy medication, and many have found results, regardless of whether it because of a 'suggestion' it works.

Yes.. ok that's all well and good for the little ailments, but what about serious diseases? While hope and belief can be a great thing it is not a cure for cancer.

when it comes medicine, it varies from person to person, and thus it maybe effective on one dude and ineffective on a another. anti-botics on some people have no effect does this mean it is a hoax? whilst others it has rapid effect.

But science can explain why there is no affect on these people.. they have a resistance, and they can show that. Your homeopathic nonsense has no proof, it is the same as me claiming that if you drink my magic tapwater you will feel better.

The reason homepathy is preferred i believe is because its safe (lol cause of the dilution).

Oh yes homeopathy is safe... because there's nothing there. There are no side affects... because there is no affect.

 

[gerhard]

it actually works

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy#The_scientific_validity_of_homeopathy

no it doesnt. hundreds of scientific studies comparing homeopathic treatments to placebos can verify this. it does exactly the same thing as a sugar pill. because it is a sugar pill.

simply because you or someone you know has decided to try a homeopathic remedy and after taking it has recovered, doesnt mean that homeopathy cured you.

 

[loquasagacious]

You do realise that homeopathic treatments are usually a chemical... mixed in water... and diluted way past the point when the chemical is no longer recognised in the solution :/



There has been some evidence that lower back manipulation can lead to benefits. However much of what is practiced has very little scientific basis.

Chiropractics is fairly straight foreward:

A vertebrae is out of alignment (this is undeniable and can be seen on xrays as well as physically felt).

Because of this several things are happening a nerve (or nerve group) may be being pressured or pinched in some way. Muslces are being pulled into unnatural positions resulting in strain (again measurable through temperature increases and intuitively in that they are being physically held out of place straining against their natural position). Finally a disc may be being pressured again this is intuitive though can also be seen by ultrasound.

So clearly when a vertebrae is out of alignment it is causing physical discomfit immediately and via the nervous system may be sending messages of such discomfit from other areas of the body.

By re-aligning the vertebrae these problems are solved.

This is not to say that chiropractics as not without fault very few chiropractors properly prepare a back for alignment through massage which by relaxing the muscles makes the process easier. It reduces the strain placed on muslces and bones during realignment and reduces the pressure required. Because it also relaxes the muscles it means they more readily resume their natural position - the offshoot of this being that they are able to hold the vertebrae in place better rather than letting them pop out almost immediately.

A second major flaw being that unlike a physio a chiro will not generally advise you on posture or recommend appropriate stretches and exercise which may provide a longer term solution by strengthening the back muscles.

I think chiropractics overall has become to much of a 'wham bam thank you mamm' see you again in a week profession. Too often it consists of a series of quick fixes as opposed to long term solutions.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Chiropractics is fairly straight foreward:

A vertebrae is out of alignment (this is undeniable and can be seen on xrays as well as physically felt).

Because of this several things are happening a nerve (or nerve group) may be being pressured or pinched in some way. Muslces are being pulled into unnatural positions resulting in strain (again measurable through temperature increases and intuitively in that they are being physically held out of place straining against their natural position). Finally a disc may be being pressured again this is intuitive though can also be seen by ultrasound.

So clearly when a vertebrae is out of alignment it is causing physical discomfit immediately and via the nervous system may be sending messages of such discomfit from other areas of the body.

By re-aligning the vertebrae these problems are solved.

This is not to say that chiropractics as not without fault very few chiropractors properly prepare a back for alignment through massage which by relaxing the muscles makes the process easier. It reduces the strain placed on muslces and bones during realignment and reduces the pressure required. Because it also relaxes the muscles it means they more readily resume their natural position - the offshoot of this being that they are able to hold the vertebrae in place better rather than letting them pop out almost immediately.

A second major flaw being that unlike a physio a chiro will not generally advise you on posture or recommend appropriate stretches and exercise which may provide a longer term solution by strengthening the back muscles.

I think chiropractics overall has become to much of a 'wham bam thank you mamm' see you again in a week profession. Too often it consists of a series of quick fixes as opposed to long term solutions.

Oh loquasagacious... I do not dispute the claims of being able to assist with back pain etc... however they claim that spinal 'abnormalities' are the cause of all disease.

 

[SashatheMan]

never been to any of them, and probably wont. But an asian massage place is on top of my list

 

[Not-That-Bright]

never been to any of them, and probably wont. But an asian massage place is on top of my list

You mean a hooker?

 

[loquasagacious]

Full body massage.....

The explanation for spinal abnormality having broader effects is that muscles are by their nature interconnecting so when some are strained eg in your back others are strained because they are connected.

Other ailments may be felt by the nervous system (but not actually occuring) because of pressure against the spinal cord.

Finally just as pressure against the spinal cord by misaligned vertebrae can impair signals 'up' the cord they could also impair signals 'down' the cord. eg send improper messages to various places.

I find the first two certainly plausible. I think of greater importance though is the backs central importance to movement etc. It is a key player in core strength so when it is aligned you feel better all over.

 

[+Po1ntDeXt3r+]

The issue is that it doesn't always work...simply believing isn't a guarantee and many people will choose these solutions rather than actual, proven, medical solutions because they see them as equal. That costs lives....not just the lives of the people making the decision, but more worrisome, imo, is when parents make those choices for kids that are in need of medical treatment.

i think you have to realise in context

of course believing isnt a guarantee... but if faith alone helps.. and DOES NOT harm.. there is little to no reason to hurt a family's chance..

certainly 1 in a 250,000 chance to recovery is usually a good time to try the witchdoctor..

