How do I convince my teacher that i can do 4U? (1 Viewer)

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So idk what exactly my teacher is going to say about if I can do or not do 4u but he's being very vague and its sort of hinting to me that I can't do 4u despite being ranked relatively higher than most students in ext. What should I say in the case he does say no? Like this is sort of unfair as there are students in ext averaging less than 70 that might have the chance to do it via the accelerated pathway but like... not fair on me at all...
 

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So idk what exactly my teacher is going to say about if I can do or not do 4u but he's being very vague and its sort of hinting to me that I can't do 4u despite being ranked relatively higher than most students in ext. What should I say in the case he does say no? Like this is sort of unfair as there are students in ext averaging less than 70 that might have the chance to do it via the accelerated pathway but like... not fair on me at all...
just compile any evidence that you’ve excelled in 3u, such as your rank like you’ve said, but also show any results, how much you study everyday, how much you’d be willing to study for 4u, that you love maths/content that 4u has gone into, show that you’ve researched 4u stuff and potentially start learning some of the content to show your dedication. some of this might be a bit excessive but it could be worth it
 

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just compile any evidence that you’ve excelled in 3u, such as your rank like you’ve said, but also show any results, how much you study everyday, how much you’d be willing to study for 4u, that you love maths/content that 4u has gone into, show that you’ve researched 4u stuff and potentially start learning some of the content to show your dedication. some of this might be a bit excessive but it could be worth it
tyty 🙏🙏
 

iloveeggs

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So idk what exactly my teacher is going to say about if I can do or not do 4u but he's being very vague and its sort of hinting to me that I can't do 4u despite being ranked relatively higher than most students in ext. What should I say in the case he does say no? Like this is sort of unfair as there are students in ext averaging less than 70 that might have the chance to do it via the accelerated pathway but like... not fair on me at all...
i would personally get my parents involved. definitely don't do this you feel like it can make the situation more heated/turn into a fight and make your teacher turn against you. but on the off chance that your teacher and parents are reasonable and respectful i feel like it allows for less of a chance of the teacher BSing you and intimidating you. also they are more inclined to present a clearer argument to your parents as opposed to you. ive been in a situation where i've had to speak to a teacher regarding an issue and i was dealt with very differently to my parents bc we spoke to the teachers alone on seperate instances. this is up to you tho

also yes compile your past 3u performance and explain how strong 3u performance indicates a higher rate of success in 4u, even more do than 2u. like if someone barely passed 3u but aced 2u the reasonable recommendation would be that they stick to just 3u or even drop to 2u, but if you did badly in 2u and much better in 3u thats indicative of maybe not dedicating enough effort to 2u or whatever other issue you might have dealt with.

the most important thing to do tho, is to give them a clear reason for why your 2u performance is what it is (for example maybe you were doing more units or extracurriculars than you could handle in y11, and you put more effort into 3u than 2u bc you didn't have enough time to do both) and how you are going to fix it for next year to make sure that doesn't happen in the hc (continuing with the same example you could say you are going to drop extra units or whatever to reduce your workload).

also id also ask if there is anything you can do personally to prove you can cope with 4u. in the past in my school they allowed a few lower-performing students to do 4u on a provisional basis, meaning for a bit they weren't actually enrolled in the course but they attended lessons to see how they would go, and then they would join them in afterwards. my school was told to stop doing it bc of enrolment issues with nesa but im sure you can do it in a more reasonable way. like similar to the way how you can drop or switch courses if they are on the same line in the first week or so, see if you could ask if you could attend a few lessons for the first few weeks to see if you could keep up to the class or whatever. and they can kick you if they think you're too far beyond the rest of the cohort.
 

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i would personally get my parents involved. definitely don't do this you feel like it can make the situation more heated/turn into a fight and make your teacher turn against you. but on the off chance that your teacher and parents are reasonable and respectful i feel like it allows for less of a chance of the teacher BSing you and intimidating you. also they are more inclined to present a clearer argument to your parents as opposed to you. ive been in a situation where i've had to speak to a teacher regarding an issue and i was dealt with very differently to my parents bc we spoke to the teachers alone on seperate instances. this is up to you tho

also yes compile your past 3u performance and explain how strong 3u performance indicates a higher rate of success in 4u, even more do than 2u. like if someone barely passed 3u but aced 2u the reasonable recommendation would be that they stick to just 3u or even drop to 2u, but if you did badly in 2u and much better in 3u thats indicative of maybe not dedicating enough effort to 2u or whatever other issue you might have dealt with.

the most important thing to do tho, is to give them a clear reason for why your 2u performance is what it is (for example maybe you were doing more units or extracurriculars than you could handle in y11, and you put more effort into 3u than 2u bc you didn't have enough time to do both) and how you are going to fix it for next year to make sure that doesn't happen in the hc (continuing with the same example you could say you are going to drop extra units or whatever to reduce your workload).

also id also ask if there is anything you can do personally to prove you can cope with 4u. in the past in my school they allowed a few lower-performing students to do 4u on a provisional basis, meaning for a bit they weren't actually enrolled in the course but they attended lessons to see how they would go, and then they would join them in afterwards. my school was told to stop doing it bc of enrolment issues with nesa but im sure you can do it in a more reasonable way. like similar to the way how you can drop or switch courses if they are on the same line in the first week or so, see if you could ask if you could attend a few lessons for the first few weeks to see if you could keep up to the class or whatever. and they can kick you if they think you're too far beyond the rest of the cohort.
hmmm I battled a few mental issues during this yr. I should've filed for misadventure but I didn't want many people to know what was going on behind the scenes so I kept it on the low. do u think thats good as an excuse asw?
 
