Law @USYD vs @UNSW (1 Viewer)

[JaneAustenEnthusiast]

Hey guys,

I'm planning to study Law/Psychology at UNSW or Law/Arts at USYD. I'm very interested in the Law/Psychology degree but I'm worried about UNSW's emphasis on group work.
I'm a highly independent worker and though I don't mind group work, I feel like UNSW over-does it, from what I've heard. I don't like the idea of being judged based on my as well other student's performance.

Nonetheless, I find UNSW incorporates so many opportunities for prac work, internships and career opportunities which is crucial within the competitive sphere of law.

Conversely, I love that USYD allows for independent work. USYD has also offered me guaranteed entry to Law if I get over 90 for my ATAR, but I really dislike the Arts component of Law/Arts. And no other combined degree is appealing (except for Law/Science (Psychology), but I dropped Maths in yr 12 and it allegedly involves 1 full year of Maths). If only USYD offered Law/Psychology!!

So this is my dilemma, and it's really frustrating me. Can anyone tell me what life as a UNSW law student would be like, and is the group work over-done like I've heard? Also, is the Science (Psychology) degree maths-intensive or does it even include maths (other than statistics for psychology).

By the way, I plan to ultimately do humanitarian law, working with refugees and asylum seekers, but I've heard UNSW is only good for commercial law... I fear I'm being fed rumours. Do any of the claims I've mentioned have any truth to them??

 

[Sherlock]

Hi Jane,

You can do an Arts/Law degree at USYD, with a major in Psychology! There are three main ways you can study psych at USYD: through an arts degree, a science degree, or a psych degree. USYD also has a strong focus on international law, so this will also benefit you.

 

[Danoraptor]

A higher proportion of USYD grads are employed at top tier firms than UNSW. Both are very good and the differences in graduate outcomes are minimal.

 

[JaneAustenEnthusiast]

Hi Jane,

You can do an Arts/Law degree at USYD, with a major in Psychology! There are three main ways you can study psych at USYD: through an arts degree, a science degree, or a psych degree. USYD also has a strong focus on international law, so this will also benefit you.

Thanks that's kind of where I was heading

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk

 

[SuchSmallHands]

I haven't done a single group assessment after a year in UNSW law, I don't know where you heard that there's loads of group work but that's not really true (maybe in certain degrees like commerce, but not in psych/law). I really enjoy law here, though it suits a specific type of person. I'm more interested in working in litigation so the seminar style (we don't do lectures and tutes like usyd) works really well for me since it favours the kind of person who wants to focus on verbal expression and confidence. I also really prefer that we have open book exams here (though most law schools do, usyd doesn't). Other than I'd say the two are basically even, with a little more prestige being attached to studying at usyd obviously. Both are good, but both suit a different type of person.

 

[JaneAustenEnthusiast]

I haven't done a single group assessment after a year in UNSW law, I don't know where you heard that there's loads of group work but that's not really true (maybe in certain degrees like commerce, but not in psych/law). I really enjoy law here, though it suits a specific type of person. I'm more interested in working in litigation so the seminar style (we don't do lectures and tutes like usyd) works really well for me since it favours the kind of person who wants to focus on verbal expression and confidence. I also really prefer that we have open book exams here (though most law schools do, usyd doesn't). Other than I'd say the two are basically even, with a little more prestige being attached to studying at usyd obviously. Both are good, but both suit a different type of person.

Thank you for your comment, it's definitely made me re-think. Especially about the lack of open book exams!!

 

[ming mong]

Would there also be a way for you to study actuarial and law together at usyd like at UNSW? There doesn't seem to be a combined like that in usyd lol

 

[harrypotterfan]

I'm currently doing B Science (Psychology)/B Laws at UNSW

In response to some of your concerns: Firstly, I haven't done any group work at all in my first year of law at UNSW (and I don't think that changes). That being said, marks are awarded for class participation which requires you to be able to contribute in a small class setting (consider like a high school class of 30 students, so all the students and the lecturer get to know each other on a pretty personal level). That means you won't be judged per se on how you interact with others, but the learning definitely does take place in an extended group setting. I think the small class sizes and the high volume of readings often means that people make their own groups to share notes with and stuff though.

As for psychology, that in itself is pretty high on group work- but you just have to deal with it I guess. It's definitely not fair sometimes when the whole group gets the same mark for an assessment despite different goals and work habits, but it happens. Group assessments are usually only limited to a maximum of 10-20% anyway, so I don't think you should worry too much about it. If you get the right group it can even be enjoyable! I'd definitely not recommend not pursuing psychology or law purely because of the group work factor (that comes in pretty much in every degree).

As for the maths: psychology will be your major under the degree of science- and science inevitably has maths... so yes there will be maths. That being said, you can always avoid doing pure maths/physics/chemistry (all of which are high in the mathematics components) for your science courses, and for the pure psychology courses the maths is limited to stats and graph interpretation. The statistics can be a bit tricky if you've never dealt with them before, but on the whole I do think the concepts are quite simple and are an extension of the stats you would have done in year 9 and 10 maths. There is a bit of probability but it's presented more qualitatively than quantitatively. Graphs shouldn't be a problem- majority of it is memorising graph shapes and distributions as opposed to any real calculations.

Hope that helps! Let me know if you want anything in more detail


edit: I think UNSW is introducing psychology/law this year? If not, you can always do science (psychology)/laws and then pursue your psych honours after (1 year)

 

[Kolmias]

You should do law at TAFE instead. It gives you real world experience.

 

[kamalpradeep]

This is a question for all Law graduates completed during last few years.

Many people say that it is very difficult to get a job after completing a Law degree if it is not from UNSW or USYD.
I would like to hear from Law graduates about their experience in finding jobs (specially from unemployed Law graduates and their opinion).

 

[Crobat]

This is a question for all Law graduates completed during last few years.

Many people say that it is very difficult to get a job after completing a Law degree if it is not from UNSW or USYD.
I would like to hear from Law graduates about their experience in finding jobs (specially from unemployed Law graduates and their opinion).

It's really just hard full stop.

Graduate employment depends on the individual and what they do to make themselves competitive in preparation for graduate employment. Most firms will take their most, if not all, of their graduates from their clerkship pool that students do in their penultimate year, and the recruitment process for that is 4-5 months long and consists of a written application with separate cover letter/resume, multiple cocktail evenings and 2 interviews with multiple partners and members from HR. This process is no easier simply because you're from UNSW/USYD (there are plenty of students from these unis who miss out as well), but the vast majority of high quality students will come from those 2 unis in NSW because that's where there's a higher concentration of high performing students generally.

To give you an idea, the Law Students' Societies of each uni will host clerkship seminars at uni where firms will visit the campus and give you a spiel about the firm, their work, their values and culture, and what they look for in an applicant. At USYD/UNSW, enough students show up to pack out lecture theatres and more (this is roughly like 400-500 students often). At UTS, the most students we had show up to a seminar was 60 and that was for the top firm in NSW. Evidently there is a huge difference in simply the number of students who even understand how to get graduate employment between the unis, and my personal experience is that only a small handful of students at UTS even bother applying for clerkships/graduate opportunities, much less applying for these opportunities outside of the Big 6 law firms. But this is changing as more students become aware of the process, which is why students from outside of the Go8 unis are slowly becoming better represented at firms after graduation.

Long story short; it's hard to find graduate employment no matter where you are, but your success depends on who you are and what you do to make yourself competitive.