The Education Access Scheme is BS (2 Viewers)

[kami]

Youth Allowance does actually take into account your immediate families income. You cannot recieve youth allowance if your parents earn over a certain amount

http://www.centrelink.gov.au/intern...05a2a008f51bc951ca25700b0014c1af!OpenDocument
Thats only in some cases - such as if you have declared yourself independent, most don't require a measure of their parents income.

Your payment and the amount you are paid can be affected by things including:
your parents' income and assets (in some cases)

Your family and you can still maintain an equitable lifestyle regardless of you being in receipt of youth allowance.

 

[Lainee]

http://www.centrelink.gov.au/intern...05a2a008f51bc951ca25700b0014c1af!OpenDocument
Thats only in some cases - such as if you have declared yourself independent, most don't require a measure of their parents income.

What are you trying to say? Being independent isn't really an option for people who want to apply for EAS. To be independent you need to have been out of school >1.5 years and working full-time >30 hrs a week. Either that or you're an orphan, in state care or have parents who 'cannot exercise their responsibilities'.

Someone who falls into any of those categories would be most deserving of EAS. There is a reason they don't take into account your parent's income to award you Youth Allowance when you don't have parents to begin with.

 

[Lainee]

Your family and you can still maintain an equitable lifestyle regardless of you being in receipt of youth allowance.

Equitable to what? To someone who doesn't live in government housing, have the stigma of not being able to afford a computer at home, have parents who have 2 jobs each and work from dawn to dusk to pay the essential bills at home, have to look after siblings at home because cannot afford childcare... Can you stand there and say that a poor student isn't disadvantaged against a richer one?

 

[kami]

What are you trying to say? Being independent isn't really an option for people who want to apply for EAS. To be independent you need to have been out of school >1.5 years and working full-time >30 hrs a week. Either that or you're an orphan, in state care or have parents who 'cannot exercise their responsibilities'.

Someone who falls into any of those categories would be most deserving of EAS. There is a reason they don't take into account your parent's income to award you Youth Allowance when you don't have parents to begin with.

What I am trying to say is that ultimately I disagree with your stance that receipt of Youth Allowance indicates an impoverished lifestyle during study and thus anyone in receipt of such a payment should be benefited by the EAS scheme for that reason alone. While there are cases your parents income does need to be tested, the threshold (if I'm reading it correctly) indicates that each parent may earn around $30, 000 a year and may have just over half a million dollars in assets, also there do exist those outside this need for testing. To then recieve Youth Allowance in conjunction with your families does not seem a fair reason on its own to bestow Youth Allowance. If someone has other factors in their life whether financial, domestic or health related then I can most certainly agree with the reasoning, but for someone to recieve something just because they have Youth Allowance seems as valid as bestowing someone with EAS because they have a disability pension instead of having a disability - one can help prove the other but its not the disability pension that is the hindrance.

Equitable to what? To someone who doesn't live in government housing, have the stigma of not being able to afford a computer at home, have parents who have 2 jobs each and work from dawn to dusk to pay the essential bills at home, have to look after siblings at home because cannot afford childcare... Can you stand there and say that a poor student isn't disadvantaged against a richer one?

Yes I can. I am a 'poor student', I do not live in housing commision, and in the past I suffered the 'stigma' of lacking a computer. I also attended a TAFE rather than a school which required me to buy all of my own textbooks unlike many school students. So I can most certainly say I know what I'm talking about.

And most certainly because I know what I am talking about, I know that my health condition is far worse, and that in reality the lack of money is next to nothing when compared to needing to be drugged up on medication 24/7 and not being able to concentrate the way everyone else did, or have to drop a subject because they couldn't make allowances for my health.

 

[Casmira]

Hah, I'm looking at psychology:


B Psychology
Non-Access CSP: 95.05
Access CSP: 94.20 <<
Non-Access DFEE: 91.95
Access DFEE: 86.05 <<

Bugger them. I'm still putting it on my prefs anyway and going to hope I get it (if I don't get into Sydney, of course).

Is it easier to transfer between uni's or degree's? because I was thinking I could do any degree at UNSW and then transfer to commerce but is it more feasible to do a business-type degree at like macquarie then transfer ... because I really REALLY liked the UNSW campus

 

[Lainee]

Yes I can. I am a 'poor student', I do not live in housing commision, and in the past I suffered the 'stigma' of lacking a computer. I also attended a TAFE rather than a school which required me to buy all of my own textbooks unlike many school students. So I can most certainly say I know what I'm talking about.

