the dismissal of the "unconventional" (1 Viewer)

[ilovenudge]

It angers and frustrates me immensely that despite the fact that in the macro art world contemporary art or as some people like to term it, "unconventional art", ie installations is a highly valued imaginative art form, in my class my artwork (based on the work of Dadists) is disregarded and marginalised by my peers. It is interesting to note that there is still an inclination to dismiss the unorthodox means of artistic expression, despite the turn after Modernism and the beginnings of fresh methods of artistic practice It appears some people still prefer faithful representations of the visible world, that which is recognisable and tangible. What is also interesting though, is that despite the disregard that my artworks receive from classmates and even my friends who know nothing about artI have still attained the top mark for it I am ranked first in the class

Possibly it is just my class however,does anybody else using supposed "unconventional" practices have the same experience? Or does anybody have any comments about the notion of the "unconventional" in art? I don't believe there is oneit's all relative to the individual.

 

[tash]

art is so subjective i think that for everyone to like a particular type of art is impossible. i think that people who don't do art or don't know much about it don't really like it because they don't understand it and would rather look at something they can recognise and understand. and i think painting/drawing realistic things is slightly more impressive and appears (though not necessarily true) to have more effort put into it.

i used to dislike postmodern art cos i thought it wasn't 'art' and it was crappy but i've gradually come to accept it more after i tried to define what art was, though i stil don't like some forms of conceptual art cos i think it's (ironically) pointless.

The girl who's top in our class does textures and more modernistic work and it's really good. i think that you can't really dismiss people's work if you can't do it yourself

 

[DC10]

Originally posted by tash
i think that you can't really dismiss people's work if you can't do it yourself

That's correct, e.g. in my art class, all the students all have mutual respects to each other in artmaking

and i guess the artworld is so big that currently there is no one single technique employed. most of the artists still look to the past for inspirations

 

[Smarty_pants!]

I think you just hit the spot!

Originally posted by DC10
most of the artists still look to the past for inspirations [/B]

And that...my dear....is not only the basis of art making practice throughout history...but also the entire guts of the HSC VA course, theory and practical. Artists look to the past, either in appropriation of works, inspiration and themes, or in pure material practice.
Someone great, know idea who, said that there are no new ideas, just old idea rehashed. That concept applies to ALL art forms, not just visual arts.

Keep looking to the past....and keep looking beyond the conventional. There is such thing as conventional art....just look at all the highly technique based works your class mates have created-based on realism and conventions-but not devalued for being so.
Unconventional art is not just contemporary works. It all depends on the context; just look at Picasso...he was unconventional then...but do we still see him as unconventional now?....
...Yes we do....and forever will do.
I think the real guts of art in the past 100 years, has not been about art movements, or convention breaking, but about the process of doing so. A constant time of change, where one time of art has blended seemlessly with the next...

The major difference between now, contemporary art, and then, rennaissance art, is that art is now in perpetual change. During the rennaissance, which lasted for around 100 years, change was slow, although noticeable, and art stayed in one place for a long time....not stagnant...though ever so slowly swirling....

Well theres my thoughts for the day....

mwaa to you all, and good luck with your trails!

 

[saladsurgery]

don't get discouraged -- stick with your idea if you believe in it. my work last year was a bit 'unconventional'/different -- but i really enjoyed working on it and felt connected with my theme, which may not have happened if i were doing something to satisfy the expectations of friends/classmates/art teachers. luckily, most of my classmates were either supportive of, or at the worst, indifferent to my work.

however, most of the people in my class dismissed alot of the new/postmodern/unconventional art that we studied in art theory -- work by the dadaists, conceptualists and some of the young british artists, for example. often the argument they cited was along the lines of "i could've done that, it's just 2 red rectangles on a black rectangle". the key thing to remember is that they didn't, and this artist did. it's easy to devalue alot of this type of art without considering the thought processes/concept/idea behind works.

my personal belief/theory is that nonrepresentational/abstract art is often the most important type. i believe one of the primary functions of art now is to present new ideas, challenge/confront standards and beliefs, and give visual/nonvisual representation to ideas, concepts, thoughts et cetera. art is no longer centered around the aesthetic, i think. some people lament this, but the shift towards conceptualism in contemporary postmodern art is something that i'm really excited about.

hmm. that's all i can think to say at the moment. good luck with it.

 

[johnson]

fark salad you can be so smart when you want to be

I completely agree with you- except for this one bit :

it's easy to devalue alot of this type of art without considering the thought processes/concept/idea behind works.

it's true, often people who are 'un-educated' in art theory don't realise that there are many other factors which make an artwork 'art', apart from just aestheticism. But with the rectangles stuff (was that mondrian? the de stijl movement? argh it's been way too long!) that was more like a Modernist movement which merely challenged what art could be- put simply, they were trying to piss off the artworld by saying "Art can be anything I want it to be.

Okay, I just realised I proved that you were right, never mind.

personally, i think that art is really starting to develop only now..i'm particularly fascinated by how asian artists are finally starting to take a stance away from traditional roots, and starting to gain more contemporary practices in their artmaking. (especially the japanese culture, who've had a myriad of crazy western influences as a result of WWII)

i used to be one of those wankers who used to sit in class and say "this is bullshit art, let's move on" but i think that once I myself started to make this so-called 'bullshit art' i began to respect it much more.

