VSU Emergency Rally - Tommorow (Wed 16th) (2 Viewers)

[Xayma]

Well I can't see any precedent for only 10% students remaining members, unless of course the union isn't viewed as fiscally responsible.

Even at 30% and drop in fees of 50% (as seen in WA, where the union wasn't seen as fiscally irresponsible) that is still 15% of the revenue.

Also on that note, it seems a large amount of USU supporters call other people selfish, after mentioning how they love all the services offered TO THEM. It is often just as selfish of them, to expect others to help provide services to them.

I don't expect others to support my services unless they choose to, I will likely remain a member of the SRC and USU (SU sport I don't know much about). But I don't expect others to pay it for me if they don't use the services, they already do enough of that through taxes.

Just on aside, although I have used my figures to be pro VSU, that is just because I am sure there are many others who use the services at the same scale (ie fairly little), it should not be up to them, unless they choose, to support those who use the services alot more.

Asquithian: I've done numerous collections for charities, from ANZAC day badge appeals to the Red Shield Appeal, people seem to be willing to part with their money even if it doesn't impact them directly. (With donations being from what they have on them to >$50).

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Asquithian, if that was true than society its self would have already crumbled.
People simply wouldn't pay taxes, etc.

What happens is people apply critical thinking, they have looked at the situation and decided that for them it is best if they didn't have to pay fee's, others have looked at the situation and decided for them (either because they get direct benefits, or the indirect benefit of just feeling good about themselves) it is best if they did pay the fee's.

In a democracy both sides (or numerous sides) will duke it out, the result (if free speech is not impeeded etc) should be that a just compromise is made.

But again, on this matter... people keep bringing up the services. I REALLY doubt that services will diminish much at all, perhaps some of the very small societies won't work out.. but most services will be provided through the uni through some sort of fee they'll charge to students that aren't a part of the union, like a "services" fee.

Basically the only real decision i can see here is, do we want to keep students in the current level of power they are? Are they doing a good job? Do we still need representation?

 

[Phanatical]

[cough]Tax Deductable[/cough]

 

[gordo]

You have this high faith in humans to be 'responsible'

When given the choice people will always choose money unless the benefit is very very good and impacts on their directly. Whether the benefit happens to impact on other people a side issue.

i buy fundraising chocolates wen ever someone asks me

matter of fact i bought som easter eggs today to fund wind turbines in nepal

and i don't do it because i get the chocolate...

 

[neo o]

i buy fundraising chocolates wen ever someone asks me

matter of fact i bought som easter eggs today to fund wind turbines in nepal

and i don't do it because i get the chocolate...

Wind turbines in Nepal. Well, paddle me and call me pimp daddy, but is this a man who knows how to spend his money or what.

BTW gordo - you must be pretty fat.

 

[Phanatical]

Oh, you definitely get reputation points for that.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I spent my money to help fund that guy in LA who wanted to put firefighters on the corner of every dangerous street when they weren't busy.

 

[Suvat]

I bought a pen from the rspca for $30...

 

[gordo]

must have been a pretty special pen

what colour was it?

 

[gordo]

Wind turbines in Nepal. Well, paddle me and call me pimp daddy, but is this a man who knows how to spend his money or what.

BTW gordo - you must be pretty fat.

not with the daily walks to consecutive lectures from wallace to aeropsace building

 

[Phanatical]

Yeah, that's a bitch of a walk.

 

[Plebeian]

Something else to consider with respect to VSU is the fact that student activism does save you money. The HECS increases that we've been hit with were originally slated to be 30%. Fighting by the SRC and NUS reduced this to 25%. For people doing HECS band 2 courses (science, engineering, etc. - which seems to be applicable to most of those people supporting VSU in this thread), that equates to a saving of 547.92 each year, more than the average cost of your union fees (and certainly much more than the $480 fee you will pay from second year onwards).

Under VSU, there would be no organised protest, and you'd be paying more.

 

[Jesus!]

Something else to consider with respect to VSU is the fact that student activism does save you money. The HECS increases that we've been hit with were originally slated to be 30%. Fighting by the SRC and NUS reduced this to 25%. For people doing HECS band 2 courses (science, engineering, etc. - which seems to be applicable to most of those people supporting VSU in this thread), that equates to a saving of 547.92 each year, more than the average cost of your union fees (and certainly much more than the $480 fee you will pay from second year onwards).

Under VSU, there would be no organised protest, and you'd be paying more.

Interesting point.