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iloveeggs

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hmmm I battled a few mental issues during this yr. I should've filed for misadventure but I didn't want many people to know what was going on behind the scenes so I kept it on the low. do u think thats good as an excuse asw?
you can bring it up ig. like you need to justify your 2u marks as not being a reflection of your ability one way or another
 

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as @iloveeggs said, do provisional
but i'd say do something like "meet [x] mark in AT1 to keep doing 4u "
issue is a lot of schools wont let you as of recently bc of issues w enrolment into y12 courses and letting some kids do provisional entry and they bomb 4u and that kind of stuff. check with your teachers if you can do a more informal type thing where you sit in on a few lessons and they see how you cope and if they agree with that ask about the provisional entry stuff
 

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issue is a lot of schools wont let you as of recently bc of issues w enrolment into y12 courses and letting some kids do provisional entry and they bomb 4u and that kind of stuff. check with your teachers if you can do a more informal type thing where you sit in on a few lessons and they see how you cope and if they agree with that ask about the provisional entry stuff
oh wow, how recent? (also what's stopping them from just doing a few non-counting tests instead LOL)
 

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So idk what exactly my teacher is going to say about if I can do or not do 4u but he's being very vague and its sort of hinting to me that I can't do 4u despite being ranked relatively higher than most students in ext. What should I say in the case he does say no? Like this is sort of unfair as there are students in ext averaging less than 70 that might have the chance to do it via the accelerated pathway but like... not fair on me at all...
How can they force you not to choose a subject? Pretty sure its your choice. Remember, teachers end up as teachers because they weren't the best back then.
 

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How can they force you not to choose a subject? Pretty sure its your choice. Remember, teachers end up as teachers because they weren't the best back then.
my school has prereqs unfortunately. I am going to see my teacher and see how it goes. If I get in. Happy. If not. I will just have to deal w it somehow.
 

iloveeggs

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oh wow, how recent? (also what's stopping them from just doing a few non-counting tests instead LOL)
to decide 4u classes, my school essentially uses 3u ranks and fill up 24 slots that way. the other 24 in my cohort are for the students who accelerate 2u maths ONLY (there are 24 of us) and we have to be separated from the rest bc we have already done some of the content the other 4 class will have to learn from scratch. if any of the accelerated students dont make top 48 in 3u or we opt out of 4u they can't refill our places bc there can only be 2 classes or 24 and no non-accelerated kid can be in our class.

idk why there is a max of 24 students in a class or why we only have 2 4u classes but my hypothesis is that by making it harder to get into, the kids in that cohort are really smart and therefore there is a higher b6 rate. my school does this for chem, phys, ext eng too

so since thats unfair on non-accelerated kids bc they had less seats, last year my school did a "probation" or provisional entry thing where a few kids who were a just a few ranks off were put in a class but they weren't properly enrolled into the hsc course for a while or smth like that bc they added them to the class of 24 (and apparently the rule is that senior classes can have maximum 24 students before having to start a new class or smth) so they sort of bent the rules for these kids. i could be recounting the stuff about the nesa/det rules or whatever wrong bc i dont know the rules but thats the general gist of what happened.

i they got shit from higher ups in det or nesa or smth who knows. smth about an ace manual and nesa rules or smth. also out of the kids they took a chance on a few of them totally bombed out on 4u and only like 2 did well. so since its a lose-lose for my school they stopped doing that
 
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issue is a lot of schools wont let you as of recently bc of issues w enrolment into y12 courses and letting some kids do provisional entry and they bomb 4u and that kind of stuff. check with your teachers if you can do a more informal type thing where you sit in on a few lessons and they see how you cope and if they agree with that ask about the provisional entry stuff
so if u didnt b6 the adv, r u not allowed to do 4u or is it still guaranteed?
 

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How can they force you not to choose a subject? Pretty sure its your choice. Remember, teachers end up as teachers because they weren't the best back then.
some schools have limited resources and high demand for picking a subject so they have to have entry criteria based on performance to select ppl. they also may make it hard to get into so only smarter kids can get in and have an overall higher b6 rate or smth stupid like that
 

iloveeggs

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so if u didnt b6 the adv, r u not allowed to do 4u or is it still guaranteed?
so they look at prelim 3u first and see where i rank. so say someone is ranked like in the top 48. so they are pretty much in, but they will check 2u for good measure. if this person b4s 2u and they are like ranked 47 in 3u they're cooked. if they are at a b5 level and they are ranked top 20 in 3u they are in.

so even if you f up in 2u you have to be better in 2u to make up for it. but if youre like below average in 2u you are cooked bc my cohort is big and below average is quite bad
 

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So idk what exactly my teacher is going to say about if I can do or not do 4u but he's being very vague and its sort of hinting to me that I can't do 4u despite being ranked relatively higher than most students in ext. What should I say in the case he does say no? Like this is sort of unfair as there are students in ext averaging less than 70 that might have the chance to do it via the accelerated pathway but like... not fair on me at all...
Tbh tell him to let you do the first 4u task, grind hard and impress him and make him confident in his decision to put you in that course.
 

iloveeggs

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Tbh tell him to let you do the first 4u task, grind hard and impress him and make him confident in his decision to put you in that course.
sounds like a decent idea but some schools wont let you do that bc youre technically not supposed to sit tasks without enrolling, on the off chance they dont manage admin properly your school could get in trouble or at least thats what happend with mine
 

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