VSU and you - real choice or the end of campus life? (2 Viewers)

[banco55]

i'm not sure which specific services you're referring too, but it appears to be a narrow minded view of things. just because it doesn't appeal to you, doesn't make it inherently 'worthless'
the credibility of the universities is weighted by these 'worthless' extra-curricular services currently funded by the union. it would be a shame to diminish the quality of our unis because of this heavy handed policy.

The credibility of a uni has virtually nothing to do with whether or not it offers childcare, counselling, healthcare or boondoggles for feminist/homosexual activitists. The credibility of uni comes from staff/student ratio, how smart the students it attracts are and how much research the professors do.

 

[Jonathan A]

It's going to go and nothing's going to change this. However, to those that do support VSU, you are without right to complain about the consequences.

-Extra $350 in my pocket annually;
-Less Left wing plackards around my campus;
-Less interruptions in class for union events and outcries.


Hmmm.. I am dreading the consequences.

 

[Jonathan A]

Im seeing a major problem in a number of pro-VSU arguments here and elsewhere and its the use of the word 'I'.
"I don't want to support X."
"Why should I support Y?
"I would like to see Z abolished."

Great. Fantastic even, so because one person doesn't like/want to join/agree with a service that the Union provides it should be abolished? Utter nonsense.
Let's look at the practical implications of VSU:

1) Consider how many students attend University, thousands.,
2) Consider the variety of opinions/ideas/ideologies amongst those thousands of students.
3) Consider the likelihood of gaining a reasonable amount of support for certain services amongst such a diverse population.

The fact is that many services that may seem wasteful/inappropriate or whatever to one person may be essential to another.
Furthermore simply because you don't use a service provided by the Union is not to say you should not support it in the form of a general contribution.

This has been attacked on various occassions, but I would like to add to it or at least my thoughts.

I don't go to University to engage in politics. Instead I pay about $20-$30 annually to be a member of the Liberal Party and I do my political discussion there. I go to University to learn and when I engage in discussion (even if political) its intelligent and not about barracading buildings, members of parliament who visit and certainly I would not miss class for it.

The fact services are essential to one and not the other does not justify us ALL paying for it. If it is so essential, the Government would be providing for it. But a special room for females, special area for special minority groups, etc... is not a necessity and not one I support. How do we go about supporting harmony and a anti-discimination when we financially and socially elevate others over the mainstream.

If you want the union services so bad, you pay for them. But my money is better spent on other things - I'd rather fund the Associations I WANT to support - e.g. my law students society.

 

[Jonathan A]

Legal, academic and welfare services provided by the student organisations are stupid, are they? I know that a number of people consider the value of such services to be marginal, but I think that it's taking it to an extreme to say that they are stupid.

If you can't face an academic and communicate with them, then you lack certain communication skills. Yes it can be daunting, but I think getting a union involved is asking for trouble. What are the union going to do? I would imagine standing outside the academic's office with a sign in protest.

 

[Generator]

If you can't face an academic and communicate with them, then you lack certain communication skills. Yes it can be daunting, but I think getting a union involved is asking for trouble. What are the union going to do? I would imagine standing outside the academic's office with a sign in protest.

So I take it that you are one of those who is of the opinion that every instance of advocacy on behalf of a student must involve a sign, a sit in or a rampage through the city? You're quite the ideologue, Jonathan. David Clarke and Tony Abbott would be proud.

It isn't just a matter of a conversation between two equals, Jonathan. As you said, it can be a daunting task, and the assistance provided by the student associations can help to assauge the student's concerns. They can also provide advice as to how to best tackle an academic complaint of some sort, because no matter how smart a student may be, that isn't to say that they will actually grasp what is required of them.

 

[banco55]

I don't see why a service that advises you on academic appeals etc. needs to cost much at all. All they need is a university provided room and some volunteers who know the procedures etc. As for legal advice you can get free legal advice from legal aid.

 

[Jonathan A]

So I take it that you are one of those who is of the opinion that every instance of advocacy on behalf of a student must involve a sign, a sit in or a rampage through the city? You're quite the ideologue, Jonathan. David Clarke and Tony Abbott would be proud.