 

[withoutaface]

Something else to consider with respect to VSU is the fact that student activism does save you money. The HECS increases that we've been hit with were originally slated to be 30%. Fighting by the SRC and NUS reduced this to 25%. For people doing HECS band 2 courses (science, engineering, etc. - which seems to be applicable to most of those people supporting VSU in this thread), that equates to a saving of 547.92 each year, more than the average cost of your union fees (and certainly much more than the $480 fee you will pay from second year onwards).

Under VSU, there would be no organised protest, and you'd be paying more.

Yes, but this is 5-6 years into the future when I'm on 40-60k, as opposed to now.

 

[gordo]

can i get a loan on my union fees and pay them back wen i'm earning 50k a year?

 

[yulia]

what the fuck do you think I've been looking for for the last 3 months? And I've been doing plenty of stuff to earn myself money, but the fact remains that some of us:
a) study subjects at an advanced level
b) actually need D's to transfer
c) are doing a real degree
and hence need to study just that little bit more than others. The sleep issue is a little more of a problem when one has 8am lecture four days a week, and time spent at uni is greatly inflated by large two and three hour gaps. And irrespective of this, students should not have to pay for what are essentially luxuries through union fees before they can pay for essentials.

The misconception you make is that my degree is not real, simply because you've read the lines somewhere that it is a good degree to get you into others in the future. Mine IS just like the science degree EXCEPT I have replaced my maths units with SLSS and ECON. I'm still MAJORING IN PHARMACOLOGY as I would've done had I gone for the MedSci degree instead (which I got into by the way, but wanted a more flexible degree). In fact, if I decide I have the time and the effort I will be doing a DOUBLE MAJOR. Please, tell me, how is this not real? When if I can be arsed, I'll finish with a double degree? Please, tell me, when did pharmacology not become real??
You need D's to transfer? Wow I'm trying to do Honours, I'm not actually going to be happy with just a pass. You seem to believe you do more than me because my degree has the word "arts" in it. May I point out the arts subject I chose is NOT an easy subject, that screening was required to determine what students would be capable, and that it requires 7 hours minimum home study as well as an hour at the least per week in the language lab. On top of that I'm doing the 2 sciences as well as legal studies. SO. With my subjects I am requiring JUST as much study as you. I also have 2-3 hour breaks. I also have days 9-4 no breaks. I also have 8-5 days. I also on occasion have days where I have 5 hour breaks. I'm not doing an arts degree. The way I've structured my degree, I'm doing science with arts on top, the arts is extra, but my major is still science.
You can try as hard as you can to tell me that my degree isn't real and that I don't have to study hard, maybe this is just one of the reasons everyone gets pissed off at you because you don't seem to be able to get the concepts of this degree through your head, so maybe you do need a lot more study than everyone else, you don't seem to handle the whole understanding things concept very well.
If you can't handle studying subjects at advanced level, then don't. No one made you do it. I could've done advanced, I didn't because I didn't need to and I looked at what I thought I'd be capable of handling.
Not out fault if you've dealt yourself more than you can handle.

If you still argue at the end of this that my degree isn't real and that I need to study less than someone in the B.Science, you really shouldn't be in Uni at all.

 

[gordo]

wow, u really hit a sore spot there

 

[stazi]

Something else to consider with respect to VSU is the fact that student activism does save you money. The HECS increases that we've been hit with were originally slated to be 30%. Fighting by the SRC and NUS reduced this to 25%. For people doing HECS band 2 courses (science, engineering, etc. - which seems to be applicable to most of those people supporting VSU in this thread), that equates to a saving of 547.92 each year, more than the average cost of your union fees (and certainly much more than the $480 fee you will pay from second year onwards).

Under VSU, there would be no organised protest, and you'd be paying more.

hehe you think this studen activism wouldnt take place without union fees I'm against VSu, but that point is relatively invalid.

 

[Jonathan A]

Unions can only get support via forcing people to pay for their pointless activities. Some unions do good for students, but hey no one should be given a tax invoice every semester and told if they don't pay they may be kicked out of uni. That's plainly against the rights of students, which union is campaigning for those rights?

The rights to freedom of association, the right to education? The same people demanding compulsory fees are the same people demanding HECS to be reduced. The only thing is, HECS can be paid at a time where I have a stable job and not worrying about my assessments pouring in.

Sure students need representation, but help students properly. Give you an example. UWS had probably the worst unions ever. From insolvency through to lack of encouragement, so UWSConnect was established to run retail and commercial services along with sports. UWSConnect is so successful I joined as a student-elect and furthermore would not mind paying a fee to be a member of their organisation. They go out there, run facilities and speak to students, want to know what is going on, not turn a blind eye to the majority and start 'beeping parades" outside the Vice-Chancellors office.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

lol did you read the sign?
"Come down, there will be a ceremonial honking of a horn and yelling at the vice-chancellor".
How lame