N.A vs F.A big debate (1 Viewer)

[HayleeKate]

I'm arrogant and I dont work hard at all. Nor do i deserve any ability bestowed apon me. Over it. Back to the maths.

In terms of mathematical ability, I'm sure that the best approach to a successful HSC is to work to the utmost limit of your means, and hence to the most with what you've got.

 

[lfc_reds2003]

meaning that YES, you deserve your natural ability. BUT, the ones who work their asses off probably deserve it MORE.

again, this is an unjustified statement... whats to say that if they had natural ability that they woudl work their asses off.. it is what we are gifted with that determines how we act or who we are... so giving these people natural ability would most likely make them slacken off..... so you cannnot work in hypotheticals.

 

[who_loves_maths]

again, this is an unjustified statement... whats to say that if they had natural ability that they woudl work their asses off.. it is what we are gifted with that determines how we act or who we are... so giving these people natural ability would most likely make them slacken off..... so you cannnot work in hypotheticals.

for the words in bold: talking in "what-if"s is you working in hypotheticals.

for the words in italics: that is not right. there are many ppl in the world who are talented but waste their talent in doing something else. i'm surprised you have not known examples of such ppl yet. your natural ability is not a precursor to your hard work... at all. the ppl around you, the ppl you surround yourself with, family, friends, etc... makes a much greater influence (eg. peer pressure, etc..) on your work ethic than most other things.
of course, if you are strong willed, then all that can be overcome. but not all who are naturally endowed are at the same time strong-willed.

 

[HayleeKate]

thats a lot of bigs words lassy, and we're nought but humble pirates. [Captain Barbossa, Pirates of the Carribean, Gore Verbinski, Walt Disney Productions, 2003.]

 

[KFunk]

it is what we are gifted with that determines how we act or who we are... .

In the above spirit of quotes:


"Man is nothing else but what he makes of himself." - Satre

The fact that satre said it doesn't make it right, but I still think it's worth thinking about.

 

[lfc_reds2003]

your natural ability is not a precursor to your hard work... at all. the ppl around you, the ppl you surround yourself with, family, friends, etc... makes a much greater influence (eg. peer pressure, etc..) on your work ethic than most other things.
of course, if you are strong willed, then all that can be overcome. but not all who are naturally endowed are at the same time strong-willed.

Now ur justifying why ppl dont work as hard as they shuld contradicitng ur belief taht those who work harder deserve NA...

how can one be MORE deserving of ability if extraneous circumstances are SO influential ... luck has a big role to play in ur attitude to stdy and so its all in the balance

 

[who_loves_maths]

...apon me. Over it. Back to the maths

and then,

thats a lot of bigs words lassy, and we're nought but humble pirates...

keep your word, and stay with the maths...

 

[lfc_reds2003]

KFunk:

clearly men can make themselves who they want to be sure

The greatest discovery of my generation is that a human being can alter his life by altering his attitudes of mind.
William James

so yes it is the approach that maketh the man

but at our age, the approach varies in large degree according to talent - those with exceptioonal NA can tend to leave it alone and rely on it... thos with some NA work hard on their FA cos they have a glimpse of the top and those with no NA enjoy other fields....

clearly there are exceptions

but approach is largely related to talent - at this stage neway - in later life we may see the light of your Satre comments but HSC yr.... dun think so

but neway in yrs to come the HSC will look like one big joke n frankly a waste of oour worry (unless it already does now)

 

[who_loves_maths]

Originally Posted by aural_sax05
Now ur justifying why ppl dont work as hard as they shuld contradicitng ur belief taht those who work harder deserve NA...

you amuse me. see non-sense and absurdity in your own statement?

