Islam Discussion (2 Viewers)

[veterandoggy]

For a religion that is meant to be tolerant and somewhat logical, veterandoogy sure has helped the cause by portraying it as a bit of an illogical mess that barely tolerates its own adherents.

which post are you referring to exactly? forget about it, ive had enough for today, but tomorrow is another day coming...

 

[Generator]

Most, actually. It may just be your manner of expression, but I am of the opinion that your posts (such as the one detailing the afterlife for a man and that discussing those who will be 'saved' on your judgement day) are suggestive of an intolerant religion that doesn't make much sense when considered logically.

If you'd like a piece of advice, I would suggest that you let someone else argue the point, because you seem to leave far too many holes into which those with a point of criticism may pour scorn. It would also help not to suggest that all who oppose you are your enemies, because that's hardly a useful frame of mind for one accessing a forum that is meant to facilitate constructive yet youthful debates concerning a range of issues (not just religion, despite what some may think) between people of diverse backgrounds and opinions.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

interseting that u ask about pork..lets investigate shall we...

( 1 )Pigs often eat and play in their own excrement

( 2 )Due to this and its biological structure, the pig produces much higher levels of antibodies in its body than other animals.

( 3 )In addition, far higher levels of growth hormone are produced in the pig compared to those in other animals and human beings. Naturally, these high levels of antibodies and growth hormone pass across to and collect in the pig's muscle tissue.

( 4 ) Pork meat also contains high levels of cholesterol and lipids. It has been scientifically proven that these significant amounts of antibodies, hormones, cholesterol and lipids in pork represent a serious threat to human health.

( 5 )Another harmful substance in pork is the "trichina" worm. This is frequently found in pork and when it enters the human body, it settles directly in the muscles of the heart and represents a possibly fatal threat. Even though it is now technically possible to identify pigs that are infected with trichina, no such methods were known in earlier centuries. That means that everyone who ate pork risked infection by trichina and possible death.

And the vesre from the Quran... oh the wisdom behind such matters...
"He has only forbidden you carrion, blood and pork and what has been consecrated to other than Allah. But anyone who is forced to eat it-without desiring it or going to excess in it-commits no crime. Allah is Ever-Forgiving, Most Merciful." (Qur'an, 2:173)

1. So do other animals.
Other points: I asked for contextual relevance, what you gave me was a throwback to times when such identification was impossible, and as such these rules are redundant.

 

[physician]

1. So do other animals.
Other points: I asked for contextual relevance, what you gave me was a throwback to times when such identification was impossible, and as such these rules are redundant.

Do u have a basis for that statement , or did u just make that up?


if u put aside ( 5 ) for a moment... I think u will realise that the first 4 still hold for all times!!! whether it be today or 1400 years ago!

 

[Capitalist Pig]

1. I've seen sheep eat their own shit, and cows poking around it with their noses, I think that is evidence enough.
2,3. What are the effects of heightened levels of such antibodies on the human body, and if they are so bad then why is pork not outlawed by the Australian food authorities?
4. So that's why halal kebab shops still serve hot chips with their kebabs, which are incidently packed with fat?

 

[Generator]

Humans play with excrement, too, but I guess that the difference is that we are more likely to play with catshit than we are our own.

Remember, cover your backyard sandpits if you don't want to be as dirty as a pig!

 

[physician]

1. I've seen sheep eat their own shit, and cows poking around it with their noses, I think that is evidence enough.
2,3. What are the effects of heightened levels of such antibodies on the human body, and if they are so bad then why is pork not outlawed by the Australian food authorities?
4. So that's why halal kebab shops still serve hot chips with their kebabs, which are incidently packed with fat?

( 1 ) U have? pritty weird sheep!..poking around it with their noses is different to playing (rolling around etc.) in it... completely different

( 2 ), ( 3 ): the answer to ur question is found in ( 4 ) It has been scientifically proven that these significant amounts of antibodies, hormones, cholesterol and lipids in pork represent a serious threat to human health...

yes!... so does hot chips... but not to such a high extent!

hot chips and pork which contains 'antibodies and hormones' are 2 different things!

