• We have a few events lined up for the October school holidays!
    Watch this space...

What is my best option? (1 Viewer)

Student1993

New Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
8
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Hi All,

I'm currently studying Arts/Law and nearing the completion of the Arts component of the degree (I will be done 1st sem next year). I've done relatively well, but at this stage, I'm not particularly interested in pursuing a legal career - the field is absolutely saturated, and I find it dull and uninspired. Instead, I'm keen to work in a professional services or similar firm, preferably in Ibanking. I'm wondering whether I should try to transfer to Comm/Law now (aware I will lose a tonne of credit) or finish and do Masters Comm (Finance). I just don't know how this is generally perceived by employers and if doing really well in Finance masters would be a path to Ibanking etc. Although if I did this, I would be like 25 or so when I graduate, which is nuts.

I've also been working on a start-up, so I'm kind of struggling to do that too amidst everything else. Was thinking maybe I could work on that and do Finance Masters when I grad, not sure. I guess I'm kind of a bit lost and seeking some advice. Thx in advance.
 

Chronost

Auditing CAGS
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
1,178
Location
where people need auditing
Gender
Female
HSC
2013
Hi All,

I'm currently studying Arts/Law and nearing the completion of the Arts component of the degree (I will be done 1st sem next year). I've done relatively well, but at this stage, I'm not particularly interested in pursuing a legal career - the field is absolutely saturated, and I find it dull and uninspired. Instead, I'm keen to work in a professional services or similar firm, preferably in Ibanking. I'm wondering whether I should try to transfer to Comm/Law now (aware I will lose a tonne of credit) or finish and do Masters Comm (Finance). I just don't know how this is generally perceived by employers and if doing really well in Finance masters would be a path to Ibanking etc. Although if I did this, I would be like 25 or so when I graduate, which is nuts.

I've also been working on a start-up, so I'm kind of struggling to do that too amidst everything else. Was thinking maybe I could work on that and do Finance Masters when I grad, not sure. I guess I'm kind of a bit lost and seeking some advice. Thx in advance.
You can still apply for sections of Ibanking with an arts/law degree,and really they'll only be looking at your law component,however it'll be tough to compete with the comm/law kids who have that comm advantage in interviews, so really do still apply and see how far you go, if you fail then, a Masters doesn't seem too bad. Alternatively try and get into consulting(mmgt consulting would be the equivalent prestige to ibanking, however big4 consulting can still work) get a few years under your belt and think about MBA/masters then. Also consider corp finance, they generally look for law degree holders, and although once again comm is an advantage you'll still be able to get interviews as long as you show your passion(and then you'll do some units to catch up).

You still have some time with your law component im guessing, have you thought about working in the finance section in a big6 law firm? It takes into account financial law and other parts of finance, whilst still having that law component.

Maybe focus on your start-up and see how that goes for now first, you still have components of your law degree to finish which means you don't need to think about graduate jobs just yet.
 

Student1993

New Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
8
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
You can still apply for sections of Ibanking with an arts/law degree,and really they'll only be looking at your law component,however it'll be tough to compete with the comm/law kids who have that comm advantage in interviews, so really do still apply and see how far you go, if you fail then, a Masters doesn't seem too bad. Alternatively try and get into consulting(mmgt consulting would be the equivalent prestige to ibanking, however big4 consulting can still work) get a few years under your belt and think about MBA/masters then. Also consider corp finance, they generally look for law degree holders, and although once again comm is an advantage you'll still be able to get interviews as long as you show your passion(and then you'll do some units to catch up).

You still have some time with your law component im guessing, have you thought about working in the finance section in a big6 law firm? It takes into account financial law and other parts of finance, whilst still having that law component.

Maybe focus on your start-up and see how that goes for now first, you still have components of your law degree to finish which means you don't need to think about graduate jobs just yet.
Big 6 Financial Law is just way too difficult to get into. Candidates with D average and experience aren't getting clerkships. Will definitely look at corp finance and consulting.

So you wouldn't recommend transferring to comm/law now?
 