Proven medical solutions are good...but you cant force them on ppl without consent and with some there is significant side effects that ppl feel lessen their quality of life.
e.g. Nitrates do not allow u to take Viagra (Sildenafil) or Cialis (Tadalafil) for erectile difficulties cos u can get heart failure.. or u can live without sex..

I feel parents are allowed to deviate and assist in management of a child.. but where there are life threatening consequences.. hopefully we can make them wards of the state...

example 1
Parents that dun believe in immunisation.

there are times when its not too consequential atm such as smallpox and i can understand the reasoning.

there are times when id highly recommend it to parents.. like Flu vaccines.

there are times when id like to beat the parents over the head with a cast iron hammer like Hep B, Meningacoccal C, Rubella etc..

example 2
Jehovah's Witnesses' Children and their rights to life-saving blood transfusions.

...this is wayyyy too long of a discussion in itself...

if i wont cost life... be informed.. but ignorance is bliss sometimes and medical science is a stupid stupid field..

Interestingly one of the main factors in chronic back pain is psychological and stress manifesting itself as physical pain.. and mabbe a listening chiropractor is far better than a busy medical practitioner rushing to find a medical or surgical solution.... of course one is bound to make u more relaxed too..
and there are times when it is muscle spasms.. and the rubbing and trigger points help.. it helps me .. my lower back pain just goes

altho where some chiropractors claim to adjust ure spine to cure asthma is a load of crock..

when it comes medicine, it varies from person to person, and thus it maybe effective on one dude and ineffective on a another. anti-botics on some people have no effect does this mean it is a hoax? whilst others it has rapid effect.

The reason homepathy is preferred i believe is because its safe (lol cause of the dilution).

no... prolly cos the bacteria is resistant to that antibiotic.. get another one .. generally antibiotic courses need to be completed lik 5-7 days worth. even after symptoms have gone. GP's get reluctant to prescribe 'stronger' antibiotics cos they now get tracked and they have to self monitor to insure we dun get too many antibiotic resistant bacteria.

some Homeopaths overseas have used deadly nightshade.. as it was used traditionally..killed ppl.. prolly the natural cure for life

Full body massage.....

The explanation for spinal abnormality having broader effects is that muscles are by their nature interconnecting so when some are strained eg in your back others are strained because they are connected.

Other ailments may be felt by the nervous system (but not actually occuring) because of pressure against the spinal cord.

Finally just as pressure against the spinal cord by misaligned vertebrae can impair signals 'up' the cord they could also impair signals 'down' the cord. eg send improper messages to various places.

I find the first two certainly plausible. I think of greater importance though is the backs central importance to movement etc. It is a key player in core strength so when it is aligned you feel better all over.

Pausible is one thing but you need to extrapolate the information to experimental data to prove the point.. in Chiropractics they need more work on this part of their science. I certainly feel they have a place in health care but whether to publicly fund it is dependent on their works' scientific basis..

 

[Salima]

I use homeopathy cause my mom's into it,a nd it actaully does work. It can be halal for me too, cause the pills don't have any alochohol, but if their is no alternative, then I got to take the pills. I just don't take it when i'm abotu to pray, and long before the next one.

 

[withoutaface]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy#The_scientific_validity_of_homeopathy

no it doesnt. hundreds of scientific studies comparing homeopathic treatments to placebos can verify this. it does exactly the same thing as a sugar pill. because it is a sugar pill.

simply because you or someone you know has decided to try a homeopathic remedy and after taking it has recovered, doesnt mean that homeopathy cured you.

Don't be silly. Next thing you'll be saying that prayer/God doesn't cure people!

 

[davin]

i think you have to realise in context

The context is someone needs medical treatment and instead tries to just go for a placebo effect and hope that works

 

[withoutaface]

I use homeopathy cause my mom's into it,a nd it actaully does work. It can be halal for me too, cause the pills don't have any alochohol, but if their is no alternative, then I got to take the pills. I just don't take it when i'm abotu to pray, and long before the next one.

It does not work. The effect is a placebo, just like your conception of God.

 

[davin]

God - the ultimate sugar pill

 

[withoutaface]

I'd say he's more of a frontal lobotomy...

 

[+Po1ntDeXt3r+]

The context is someone needs medical treatment and instead tries to just go for a placebo effect and hope that works

no... u try miracle cures before, after or with conventional therapy...

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I use homeopathy cause my mom's into it,a nd it actaully does work. It can be halal for me too, cause the pills don't have any alochohol, but if their is no alternative, then I got to take the pills. I just don't take it when i'm abotu to pray, and long before the next one.

No... it doesn't work at all. It is a cleverly marketed placebo... There is not one person on the face of the planet who can design a double-blind test to determine which of the solutions is homeopathic water... and which is plain water.

no... u try miracle cures before, after or with conventional therapy...

You are very correct, and this is how alot of the stories about the success of these 'cures' in fighting cancer come out in the open... For example I saw an interview of a man whom claimed his cancer was healed by benny hinn... later on they asked if they could talk to his doctor to find out the same, and he said 'oh sure... but my doctor doesn't believe it was the faith he believes it was the chemo'...

It is very dangerous... so many people put their faith in these cures over real medicine and they end up dead, their loved ones feel the pain of knowing that person could of quite easily lived... they also rake in millions and millions of dollars which they use to appear on tv shows and get millions more customers as all the coverage of such things on TV tends to be extremely biased.

 

[+Po1ntDeXt3r+]

benny hinn is such a commercialism of true faith.. makes me sick... at 5am in the morning..