• Best of luck to the class of 2024 for their HSC exams. You got this!
    Let us know your thoughts on the HSC exams here
  • YOU can help the next generation of students in the community!
    Share your trial papers and notes on our Notes & Resources page
MedVision ad

General weights thread (1 Viewer)

Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
729
Location
Newcastle
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
'useless' probably wasn't the right word to use (then again, out of all the isolation exercises I'd use for chest it would be the dumbest, I'd use an incline/decline to hit a lagging musclehead and boards to improve my bench) 'not a priority' would have been better.
 

quik.

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
Fatigue =/= strength or hypertrophy.

Why not?

The reason why I'm 87kg and Percy Montgomery is 94kg is because he can bench 150, squat 220 and deadlifts 300.

Strength = muscle mass. Compound exercises hit more muscles and stress the central nervous system to a greater extent which forces the body to get bigger. The focus of every lifter should be getting their bench, squat, deadlift, pull ups, rows and cleans higher.

Isolations are only relevant in that in the intermediate/advanced level they can help a lifter improve these lifts (for example, heavy core work) or for a bodybuilder can hit muscles which lag. But bodybuilding is gay.

Because the hammer hits the muscle the other tools do anyway, and does a better job of it. And if you use too many tools you won't get the job done.
Fatigue was 2 of 4 examples given, and using fatigue as a tool in your exercise program I would say is a very important aspect of strength and hypertrophy training.

If you think that you will magically be able to lift a given amount of weight in a particular lift at a given bodyweight you are kidding yourself. Same if you think lifting a given weight means you will weigh a certain amount. Strength comes from muscle mass, fibre type, CNS and in all likelihood a host of other factors. There are some tiny fuckers out there who lift massive weight.

If you want to focus on compounds at the expense of all else then that is fine and it won't necessarily lead you wrong. But it is a very narrow view.
 
Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
729
Location
Newcastle
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
If you think that you will magically be able to lift a given amount of weight in a particular lift at a given bodyweight you are kidding yourself. Same if you think lifting a given weight means you will weigh a certain amount. Strength comes from muscle mass, fibre type, CNS and in all likelihood a host of other factors. There are some tiny fuckers out there who lift massive weight.
There is a clear correlation between bodymass and strength. A bigger muscle is a stronger muscle, a muscle enlarges in order to compensate for increased workload.

I am not saying that X lifter will be able to lift Y weight (though if you look at most lifting stats they give you a ballpark figure) rather that if a person increases their bench, deadlift and squat and are eatting to sustain this they will notice an increase in bodyweight. Yes it is that simple.

We're not talking genetic anomolies, such as bodybuilders drugged to the teeth who only lift RESPECTABLE weights or olympic lifts who restrict their calories in order to stay within a certain weightclass, but for the 99% of the population.

Simple fact is this: properly performed, full range-of-motion barbell exercises are essentually the functional expression of human skeletal and muscular anatomy under a load.

If you want to focus on compounds at the expense of all else then that is fine and it won't necessarily lead you wrong. But it is a very narrow view.
In the macrocycle there might be muscular imbalances, but as long as they are dealt with when they occur I do not see why your routine should not revolve around the compounds (squats, deadlifts or power cleans, rows, pull ups, dips, bench press and overhead press).

There are 3 muscle heads on the shoulders, chest and triceps, two on the forearms (I could continue like this for a while) you simply cannot hit every muscle head without employing an ineffective routine, let alone be able to work your whole body x3 a week. Why not focus on the basics and solve issues like imbalances when they occur?
 

quik.

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
I never said that you shouldn't build a program around compound lifts. Simply that isolation exercises are not solely the domain of people who have been lifting for 5+ years.

Hitting everything 3x a week is a choice, personally at the moment I work muscle groups twice p/week and previously have done so once p/week. I've had a lot of success, as have many people, using compound exercises followed by isolation exercises in order to work the muscle as much as possible. However this is getting off the point.

All I am saying is what is in the first paragraph of this post, isolation exercises have their place whether developing mass or strength.
 
Joined
Oct 18, 2007
Messages
729
Location
Newcastle
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
I never said that you shouldn't build a program around compound lifts. Simply that isolation exercises are not solely the domain of people who have been lifting for 5+ years.

Hitting everything 3x a week is a choice, personally at the moment I work muscle groups twice p/week and previously have done so once p/week. I've had a lot of success, as have many people, using compound exercises followed by isolation exercises in order to work the muscle as much as possible. However this is getting off the point.

All I am saying is what is in the first paragraph of this post, isolation exercises have their place whether developing mass or strength.
I think isolation exercises have their place also (I do core work and arm work because I found that after a period of time these muscles were lagging) but I still added these after finding out what wasnt working after 4 months of training. 95% of my training is based on compounds, and I expect that to change the more lifting I have under my belt.

Omie's routine currently contains no decent compounds or major lifts and a lot of bloody isolation exercises. I dont think that's a decent focus.
 

quik.

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
I think isolation exercises have their place also (I do core work and arm work because I found that after a period of time these muscles were lagging) but I still added these after finding out what wasnt working after 4 months of training. 95% of my training is based on compounds, and I expect that to change the more lifting I have under my belt.

Omie's routine currently contains no decent compounds or major lifts and a lot of bloody isolation exercises. I dont think that's a decent focus.
If I remember correctly he works out like once a week, I doubt anything he does will make a significant difference. He may have changed this, however.

Either way, I think we agree and thus let the singing around the campfire commence.
 

Omie Jay

gone
Joined
Nov 8, 2006
Messages
6,673
Location
in my own pants
Gender
Female
HSC
2007
another question, any major benefits of doing pushups, whether regular or with legs raised?

im guessing this would be a muscular endurance kinda thing
 

quik.

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2006
Messages
781
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
You will get better at pushups

I like doing weighted pushups but am yet to find a reliable way to stop the weight moving.
 

Omie Jay

gone
Joined
Nov 8, 2006
Messages
6,673
Location
in my own pants
Gender
Female
HSC
2007
yea of course i will, i used to be fairly awesome at em, then i bummed out for a year and im back to merely above average.

are they worth doing at all?

and try putting the weights in a backpack, one of those hiking ones that have an additional clip to secure around your waist, or get a normal backpack, put weights in it, then use a belt to fasten to ur torso, or something.

and any particularly special way to rest your hands?
i used to just place palms flat on the ground, but my wrists have a tendency of being shit, i'd get piercing pain in them etc, so now i go on knuckles, no more pain.
 
Last edited:

CharlieB

?uestlove
Joined
Sep 30, 2004
Messages
390
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
another question, any major benefits of doing pushups, whether regular or with legs raised?

im guessing this would be a muscular endurance kinda thing
switch it up as much as you can and work different stabilizer muscles


[youtube]EOyy-zmnLHc[/youtube]

You will get better at pushups

I like doing weighted pushups but am yet to find a reliable way to stop the weight moving.
[youtube]q4xT9i-1Qa4[/youtube]
 

Omie Jay

gone
Joined
Nov 8, 2006
Messages
6,673
Location
in my own pants
Gender
Female
HSC
2007
first dude is quite awesome, i wanna try that stuff out but i definitely wouldnt have THAT sorta endurance :eek:
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top