Omnipotence

Kendrick Lamar
Joined
Feb 7, 2009
Messages
5,332
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2011
Uni Grad
2016
Arts/Law goes into IB interview, gets asked industry specific questions, leaves without a job.
 

isildurrrr1

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
1,758
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
having fun doing investment banking without a hotshit math background.
 

seremify007

Junior Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2004
Messages
9,786
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
Uni Grad
2009
How good are your marks in Arts/Law? Transferring to Comm/Law and getting less than stellar marks won't necessarily improve your chances of some of the top tier finance roles with or without maths.

Most people who do Arts/Law (cf any other double degree with law) tend to end up in law from what I can tell.
 

RishBonjour99

Active Member
Joined
Feb 9, 2014
Messages
375
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Hi All,

I'm currently studying Arts/Law and nearing the completion of the Arts component of the degree (I will be done 1st sem next year). I've done relatively well, but at this stage, I'm not particularly interested in pursuing a legal career - the field is absolutely saturated, and I find it dull and uninspired. Instead, I'm keen to work in a professional services or similar firm, preferably in Ibanking. I'm wondering whether I should try to transfer to Comm/Law now (aware I will lose a tonne of credit) or finish and do Masters Comm (Finance). I just don't know how this is generally perceived by employers and if doing really well in Finance masters would be a path to Ibanking etc. Although if I did this, I would be like 25 or so when I graduate, which is nuts.

I've also been working on a start-up, so I'm kind of struggling to do that too amidst everything else. Was thinking maybe I could work on that and do Finance Masters when I grad, not sure. I guess I'm kind of a bit lost and seeking some advice. Thx in advance.
Don't transfer into comm/law - too late. Generally, arts/law guns = big 6 law. They don't care about your arts marks at all, as long as law is godly (75+ wam for just law units at usyd). So when you apply to IBs, it will be very similar - they will look at your law marks, and if it isn't good, no chance for interviews. I heard they take into consideration what degree you're from when you're interviewed. So for example, if you're from straight science - it is unlikely they will ask some technical valuation stuff.

Have you thought about management consulting? That's probably the best thing you could do - but it's harder to get into top-tier MC firms than IBs - so you could try big 4 consulting or even mid tiers - they are all great!
 

Student1993

New Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
8
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Don't transfer into comm/law - too late. Generally, arts/law guns = big 6 law. They don't care about your arts marks at all, as long as law is godly (75+ wam for just law units at usyd). So when you apply to IBs, it will be very similar - they will look at your law marks, and if it isn't good, no chance for interviews. I heard they take into consideration what degree you're from when you're interviewed. So for example, if you're from straight science - it is unlikely they will ask some technical valuation stuff.

Have you thought about management consulting? That's probably the best thing you could do - but it's harder to get into top-tier MC firms than IBs - so you could try big 4 consulting or even mid tiers - they are all great!
Thanks for the advice. I'm definitely super keen on management consulting - I'll certainly try big 4 consulting and all the other options. Will have a crack at corporate finance too, although this might be harder coming from a non-finance background. If everyone is suggesting mgmt consulting, I take it an Arts/Law background would be fine? (provided marks are good, obviously)
 

peri24

Active Member
Joined
May 28, 2012
Messages
194
Location
Australia
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2016
Thanks for the advice. I'm definitely super keen on management consulting - I'll certainly try big 4 consulting and all the other options. Will have a crack at corporate finance too, although this might be harder coming from a non-finance background. If everyone is suggesting mgmt consulting, I take it an Arts/Law background would be fine? (provided marks are good, obviously)
i dont get law but yea u be fine.
 

Omnidragon

Devil
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
937
Location
Melbourne
Gender
Male
HSC
2003
Uni Grad
2007
Some pretty misleading advice. Here, you will not be considered in M&A or trading in Asia Pacific with that degree. Period.

You will be on equal footing for management consulting as anyone else.
 

Student1993

New Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
8
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Some pretty misleading advice. Here, you will not be considered in M&A or trading in Asia Pacific with that degree. Period.

You will be on equal footing for management consulting as anyone else.
That's what I imagined. What postgrad would you suggest to break in?
 

Omnidragon

Devil
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
937
Location
Melbourne
Gender
Male
HSC
2003
Uni Grad
2007
If you want to break into corporate finance, you can always become a lawyer and do M&A and then move (perhaps laterally) across to finance. Post grad-wise, honestly, no idea because most people who get in in Australia are undergraduates.'

