Thoughts regarding Capital Punishment (2 Viewers)

[soha]

i say and eye for an eye..a tooth for a tooth so on and so forth
to an extent
but we are all going to die anyways arent we..so doesnt really matter it you kill them or not
as long as they dont have the opportunity to do it again
but i like the idea of public beheadings in saudi arabia
i dont think you would be stupid enough to commit such a crime when you know what you are in for if you get caught
and thats the whole point...

 

[flipsyde]

I think its wrong to take a life whther you think they deserve it or not, and no matter how bad it was. I mean Ive even said to myself about people " They dont deserve to live" yet what woul you rather if someone had murdered someone close to you? would you rather them 'go to sleep' or forever rott in hell. Plus jail in a sense aims to rehabilitate (heh read my Raw essay Im not going into it).

Who are we to play god and deserves who lives and who doesnt?

I can see some of the upsides but what it voils down to is that CAPITAL PUNISHMENT IS WRONG.!

 

[Monkey Butler]

From a legal standpoint, capital punishment is illegal under international law, but that's never stopped anyone in the past, so it's kind of a moot point. Also, tattoodguy, nobody has a "right" to own a gun. You own one because you want to kill people with it, and to a certain extent the government ackowledges your fear for your own safety and the safety of other, but that doesn't give you the "right" to own something that'll blow out a wall if you want it to. That's not self defence, retribution or protection - it's unadultered violence, and that is definitely not sanctioned by the government. So don't complain that your "right" to own a gun is being violated by having automatic and semi-automatic weapons banned.

I'm against capital punishment (you probably could've already guessed), although I understand the points for it, without really accepting them. First of all, capital punishment has been proven to be no real deterrant for murderers (somebody mentioned the idea of public executions - if they're still going on then murder still obviously occurs, and the public executions obviously aren't working). Secondly, as has already been said, capital punishment offers no margin for error, and no chance for rehabilitation. Thirdly, how can you possibly put a price on the life of a human being? Saying that it costs $X a year and that that money could be better spent elsewhere is offensive - what about people on life support? They haven't committed any crime, but when it comes down to it, they're both still people. And finally, the idea of "retribution" for the families of victims is bullshit. It's not retribution, it's an acceptance of bloodlust and vengeance. If you desire to murder someone, that makes you one tiny step away from being a murderer yourself, state-sanctioned or not.

 

[tattoodguy]

monkey butler.........u sound smart..........what do you do??????? work? study?


you shuold have the right to own a gun man.........like, you should have the right to protect urself.......froma moral point of view................alll ppple should have a right to protect themselves.

it offends me.....the governemt............tires to make just possessing a gun a serious crime............................that shouldnt be a crime...............that doesnt hurt anyone. many pple have a gun simply for protection..........yet u get put in jail for 6 months etc.....................or maybe even more............just for owning a gun.................thats immmmoral.

its so painfully obvious....................the police cant protect people.

its so offensive..the police....................waste so many resources chasing ppple who arnt hurting anyone...........ie..........ppple at raves taking drugs.........and then.......serious criminals are holding ppple up...bashing ppple etc......cos the police cant priorotise cos they are morons.

the police are fucked..............if they dont want to protect ppple and they want to harrassss.........citizens who arnt hurting anyone and leave the rest of us to fend for ourselfs.................they shouldnt bitch......when pppple have guns for protection.

 

[neo o]

I recognise that :

1) Capital punishment is not an appropriate detterant, it's been shown rather conclusively that chances of getting caught, not the punishment itself deters would be criminals.

However, for those preaching about accuracy etc, on average the majority of death row inmates spend 10 years on death row, more than enough time for any potentially contradictory evidence to surface.

 

[thorrnydevil]

I actually agree with Monkey Butler on the gun issue. Guns are totally ridiculous. Its fair enough for farmers to own a gun, and police officers to carry one, but for somebody to have an uzi or M-16 in their home is just stupid. Use America as an example. Their second right on the Bill of Rights is to own a gun...and look how fucked up they are.

 

[joujou_84]

im with her ------> *points to soha*......if the punsihment for killing someone was public beheading....i imagine the killing rates would decrease dramatically....

 

[neo o]

I actually agree with Monkey Butler on the gun issue. Guns are totally ridiculous. Its fair enough for farmers to own a gun, and police officers to carry one, but for somebody to have an uzi or M-16 in their home is just stupid. Use America as an example. Their second right on the Bill of Rights is to own a gun...and look how fucked up they are.

Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

 

[Xayma]

Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

While true, automatic and semi-automatic weapons make it easier to kill high numbers. Considering there is no need for them in regular life having them only able to kill 5 people is better then having them able to kill 25.

 

[budj]

Yes see that is the arguement that is difficult. You cannot implace a value on life, but can we judge what is more morally correct? Correct me if im wrong, because obviously i know shit all about the legal system, but don't prisoners have to be givensome saught of civil rights, like decent clothes or stuff, which would cost money. And for high security prisons, like that which housed ivan milat, wouldnt that cost heaps to maintain?

See im not really sure of my decision yet. Whether capital is good or bad. Perhaps it is better in some cases. Like that of Milat. He brutally murdered many, no remorse, and it is pretty much ascertained that he did it yeah? Therefore there couldn't be many appeals because the evidence is black and white against him. So if you put him to sleep, then transfer what money would of been funded by tax payers ( i think), to support him for say, 50 more years or so, to another cause, which would promote life, not jut prolong it, wouldn't that be a better usage.

Its really contenscious, beacase on one side you are actually choosing to be god by saying, on this date you will die, and on the other, you are prolonging a life which, as i think it was Soha that made the point, will die no matter what, beause obviously he wont be released.

