Evolution/Intelligent Design (1 Viewer)

[Rorix]

No, im saying reason and faith are irreconcilable.

If you can prove God exists, great. Then ill believe.

Faith means you cant prove it.

You can have faith from reason.

Furthermore, faith does not mean that I can't prove it. I can have faith in things which are provable. I can have faith in gravity [if gravity is provable].

That is, if you are using the normal definition(s) of the word faith.

Your argument is rather circular, you are dismissing the position basically because 'something that can't be proven [according to you] hasn't been proven'.

 

[Slidey]

Oh, of course. I'm a figment of your imagination.

 

[MoonlightSonata]

Yes, please.

Alritey. Before I begin let me say that this is NOT the normal ontological argument. It is a modal version of the ontological argument which does not contain the same question-begging fallacies.

(This argument entails some knowledge of possible world theory).

1. A perfect being (a being possessing all perfections essentially) is not impossible.
2. Necessary existence is a perfection.
:: A perfect being exists.

To expound:

Poss (a perfect being)
= In possible world (W), there is a perfect being (G)

In W, G is necessary
= G is in all worlds

:: G exists here.

I don't necessarily approve of this argument. But it does show that you can use reason, reasonably, to attempt to show the existence of God.

 

[Slidey]

And yet like all such arguments, to prove it wrong, or see with reasonable conviction that it is wrong, one need only look as far as the initial assumptions; axioms. That's the case with all mathematics.

 

[MoonlightSonata]

And yet like all such arguments, to prove it wrong, or see with reasonable conviction that it is wrong, one need only look as far as the initial assumptions; axioms. That's the case with all mathematics.

True, though if one disagrees with a premise, you'd best state which premise and why

 

[MoonlightSonata]

Ok, so I know that i necessarily exist. So your argument would mean that in my view I am God

No you contingently exist.

If you need more info about modal reasoning please read a bit of the info from the link I posted about possible world theory, it's easy to read and should help