If you want to do exciting stuff like sales/trading/hedge fund, you are in the completely wrong/unrelated field. Even for people working in M&A in finance, it is not easy to break into buy-side, let alone a lawyer.
 

Student1993

New Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2014
Messages
8
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
If you want to break into corporate finance, you can always become a lawyer and do M&A and then move (perhaps laterally) across to finance. Post grad-wise, honestly, no idea because most people who get in in Australia are undergraduates.'

If you want to do exciting stuff like sales/trading/hedge fund, you are in the completely wrong/unrelated field. Even for people working in M&A in finance, it is not easy to break into buy-side, let alone a lawyer.
Yeah, that's what I've been told. I understand some M&A Lawyers move over to IB to be analysts. My fear is that it's so brutally competitive to get into a top tier, which would be the only path in I would say. Whilst my marks will be solid, I was hoping that I could go into pro services, do a postgrad, smash that and be competitive to move across; either internally or externally.

Yeah, from what I understand, the sales & trading side is completely separate. Out of interest, how does one usually break into this?
 

Omnidragon

Devil
Joined
Jan 4, 2005
Messages
937
Location
Melbourne
Gender
Male
HSC
2003
Uni Grad
2007
It's not that brutal to get into top tier ibank as an M&A lawyer with 2-4 years experience. Depends on the market, sometimes they're just dying for people and take anyone. Of course, you'd normally start back as a 2nd year or 3rd year (if lucky) analyst. If you want to do ibank, your best bet is to drop arts now and do commerce. Or drop arts/law altogether and go do finance.

As for buy-side trading and hedge funds, most people who break in from undergraduate are from comm/eng or comm/sci backgrounds, or even straight commerce with honours. And they have a keen interest in numbers and trading strategies, are somewhat geeky, and aren't into doing deals or being a "baller" like most lawyers aspire to be. Completely different personalities. Professionally, lawyers almost never break in unless there was a specific skillset the hedge fund needed (eg a PE firm might take on a lawyer, but not a trading desk). Accountants have better chance. Even from sell-side (eg M&A), you'd have to break in quite early. Once you're past VP level or are at a senior VP level, it's pretty hard to break in. Because you're too accustomed to doing nothing meaningful except making powerpoint presentations, rather than using your brain.
 

Futuremedstudent

Ancient Orator
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
1,434
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
It's not that brutal to get into top tier ibank as an M&A lawyer with 2-4 years experience. Depends on the market, sometimes they're just dying for people and take anyone. Of course, you'd normally start back as a 2nd year or 3rd year (if lucky) analyst. If you want to do ibank, your best bet is to drop arts now and do commerce. Or drop arts/law altogether and go do finance.

As for buy-side trading and hedge funds, most people who break in from undergraduate are from comm/eng or comm/sci backgrounds, or even straight commerce with honours. And they have a keen interest in numbers and trading strategies, are somewhat geeky, and aren't into doing deals or being a "baller" like most lawyers aspire to be. Completely different personalities. Professionally, lawyers almost never break in unless there was a specific skillset the hedge fund needed (eg a PE firm might take on a lawyer, but not a trading desk). Accountants have better chance. Even from sell-side (eg M&A), you'd have to break in quite early. Once you're past VP level or are at a senior VP level, it's pretty hard to break in. Because you're too accustomed to doing nothing meaningful except making powerpoint presentations, rather than using your brain.
wrong, in fact with an oversupply of graduates finding a job is very very hard.
 

enoilgam

Moderator
Moderator
Joined
Feb 11, 2011
Messages
11,869
Location
Mare Crisium
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2010
wrong, in fact with an oversupply of graduates finding a job is very very hard.
Exactly, graduates. Omnidragon was referring to lawyers with experience, which is a totally different ball game. I remember when I was at a Big 6 firm, we had to use LinkedIn to head-hunt for some senior/experienced law roles because we weren't getting many applicants.

As for the OP, I wouldnt do Masters - in most sectors, that's something you do to compliment years of experience. It wont do much to help for entry level/junior positions (in most business fields that is).
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top