 

[physician]

Humans play with excrement, too, but I guess that the difference is that we are more likely to play with catshit than we are our own.

Remember, cover your backyard sandpits if you don't want to be as dirty as a pig!

we dont eat humans do we???

at least I dont!...

humans play with excrement??? ...

I think ur version before it was edited contained something about kids playing wth excrement... I think its the responsibilty of the parents to make sure they dont!

Just because they do, it doesnt make it right... and as i said... dead humans arent sold in shops... pigs are!

 

[Generator]

we dont eat humans do we???

at least I dont!...

humans play with excrement??? ...

I think ur version before it was edited contained something about kids playing wth excrement... I think its the responsibilty of the parents to make sure they dont!

Just because they do, it doesnt make it right... and as i said... dead humans arent sold in shops... pigs are!

...

Whether you eat a pig or not, it's still 'dirty' given your reasons, and that was the point. I wasn't playing with the notion that because a pig is meant to be 'dirty' it shouldn't be eaten, but rather that of it just being 'dirty'.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

( 2 ), ( 3 ): the answer to ur question is found in ( 4 ) It has been scientifically proven that these significant amounts of antibodies, hormones, cholesterol and lipids in pork represent a serious threat to human health...

So would fasting for a month, I would imagine, if not managed properly. But most Muslims would manage their eating and drinking patterns during non light hours to make sure that it's not. By the same token most people would be responsible enough not to eat pork chops every day and hence would avoid any serious risk to their health.

 

[SashatheMan]

dying naturally with the words of the declaration of allah's oneness on your lips would make you a shaheed. oh, and if you also die of an illness, and you were patient, you are also a shaheed. if i remember these have very little punishment before entering heaven.

and there's no such thing as a holy war

how can there be no such thing as a holy war, is many extremists mention it and die for that cuase. are you just saying that becuase you dont know . i think so

 

[SashatheMan]

Ummm there is such thing as a Holy War.

i know there is veterandoggy go read up for yourself, dotn try to defend islam by saying its not true, when obviously there is so much evidence there is. my proof, i seen evidence of actual muslims speak of it.

 

[SashatheMan]

Soha and veterandoggy you produce so much crap out of your mouths, but dotn have anything to support it.

Soha you believe so strongly that islam is the only true religion and that everyone else will go to hell,
http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.gif

using this graph muslims make up only 20 % of relions. Christians have a much higher number, if there really was a god , it would be logical to deduce that the greatest amount of believers would be most right. Islam falls short of numbers and hence would go to hell.

veteraldoggy, you are pulling all these precise numbers out of your behind, eg 1 in every 73 will pass to heaven etc etc, how can you be so certain that the numebrs are what you belive, theres no evidence it coulnt be anythign else., It appears as if all these random numeral facts are a way to make the religious seem believable enough and not just a piece of crap written from some bearded dude.

why hasnt the world ended yet, why do all the beleivers think that its gonna end in thier life time. THis has been thought by many people for centuries until notihng happens and they were proven dead wrong. But now we have a new bunch , who know that the world is comign to an end, its just obsurd, to think so.

 

[chookyn]

hmmm... hell. i think the only people that will endure hell are those that reject Jesus' invitation to heaven. The pain of hell is essentially separation from God and it's a choice - you choose to live separately from God now, that's your choice, that's how it will be forever. No-one is forced to go to hell, it's probably where we'd all be if God didn't step in with a solution. It is our privelige to accept or reject that solution, keeping in mind the possible consequences of our choice.

if it could be possible to get to heaven by a person's merits, no-one would be there because no-one meets the mark. I think that's what's different between Christianity and other religions: other religions are about earning eternal life through 'doing good', whereas Christianity is about receiving it undeserved as a result of God's compassion. Interestingly enough though, there are some Christians who think they can work their way into God's good graces. That type have got their theology screwed up somewhere down the track, because it's simply not the case.