YES, i gave reasons as to why ppl don't work as hard as they should when they have the natural ability... so how is that contradicting my belief that those who work harder deserve NA??? lol, you make no sense.

how can one be MORE deserving of ability if extraneous circumstances are SO influential ... luck has a big role to play in ur attitude to stdy and so its all in the balance

luck is not a persistent or stable 'force' in life. those who work hard, work through luck, they work through misfortune, they work through defeat, they work through victory, they work undeterred and they work on... until they reach their target. this is what hard work is. and for that, they deserve the ability that others may innately carry but not use to full potential because they don't work hard.
on the side of the studious and labourious, natural ability can be stretched to the limit and used for the good of all others.
yes there are cases where circumstances may alter this equilibrium. but that is unavoidable and inevitable. that is why society is not necessarily 'balanced' and that is why life is not necessarily 'fair'. so i'll say what i have already said in my last post: talking in "what-if"s is you working in hypotheticals.

 

[wanton-wonton]

you amuse me. see non-sense and absurdity in your own statement?

YES, i gave reasons as to why ppl don't work as hard as they should when they have the natural ability... so how is that contradicting my belief that those who work harder deserve NA??? lol, you make no sense.



luck is not a persistent or stable 'force' in life. those who work hard, work through luck, they work through misfortune, they work through defeat, they work through victory, they work undeterred and they work on... until they reach their target. this is what hard work is. and for that, they deserve the ability that others may innately carry but not use to full potential because they don't work hard.
on the side of the studious and labourious, natural ability can be stretched to the limit and used for the good of all others.
yes there are cases where circumstances may alter this equilibrium. but that is unavoidable and inevitable. that is why society is not necessarily 'balanced' and that is why life is not necessarily 'fair'. so i'll say what i have already said in my last post: talking in "what-if"s is you working in hypotheticals.

I haven't been reading all the previous posts but this debate seems to be getting out of hand here.

The real answer is a little bit of each. You have to be naturally smart, work hard, and you have to have a little bit of luck. And yes, I said LUCK.

 

[lfc_reds2003]

luck is not a persistent or stable 'force' in life. those who work hard, work through luck, they work through misfortune, they work through defeat, they work through victory, they work undeterred and they work on... until they reach their target. this is what hard work is. and for that, they deserve the ability that others may innately carry but not use to full potential because they don't work hard.
on the side of the studious and labourious, natural ability can be stretched to the limit and used for the good of all others.

talking in "what-if"s is you working in hypotheticals.

please your whole THEY obsession about the perfect HSC crusading candidate is a what if.......



Also, you quite clearly contradict yourself:


first you sed that the harder workers deserve NA more than those who dont work

then you say.... but wait a minute, people who work hard are those that are pushed by their friends or family or who are strong - willed enough to fight their demons.....


so, by equating, you think that those who are pushed to work, or those that can work throuh all the hardships, deserve NA........

again your disrupting the cosmic and karmic balance by saying this

you create new situations that dont exist and wont exist for A REASON
as NA ia such a corrupting force against FA

so leave YOUR hypotheticals about who studies and hence who deserves NA and stick to creating a novel about the perfect HSC student that you clearly know so much about !

 

[lfc_reds2003]

Please involve urself steele ... if ur game (as ur always r...)

 

[withoutaface]

Forced ability alone will not get you more than low 90s in 4u, believe me I tried.

 

[who_loves_maths]

Original Posted by aural_sax05
then you say.... but wait a minute, people who work hard are those that are pushed by their friends or family or who are strong - willed enough to fight their demons.....

isn't just so annoying when ppl post criticisms without even reading what they are criticising?! i'm not going to refute what you've said, because it'll be a waste of both of our time...
all i can say is this: read what i wrote on this topic again, carefully this time plz. you'll notice that my mention of family, friends, etc... is NOT a justification FOR the hard work of ppl without n.a.
it's a justification FOR the LACK of hard work of those who are already naturally talented...

for your visual convenience:

Originally Posted by who_loves_maths
there are many ppl in the world who are talented but waste their talent in doing something else. i'm surprised you have not known examples of such ppl yet. your natural ability is not a precursor to your hard work... at all. the ppl around you, the ppl you surround yourself with, family, friends, etc... makes a much greater influence (eg. peer pressure, etc..) on your work ethic than most other things.

i highlighted the important words/phrase for you... all you have to do is synthesis the meaning in your head... what exactly was i saying?

plz DO NOT post casually again on this topic until you have actually understood or seen my argument. you'll only be making fun of yourself.