And most certainly because I know what I am talking about, I know that my health condition is far worse, and that in reality the lack of money is next to nothing when compared to needing to be drugged up on medication 24/7 and not being able to concentrate the way everyone else did, or have to drop a subject because they couldn't make allowances for my health.

I'm really sorry to hear about your health. But I think if what you say is true, you of all people should realise how unfair it is to have others underestimate how your difficulties affects your studies.

What I am trying to say is that ultimately I disagree with your stance that receipt of Youth Allowance indicates an impoverished lifestyle during study and thus anyone in receipt of such a payment should be benefited by the EAS scheme for that reason alone. While there are cases your parents income does need to be tested, the threshold (if I'm reading it correctly) indicates that each parent may earn around $30, 000 a year and may have just over half a million dollars in assets, also there do exist those outside this need for testing. To then recieve Youth Allowance in conjunction with your families does not seem a fair reason on its own to bestow Youth Allowance. If someone has other factors in their life whether financial, domestic or health related then I can most certainly agree with the reasoning, but for someone to recieve something just because they have Youth Allowance seems as valid as bestowing someone with EAS because they have a disability pension instead of having a disability - one can help prove the other but its not the disability pension that is the hindrance.

How else are you going to prove to the EAS board that you're disabled then? Isn't the easiest way to show that you receive a disability pension and thus you have satisfied the criteria for that, which therefore means you are disabled. Doesn't mean people who don't receive the pension are not disabled, but the pension proves paper proof that you've been maimed in an accident.

Or do you need to once again fill in an income test specially designed for by the EAS board to prove that you and your family are really suffering financially? For the sake of efficiency, I don't think this is necessary - the Youth Allowance shows that you have varying amounts of financial need. And that's enough proof to show that you suffer financially.

I understand that you're saying receiving Youth Allowance alone isn't enough for EAS, and I have to disagree. Youth Allowance is proof of financial suffering, and financial suffering is, or can be, as bad as physical illness.

 

[kami]

How else are you going to prove to the EAS board that you're disabled then? Isn't the easiest way to show that you receive a disability pension and thus you have satisfied the criteria for that, which therefore means you are disabled. Doesn't mean people who don't receive the pension are not disabled, but the pension proves paper proof that you've been maimed in an accident.

Or do you need to once again fill in an income test specially designed for by the EAS board to prove that you and your family are really suffering financially? For the sake of efficiency, I don't think this is necessary - the Youth Allowance shows that you have varying amounts of financial need. And that's enough proof to show that you suffer financially.

I understand that you're saying receiving Youth Allowance alone isn't enough for EAS, and I have to disagree. Youth Allowance is proof of financial suffering, and financial suffering is, or can be, as bad as physical illness.

Whilst a disability pension can prove you have been recognised as having a disability, it doesn't directly prove on how you have been impacted by it. I also think that it would be a good idea for there to be a means test performed to UAC standards - it would ensure both that those who don't truly need it were sifted out and the larger amount of data would mean that many who cannot detail their impairments sufficiently won't be left out because they couldn't write a certain way - UAC could literally see for themselves.

And on your last point whilst I can understand your reasoning, I don't share it and I doubt I will in the immediate future so I suppose it would be better if we simply agreed to disagree.

 

[Lainee]

Whilst a disability pension can prove you have been recognised as having a disability, it doesn't directly prove on how you have been impacted by it.

You're right, but that's what a personal statement is for. It's space for you to explain how it has disadvantaged you. The pension is just a way for them to verify that yes you do have a disability, but beyond that it's up to the applicant to specify to what extent this affects your study.

I also think that it would be a good idea for there to be a means test performed to UAC standards - it would ensure both that those who don't truly need it were sifted out and the larger amount of data would mean that many who cannot detail their impairments sufficiently won't be left out because they couldn't write a certain way - UAC could literally see for themselves.

That's possibly a better way of doing it. But no matter how you put it, the EAS is awarded based on a subjective analysis of whether you deserve it based on your application. To reduce it to a mathematical comparison of data will have it's own problems.

 

[djravine]

I still don't know why i didn't get in. I explained, hell i ellaborated how sick i was on the form even greater. I gave reports by specialists and doctors. Blah...

