Grammar help with 'le' and the like (1 Viewer)

[Sugar]

I was trying to write a response to some writing questions and come across this sentence.

Je ne le tolererai pas. (I will not tolerate it.)

I never really completely understood the positioning of 'le', so I was wondering if anyone could explain that to me, and perhaps give me more examples of it.

Hoping someone can clarify for me. Thankyou.

 

[ephemeral]

There is an order to follow with the placement of pronouns, something like (if i remember correctly)

first:
me te se nous vous etc.
then
le la les
lui leur
y
and last
en

 

[chepas]

Hi Sugar,

The 'le' in that sentence is the direct object pronoun, ie, it is a word that replaces the direct object of the sentence. The following (some of which ephemeral posted) are the direct object pronouns:

me
te
le/la
nous
vous
les

Eg:
Je regarde la télé. - Je la regarde.

Thomas détèste Marie - Il la détèste. (NB: I personally hate 'détester', the accents I always get wrong so it may not be that way!)

A: Tu as lu le journal ce matin?
B: Oui, je l'ai lu.

So, the direct object pronoun always goes before the verb from which it receives the action. In the passé composé etc, it goes before the auxiliary verb (ie, the ai, as, a... part with avoir, être...)
___________________________________________________

Some more complicated ones. There are also indirect object pronouns, the ones that take:

me
te
lui
nous
vous
leur

These are used with verbs that take prepositions, that is, verbs that don't directly do something to the object. Some examples of these verbs are:

1) dire a`
2) parler a`
3) faire (quelque chose) a` (quelqu'un)
4) manquer a`
5) téléphoner a`

NB: By no means is this a definitive list! Just for example's sake.

1) A: Je vais dire 'bonjour' a` Phillippe
1) B: Quoi? Tu ne lui dis pas bonjour tout de suite?

The 'lui' replaces "Phillippe" - 3rd person singular - and as Phillippe is the indirect object, he takes 'lui'. Literally one would translate 'a` Phillippe' as '.. to Phillippe': "I am going to say hello to Phillippe."

1) A: Je lui ai dit de venir a` 14 heures.
1) B: Haha, je le lui ai déja` dit!

Now, you have an indirect object (lui), but also another something. For this example, you would translate the last sentence as "I already told him that" - 'that' is equal to the 'le', or the direct object. '(de) venir a` 14 heures' functions as a direct object here, as a thing. (On second thoughts, forget about that if it's too hard at the moment, it's not important hehe.)

2) Ben, il faut que tu lui parles, Christophe! Sois pas si con...
1) (You have to speak to him/her, Chris!)

3) Je leur ai fait mal!
1) (I hurt them!)
1) Tu me largues? Oooh! Tu me fais mal au coeur!
1) (You're breaking up with me? Ooh, you've heart my heart... more like a nice piece of schmaltz for writing..)

4) Vous me manquez tellement!
1) (I miss you so much!) Careful here, to miss someone is actually expressed as 'you are missing to me', so "I miss
1) you" - "Tu me manques/Vous me manquez".

5) A: Est-ce que vous pouvez téléphoner au magasin leur dire que je voudrais annuler ma commande?
1) B: Ne vous inquiétez pas, je leur ai déja` téléphoné. Tout est reglé.
1) (A: Did you phone the shop to tell them that I want to cancel my order?
1) B: Don't worry, I have already phoned them. All's been fixed.)

I was a bit sneaky here: "Est-ce que vous pouvez téléphoner au magasin leur dire que je...". Here another example of how the object pronouns ALWAYS go BEFORE the verb to which they refer.
___________________________________________________

So to some up, the words like 'le' etc always have to go before the verb. A very hard and fast rule.

Also re: tolérer, I wouldn't use tolérer as it's a bit of a false friend, I'd use instead "supporter": "Je ne le supporterai pas" - I won't tolerate it/I won't put up with it.

I would go into the 'y' and the 'en', but that is a whole new kettle of fish .

I suggest you take a peek at a good reference grammar book or something, or french.about.com, which is brimming with these kinds of explanations, which will probably be a lot clearer than mine!

J'espère que ça t'aide. p),
chepas .

 

[!Solskjaer!]

Chepas, I am in year 10 and exceptionally grateful for the above tutorial.

I understand the way pronouns work, but I occasionally forget bits and pieces here and there. This is the first time I have seen any sort of guide anywhere near as complete as ^that. Thanks mon!

-----

Does this make sense?

I would like to send you an SMS. (No, not really, it's just for the sake of clarifying the rule with the verb 'to send'.)

"Je voudrais t'envoyer un SMS."

 

[chepas]

Hi Solskjaer, bienvenue au forum français en plus!

Yes that's ^ correct. envoyer a`, so you take the indirect object, 'te'. As it's in front of the vowel you do «t'», and the indirect object pronoun goes before the infinitive there. A+

I see you're doing the HSC in 2007 - are you doing Continuers next year?

chepas .

 

[!Solskjaer!]

I certainly am, and looking forward to it.

So "Je voudrais envoyer un SMS a` toi" would also make sense?

 

[cameronius]

I certainly am, and looking forward to it.

So "Je voudrais envoyer un SMS a` toi" would also make sense?

No, not exactly. When in english we say "to you, to me, to her etc", the French always replace that with the indirect object pronoun, me, te, lui, nous, vous, leur. So if you want to say I would like to send you an SMS you must write

"Je voudrais t'envoyer un SMS"

So, basically, "* toi" is always "te" (before the verb).

Hope that answered your question.

 

[el gwapo]

i need a bit of revision, when is "en" or "le/la/les" used?

 

[fearless86]

check with your teacher- but in my opinion:

'en' is when youre talking about some.

and 'le/la/les' is talking about the actual thing.

so- tu veux du sucre?
Oui, j'en veux.

Tu veux le lait?
Oui, je le veux.

 

[el gwapo]

i checked..since i last posted that message.. and apparently it's "some of it" so tu veux de sucre (do you want sugar)... oui j'en veux (yes I want some of it)