It isn't just a matter of a conversation between two equals, Jonathan. As you said, it can be a daunting task, and the assistance provided by the student associations can help to assauge the student's concerns. They can also provide advice as to how to best tackle an academic complaint of some sort, because no matter how smart a student may be, that isn't to say that they will actually grasp what is required of them.

Mate it wouldn't even cost me $300 to get my solicitor (an accredited specialist) to contact the University and represent me. Why should it cost the Union more. I have hadrly heard anyone using the union for support. And I speak to lots and lots of people given my public role. I don't see the justification. If I need their advocacy, I'll pay for it.

Regardless of what Clarke and Abbott would say, Unions are a rip-off and VSU will make them rethink that their utopia was one built on the backs of the students they supposedly served.

 

[Silver Persian]

Full fee paying places should have their price bumped up to cover union activities so that those who are struggling financially won't be faced with the burden but can still use the facilities.

 

[banco55]

So I take it that you are one of those who is of the opinion that every instance of advocacy on behalf of a student must involve a sign, a sit in or a rampage through the city? You're quite the ideologue, Jonathan. David Clarke and Tony Abbott would be proud.

It isn't just a matter of a conversation between two equals, Jonathan. As you said, it can be a daunting task, and the assistance provided by the student associations can help to assauge the student's concerns. They can also provide advice as to how to best tackle an academic complaint of some sort, because no matter how smart a student may be, that isn't to say that they will actually grasp what is required of them.

Considering how the morons behave when abbott speaks on campus I can certainly see why he is more than a little cynical about student activism.

 

[Generator]

Campus quandary as union dues dry up

I really should pay more attention to the daily rags - a day late, but at least it's up .

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Edit: I was just sent the link for UNSW student organisations' VSU planning report - if you're interested, please follow the link to wherever it may lead - http://www.source.unsw.edu.au/vsureport/.

 

[Aryanbeauty]

Although i'm new in australia and university, I must say its a disaster that they introduced voluntary thing. Now everything is charged seperately. I am not willing to pay extra 100$ just to use swimming pool once a week and pay $5 everytime I play tennis, instead I sit in my room browsing this website and post this useless message on this board.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

willing to pay extra 100$ just to use swimming pool once a week and pay $5 everytime I play tennis, instead I sit in my room browsing this website and post this useless message on this board.

lol ok.

 

[withoutaface]

Although i'm new in australia and university, I must say its a disaster that they introduced voluntary thing. Now everything is charged seperately. I am not willing to pay extra 100$ just to use swimming pool once a week and pay $5 everytime I play tennis, instead I sit in my room browsing this website and post this useless message on this board.

So someone who doesn't use the pool or any of the Union facilities should pay $50 for you to use it for the year while you pay the other $50?

Yeah, that makes sense!

 

[Generator]

Sydney uni steps in to fund services

 

[Phanatical]

As I see it, VSU forces the Unions and the Universities to adopt a model similar to that in shopping centres. We don't pay for the privilege to use a shopping centre - there are plenty of free things that are available at Westfields or Centro or Stockland etc.

Yes, it might be more difficult for students with children to attend university. But as far as I'm concerned, they are in a much better financial position than parents who can't attend university because they have to earn money to feed their kids. Further, for the majority of universities, childcare services are impractical anyway since the Union does not fund childcare services at Every campus where there are students. One of my classmates at the Con just had a child, and she does not have access to the Union childcare she (and the rest of us) pays for.

Unfortunately, universities are very likely to cave into demands for a "fully-funded SRC" and a "fully-funded Union", and that funding will be taken from our classrooms and libraries. At USYD, the SRC received a guarantee for funding post-VSU, and I am disgusted by the fact that now we cannot even conscientiously object - the fees will be paid to the SRC whether or not we choose.

 

[gerhard]

Sydney uni steps in to fund services

lol. although i am pro vsu, i still find this pretty funny. liberals whinging about how if they dont want to pay for student unionism they shouldnt have to are still forced to pay for student unionism - out of money that probably should be going to their education.

 

[P_Dilemma]

Isn't it illogical when people paid for student unionism and didn't take advantage of what was available?

VSU needn't be necessary, really, just persuade the people to actually use what's available.

-P_D