Lets just say, the EAS is easy to abuse.

 

[lala2]

Poor all of you! I hope you'll find alternate ways of getting into the course you want. What will you guys be doing now? Are your UAIs high enough for a DFEE paying course? Or transferring could always be another option? Whatever happens, good on you for braving this year through, even if you have been very, very unfarily disadvantaged by the system. Ii'm sure you guys will succeed in life--things like this always make people stronger and that's who the real survivors are.

 

[asscookie]

Hmm.... i thought you couldnt use EAS with DFEE... ?

I know USYD doesn't let EAS people apply for DFEE courses, but UNSW seems to think it's alright...

I don't see how most successful EAS applicants could comfortably take a DFEE place anyway. It's not just the people applying for EAS under the financial disadvantage code. A few of the other codes would include people who've had to divert large portions of their income and savings into ongoing appointments with medical specialists, or lawyers/barristers - either of which can easily add up to tens of thousands of dollars within the space of a few months.


I think it's almost cruel to have EAS DFEE places, as if the original DFEE cutoffs aren't low enough already

 

[minushuman]

I got in under EAS for going to a shit school, basically the way I figure it, i'm much more deserving of UAI assistancing then you are djravine. You should be happy that you're alive, not worrying about your career.

On the otherhand, my school places 2nd last in its region, and we only did that well because we had a couple of morons get band 6's in their native (and posisbly only spoken) langauge like arabic, persian and terrorist.

 

[Danoz The Great]

You should be happy that you're alive, not worrying about your career.

I'm sure that he is not thinking like that.
His illness has affected his marks, no question about that.

On the otherhand, my school places 2nd last in its region, and we only did that well because we had a couple of morons get band 6's in their native (and posisbly only spoken) langauge like arabic, persian and terrorist.

And the need to be so politically incorrect was...?

(Not to mention bumping an old thread)

 

[elisabeth]

If you wanted to do well in that shit school, you could have. I think dj is just as, if not more so deserving of eas.

 

[minushuman]

Sarcasm and hyperbole are totally lost on you people. What are you fucking mentally retarded or something?

I could go through my post more slowly if need be, point out all the subtle intricacies (yeah I can't spell, I went to a piss poor school).

And the need to be so politically incorrect was...?
(Not to mention bumping an old thread)

I like bumping old threads. Also, one of those people is now being investigated because of alleged links with an Australian Al Qaida cell.

If you wanted to do well in that shit school, you could have. I think dj is just as, if not more so deserving of eas.

Having never been to my school you are in no position to say that.

 

[elisabeth]

Far too many people are quick to blame their school when a substaintial amount of effort could have compensated for poor resources and not such good teaching. And hell, if you didn't have a very bright year, it should have been even easier to get top rankings in your subjects, which mean you can contol your HSC mark. What other problems did you have?

 

[minushuman]

Far too many people are quick to blame their school when a substaintial amount of effort could have compensated for poor resources and not such good teaching. And hell, if you didn't have a very bright year, it should have been even easier to get top rankings in your subjects, which mean you can contol your HSC mark. What other problems did you have?

Believe me, my 92.25 was complete self tuition, except funnily enough for english ext2 which I got a 49/50, my teacher proofread my story once so I can't say that was all me. Anywho, basically i'm pissed because UNSW don't consider my EAS at all, apparently (despite what the UAC believes) being in a priority funded school doesn't cut it for them. If I had of known that I would of bothered filling out other sections of the EAS...

 

[elisabeth]

That's what I'm saying though, you have done well with little assistence and that's admirable. My comment is with the people who aren't prepared to put in any of that self-tuition and instead blame their poor marks on a crap school, failing to acknowledge that it's mostly up to you.

 

[reggina_calcio]

Am I the only one that finds the rort that is DFEE more concerning than the handful of people who seemingly get unfair advantages via the EAS?

 

[Nefertari]

If anything, those who get EAS are at a disadvantage to begin with: they don't have access to many schools with the reputaion of the selective ones, and there's not a hell of a lot of universities outside the major population areas. It's designed to give everyone a level footing, not advantage some at the expense of others.

Yet most major universities do not see that excuse as sufficient. I do not know any who got EAS from UTS, USYD or UNSW due to going to a school on the priority funded list.