Which brings me to my point. Religion generally is like panning for gold. A majority of the stuff you'll find in it is worthless crap (gravel, fools gold, etc). That's the baggage that humans bring to religion. Don't let it distract you. If you search and be persistent, you'll find gold. Which makes it all worthwhile. Satisfied people who belong to any particular faith group learn to focus on what's pure gold and disregard the BS.

End rant.

 

[ladyknight]

I'm trying to say this really dispassionately- don't generalise with stereotypes. They're exceedingly dangerous. Does anyone remember the Crusades? As long as that 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong' attitude exists, there will always be war, and torture, and wrongful imprisonment, and a minority group that's either wronged or seeking revenge. It's our duty to act responsibly and just for the future. Don't fuck it up.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

I'm trying to say this really dispassionately- don't generalise with stereotypes. They're exceedingly dangerous. Does anyone remember the Crusades? As long as that 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong' attitude exists, there will always be war, and torture, and wrongful imprisonment, and a minority group that's either wronged or seeking revenge. It's our duty to act responsibly and just for the future. Don't fuck it up.

I'm not Christian, the crusades have nothing to do with me, and that's a stupid tu quoqe.

 

[SashatheMan]

pannign fro gold is your metaphore for religioun.? well ill expand on that. Some fools give up everything , all possesions to find this gold, then they mine for weeks , but in the end they find Nothing. They come hope disappointed. Excepct the differnce with religion is that you dont come home when u find nothing, you are already dead and notihng can be changed , your lifeless bosy is buried 6 feet underground.

 

[SashatheMan]

and you say some find gold? how does this translate to religion, what do people find which is that precious to them in this life? i cant think of anythign they get which is can be worthy of the effort people put in.
you can argue that its not in this life , its when they die. But you have no proof that they actually get this reward from god, so the metaphor doesnt make sence, becuase the goldminer find a reward in his lifetime, but a christian supposably onlt finds the reward after they die, a place where noone who is alive has been , therefore has no evidence exists

 

[veterandoggy]

Soha and veterandoggy you produce so much crap out of your mouths, but dotn have anything to support it.

Soha you believe so strongly that islam is the only true religion and that everyone else will go to hell,
http://www.religioustolerance.org/worldrel.gif

using this graph muslims make up only 20 % of relions. Christians have a much higher number, if there really was a god , it would be logical to deduce that the greatest amount of believers would be most right. Islam falls short of numbers and hence would go to hell.

veteraldoggy, you are pulling all these precise numbers out of your behind, eg 1 in every 73 will pass to heaven etc etc, how can you be so certain that the numebrs are what you belive, theres no evidence it coulnt be anythign else., It appears as if all these random numeral facts are a way to make the religious seem believable enough and not just a piece of crap written from some bearded dude.

why hasnt the world ended yet, why do all the beleivers think that its gonna end in thier life time. THis has been thought by many people for centuries until notihng happens and they were proven dead wrong. But now we have a new bunch , who know that the world is comign to an end, its just obsurd, to think so.

sasha, youre a stange fellow...
only 1 out of 1000 people will go to heaven, including everyone to have lived, from adam till the day of resurrection. whoops, im back woith my precise numbers again. why? cos theyre true, or at least for muslims anyway. you dont believe it as you have just shown. oh, and the bearded dude was uneducated,, illiterate, and an orphan from young, so i dont think that he could have popped them out of his head without assistance. would you also call the scientific calls made by the bearded dude pieces of crap too? not to forget that jesus is a bearded dude too, not a business man in a suit with a clean shaven beard, or so your glass panes portray...

 

[veterandoggy]

1. I've seen sheep eat their own shit, and cows poking around it with their noses, I think that is evidence enough.
2,3. What are the effects of heightened levels of such antibodies on the human body, and if they are so bad then why is pork not outlawed by the Australian food authorities?
4. So that's why halal kebab shops still serve hot chips with their kebabs, which are incidently packed with fat?

let me tell you that animals that eat their own excrement, or meat for that matter, of cattle cannot be slaughtered anymore until the substances exit their bodies, i think about a month of so.