 

[thorrnydevil]

Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

Yeah, but a five foot man with an overload of testosterone cant kill someone unless he has a gun.

 

[superbird]

capital punishment is a no no. there have been a number of cases where people who are truly innocent have been sentenced to death. although not resulting in a death sentence, a good example is the Chamberlain case. She was first found guilty and she spent three years in jail fighting for an appeal. If a death sentence had been imposed, she may have been executed even though she was truly innocent.

 

[superbird]

on a side note, personally i believe the criminal would suffer more spending life in jail than execution.

 

[jm1234567890]

reminds me of the green mile

nah, capital pinishment should be avoided as long it can be afforded.

 

[Cape]

I don't think that capital punishment should be introduced cause if it was and someone was sentenced to death for say serial killings, it would be an easy escape from the consequences. Lock them up for life instead and let them live with what they did ... that way i feel that the punishment is much more severe.

 

[thorrnydevil]

I don't think that capital punishment should be introduced cause if it was and someone was sentenced to death for say serial killings, it would be an easy escape from the consequences. Lock them up for life instead and let them live with what they did ... that way i feel that the punishment is much more severe.

Yeah!!! Let them get locked up for life and get parole in 40!!!

 

[ohne]

The jury can often get it wrong. Lindy chamberlain could have faced the death penalty if there was one. She would have been executed. Later it was found that she was convicted in an unsafe manner.

I'm not for the death penalty however some of Australian's worst killers deserve the death penalty. Milat and the nutcase from tassie are among the most recent. Not for retribution but for the families of the victims. I think it would be hard to be a loved one of a victim. However I hope society doesnt drift back into 'an eye for an eye' and self methods of 'justice'...

The fact is Milat and other are never to be released....There was an 'Australian story' doco on the milat family on the ABC a few weeks ago. It is nuts to see that some of them feel that he is innocent :\

it is true that people like ivan millat and martin bryant cannot be released as they would likely kill again (in millat's case there is no doubt). neither of them show any remorse for their crimes and millat is obviously in denial.

while i obviously can't speak for victims, personally i don't think capital punishment is the way to go. i don't think killing the person who killed in the first place solves the problem. in my opinion it is not a lot better than the first killing. if the murderer did show remorse, i think i could somehow forgive them, but it is difficult to speculate when one has not experienced such things

if millat were to be executed then we would never know the full story. i guess there is still a chance that one day he will come clean and say what really happened, if he was executed there would be no chance of this. millat honestly saying what happened is the only way we canl find out how many people he killed and other more grusome details and where bodies are located

i saw the ABC documentary....very interesting...there was also another one on one of the commercial channels shortly before that...it's quite scary that the judge thought he did not act alone.

 

[tattoodguy]

i respect ....murderers..........who.....................in other countries............they killed ppple etc......and.........are are going to be sentenced to death...

and they are happpy to die.....for there crimes like..........timothy mcveigh or the bali bombers.

"i deserve to die and im happpy to die...........im proud of what i did"..........its a good attitude.

they are never defeated....


timothy mcveigh "my head is bloodied but unbowed" - sick cunt.

 

[tattoodguy]

its funny how.....................police shoot ppple with nives etc.

but if we did it.....................we would probably be in jail.................thats fucking funny, and how police are the ones who arrest us for it...............fucking hypocrites.

its funny how police think they have a right to carrry guns and own guns and shooot pppple..................but we cant have guns to defend ourselves.......................and its actually a serious crime to have a gun to defend urself.......

thats fucking funnny -------------------- mroe civilians are killed than police......................a life is a life..........all life is precious...........we should avhe the right to defend ourselfs.........................not just those who have a badge and wear a uniform.

If a cop had a baton and u shoot him............u get in big shit..................u have a baton..and a cop kills u................nothing happens........................what a fucked up society.

 

[Monkey Butler]

Tattoodguy - thanks for saying I sound smart. I'm hoping to go into law, so this is something that's pretty important to me.

I suppose it's fair enough that people want to defend themselves. However, there's still no need for higher calibre (is that right? I know shit all about guns) weapons to be owned by regular people in the name of self-defence. I mean, you hear about people in America being able to buy a gun over the counter that is almost identical to those being used by soldiers in Iraq. That's just stupid, no private individual needs to "protect" themselves that much. There's also the trade-off between protection and the fostering of a peaceful society. A society in which everyone owns a gun is a society in which nobody trusts each other, which makes conflict all the more likely to occur.

And when it comes down to it, there are five purposes for the punishment of criminals:
Reintegrative Shaming (as in, making them ashamed of what they've done so that they can re-enter society; similar to rehabilitation), Retribution for victim/victim's family, Rehabilitation, Deterrance and Incapacitation (I'm pretty sure I've listed these before somewhere). Capital punishment arguably only fulfills one of those criteria. How is it then a suitable punishment?

EDIT: Tattoodguy, reading your last couple of posts, you obviously have major problems with the cops. I can understand your issues, but you have to understand that the cops are people too, and they're just as likely to be afraid of someone waving a weapon (a gun, knife, stick, whatever) at them as anyone else. Think about it - you're a regular person, if someone came at you with a knife and you were carrying a gun, would you use it? And it's potentially worse for the cops, because the uniform can actually attract violence. In the end, cops are trying to keep the peace, which is why it's such a big deal to kill a cop. They aren't supposed to try to kill people (but you'll always get dickheads sometimes I suppose), and they DO get in trouble if they deliberately kill someone, but in the end, cops are people too, and they're probably bloody scared at the thought of having to confront people who want to, and would, kill them.