 

[johnson]

I've always wondered where art was going to move in the 21st century.. it's incredibly hard to predict the future.. now that we've gone through the traditional art, then modernism, and now we are gradually getting sick of post-modernism.....where are we going to go from here?

the other week i read in some magazine that we are returning to 'traditional roots' , specifically in australia (like colonial landscape oil paintings and the like) , i reckon that's bullshit cos no matter how much we try to return to traditional art, it will never happen because the artworld has changed so much that, as salad boy said, our most important aim in artmaking these days is to challenge people, to confront us with realities (or un-realities).

which, in my opinion, 'traditional' art does not do

anyway fuck i should stop rambling

 

[DC10]

my teacher said to the whole class that currently artists alike are looking back to previous artmovements for inspiration and the postmodern thing is sort of wearing off.... :mad1:

 

[Smarty_pants!]

We cannot yet, without a vast space of time between us and the beginning of the Post modern, have a retrospective view of when postmodernism ended, and contemporary art began. When picasso was painting his true cubist works, he was not saying, 'oh look at me i'm a cubist', all he was trying to do was break the past....and he did that. We call ourselves contemporary artists, but in 20 years time, the art world will have developed a name for the movement we currently find ouselves in, without knowing that we are in it. Does that make sense?
People are always trying to label things; art in particular, it helps thm understand it. Imagin if we had nothing to call surrealism....Would it make any sense at all? i doubt it, but by giving it a label, we can make sense of it and therefore use it to talk about art. Like the label 'unconventional', its there so that art critics, and us, the art students, can talk about it with some kind of system, we can say that contemporary art is unconventional because it attempts to decontruct many of teh notions about art and artists. That is why it i label....its just a system...and it does not have to be adhered to....but its easier to follow it....it gives us a concept to link art and artists to. Without the system we would have nothing to hang our essays on! I'll break the system once i finish my HSC....OK? Will you follow me? probably, cos art will change, and you will want t change too....and that change will involve the breaking of a system!

 

[tash]

Originally posted by johnson

i used to be one of those wankers who used to sit in class and say "this is bullshit art, let's move on" but i think that once I myself started to make this so-called 'bullshit art' i began to respect it much more.

lol that was me too until my i thought 'if it isn't art, then what is it?' and i can't really define what art is so i had to accept it as a form of art.
yeah how weird is that, thinking how art could somehow change in the future. and youre thinking 'but how can it change? haven't we done everything already?' cos art can't really develop any more can it cos there's no limits as to what you can do like there used to be.

i have a question: not being a full contemporary conceptual etc artist myself, do you get any satisfaction from drawing a couple of squares on a canvas? i mean, when i've finished a painting or whatever i can look at my work and feel like i've actually done something but if i just draw a squiggle it feels like nothing. but i suppose i have no meaning within that. tell me if i'm wrong, i don't know

 

[johnson]

Originally posted by Smarty_pants!
We call ourselves contemporary artists, but in 20 years time, the art world will have developed a name for the movement we currently find ouselves in, without knowing that we are in it. Does that make sense?
People are always trying to label things; art in particular, it helps thm understand it.
I'll break the system once i finish my HSC....OK? Will you follow me? probably, cos art will change, and you will want t change too....and that change will involve the breaking of a system!

Yeah, you're right smarty pants- since we are essentially creating history right now (in terms of the art world) it's impossible to label ourselves until our particular movement/style has died out. then people will go "hey, what happened to the so-and-so's". but I think the thing is, that now, we really don't have one particular style- we are influecnced and inspired by such a variety of crap that we can no longer be really unified together as a collective of artists..

though, if u think ab out it, it's probably been the same for all of time- i'm sure there were other styles going on at the same time as, say, the dadaists, or surrealists- its just that those were the most important of the time, so that's why we know the most about them.

haha, are you doing something art-related in your uni studies smarty pants?

 

[johnson]

Originally posted by tash
i have a question: not being a full contemporary conceptual etc artist myself, do you get any satisfaction from drawing a couple of squares on a canvas?

hmm, see, 'satisfaction'is such a subjective word..

personally, with an artwork, i have a certain initial aim/objective.

If I fulfil that aim/objective when I have finished my artwork, then I am 'satisfied'.. does that make any sense..?

So, for example, the rectangle artists.. they set out to demolish the boundaries of art and make a stance saying that art can be anything that we want it to be..

In my opinion, they achieved that.

 

[Smarty_pants!]

yes i am going to do something art related at uni...

haha, are you doing something art-related in your uni studies smarty pants?[/QUOTE]

Yes i am...but what exactly i am not sure....i plan to do a BA at sydney, majoring in art theory and english litt....then a post grad in public relations....i hope to end up working for an art gallery....or an art magazine.

Whatever happens tho....i'll always make artworks....forever...its just wot i do!

 

[tash]

Originally posted by johnson
hmm, see, 'satisfaction'is such a subjective word..

personally, with an artwork, i have a certain initial aim/objective.

If I fulfil that aim/objective when I have finished my artwork, then I am 'satisfied'.. does that make any sense..?

So, for example, the rectangle artists.. they set out to demolish the boundaries of art and make a stance saying that art can be anything that we want it to be..

In my opinion, they achieved that.

ok i get that. makes sense and possibly will help my further acceptance of that form of art

 

[saladsurgery]

stuckism.
http://www.stuckism.com/

art movement founded by billy childish, ex-boyfriend of postmodern british artist tracy emin, as a reaction to the percieved downfall/degredation of the wider visual arts world (re. new british artists, postmodernism, damien hirst and so on).

personally i think art now is more exciting than it's ever been, but it's still worth checking that site out, i think.

 

[Tyler Durden]

No respect in my class... everyone bitchy and backstabbing ppl, whispering and name calling! Grow Up!

I dont give a shit, it's all good, they can do watever they want, and get whatever mark they get... wont stop me, I aint complaining! it's all good!