Maths or Science compulsory for Year 11/12 Students (3 Viewers)

[BLIT2014]

This also would have been so good. I would have probably hated it then, but it would have been very useful.

I'd have hated it but I think it is probably one of most important aspect that we should change it in our education system.

 

[isildurrrr1]

I'd have hated it but I think it is probably one of most important aspect that we should change it in our education system.

The problem with Math and Science is that if you get a shitty teacher you're not going to learn anything at all.

Understanding math and science is way more important than what people think.

I went to the ADF recruiting and I think most people failed to get their jobs because they hated math in high school and did shit at it, now they realize the military REALLY needs people to understand maths especially geometry. If both militaries are equal in equipment and training, the one with the better math will always win.

 

[BLIT2014]

The problem with Math and Science is that if you get a shitty teacher you're not going to learn anything at all.

Understanding math and science is way more important than what people think.

I went to the ADF recruiting and I think most people failed to get their jobs because they hated math in high school and did shit at it, now they realize the military REALLY needs people to understand maths especially geometry. If both militaries are equal in equipment and training, the one with the better math will always win.

I was talking about making languages compulsory to study up to year 10.

I know have a terrible science, and especially mathematics teacher really stuffs you up foundationally so it is harder to learn mathematics later on.

 

[nerdasdasd]

I was talking about making languages compulsory to study up to year 10.

I know have a terrible science, and especially mathematics teacher really stuffs you up foundationally so it is hardier to learn mathematics later on.

Hardier :hahahhaha:

But yeah . Having students that know two languages is good

It's a common education policy in south East Asian nations

 

[Trebla]

Definitely don't agree with making Science compulsory, but agree with making Maths compulsory provided the course is restructured for 2U and General in a similar nature to Advanced and Standard in English. In other words, a common content which all students are exposed to (hopefully with something that trains their analytical/quantitative skills) and then deviate into different topics afterwards.

You can talk about improving quality of teachers etc but that's kind of irrelevant to this topic because that will always be a problem regardless of course structure.

EDIT: Just realised this is my 5000th post!!!!

 

[4025808]

I'd honestly think that the problem lies within year 7-10 itself. People tend to not choose maths and science in year 11/12 due to poor teaching practices and general disinterest in the topic - probably since we have crappy teachers teaching such subjects. We are generally exposed to lots of content, rote-learning and memorizing in Science. Mathematics is also pretty easy in itself but it's bloody boringly taught - people don't really see the rewards and get easily bored. Then when you get to year 11, BOOM and then people start fucking up due to the huge change in difficulty level. Teachers play a big part in this, as well as the syllabus itself, and they gotta change the syllabus, as well as hire better teachers to account for this.

As much as I'd like maths and science to be compulsory in year 11/12, there has to be significant restructuring of the syllabus - if anything using the framework of the IB would be a good initial start, provided that the syllabus in year 7-10 accounts for the change in difficulty for year 11/12. Bring back the mathematics involved in the physics syllabus.

Also I believe languages should be compulsory for up until year 10 - having a 2nd language handy can actually help us to be more competitive and capable individuals in the future. The few problems with this is about managing the quality of the teachers teaching such languages, especially in the countryside. :S

 

[Drongoski]

The problem with Math and Science is that if you get a shitty teacher you're not going to learn anything at all.

Understanding math and science is way more important than what people think.

I went to the ADF recruiting and I think most people failed to get their jobs because they hated math in high school and did shit at it, now they realize the military REALLY needs people to understand maths especially geometry. If both militaries are equal in equipment and training, the one with the better math will always win.

I find students weak in maths often drop the '-' sign for negative quantities. I asked them what would happen if they were to fire a missile at a target with co-ordinates (172,-763) and , being the way they are, they entered the co-ord (172,763) ?? - might the missile not land on their own backyard?

 

[isildurrrr1]

Hardier :hahahhaha:

But yeah . Having students that know two languages is good

It's a common education policy in south East Asian nations

It's just native language + engrish. I wouldn't say it's highly effective in Japan nor Taiwan... I blame the shitty backpacker english teachers.

Drongonski: not only that, even in small infantry units math is pretty fucking important. Judging range, how fast a target is moving, adjusting etc. Also, snipers are essentially dudes who weaponised maths.

It's also better for the general population to have better math skills.

 

[4025808]

It's just native language + engrish. I wouldn't say it's highly effective in Japan nor Taiwan... I blame the shitty backpacker english teachers.

Drongonski: not only that, even in small infantry units math is pretty fucking important. Judging range, how fast a target is moving, adjusting etc. Also, snipers are essentially dudes who weaponised maths.

It's also better for the general population to have better math skills.

In some countries it's not just native language + English.

I.e. in Singapore often or not you speak English and your mother tongue (which is either Mandarin, Malay or Tamil depending on your background). In terms of applying for jobs, most jobs there have a prerequisite of English and Mandarin. Thus if Malays and Indians were to apply for jobs then they'd also need to learn Mandarin in order to compete.

In Malaysia it's even greater. To do business flexibly you'd often need to know a substantial amount of English (business language), Mandarin (business language, also due to proximity to Singapore and China), Malay (because its the national language used in government/politics) and often or not Cantonese (if you live in KL - its the lingua franca of the local population) and even Hokkien (Penang or anywhere else really), and Tamil (if you're Indian)

Then in HK you have to learn English, Mandarin and Cantonese, all three fluently.

 

[isildurrrr1]

I guess languages that are 'native' to the country in the sense that it's significant to the population.

I think it'll be good for people to learn a foreign language, it allows you to think in different ways.

That comment was mostly around East Asia, not South East Asia...

 

[Queenroot]

I think at that age they should be able to be given the freedom to choose their subjects. No one should be forced.

But sometimes I feel like science is necessary in some cases, especially when we see how many anti-vax people there are, a simple education about how vaccines work would reduce the greater community from being put at risk. Although I guess the above problem can be combated in other ways, it is one of many problems.

I'm all for independence and freedom when it comes to choosing subjects, but honestly when it comes to things as mentioned above it's kind of alarming and sets off a few red flags about science education.

 

[isildurrrr1]

I think at that age they should be able to be given the freedom to choose their subjects. No one should be forced.

nope.avi

A teenager can't predict what they would need for their future. I know heaps of people who wished they continued to do maths in high school instead of dropping it.

There are certain subjects that are compulsory everywhere in the world for a reason. There's other subjects that can be electives.

 

[Evertone]

Out of something like 50 maths teachers I've come across since kindergarten (now in year 12) perhaps only 5 I think were half competent on reflection.

Yet I could hardly remember any science teacher I have come across who was incompetent. That explains why I continually raked up A's in science from years 5-10 and E's in maths from years 2-10.

I genuinely believe if there was enough fostering and nurturing of the subject going on, I would not be in the undesirable position I am in now.

Improve the teachers and and I'm all for it. But there is one hell of a problem with the maths teachers in this state -- at least the ones I have seen (which, by the way, cross many suburbs and many schools).

 

[Squar3root]

IMO people should do these subjects

> English, obviously but not that crappy analyse a poem or write about feelings but more skill based things like reports, etc
> Another Language, in this global society
> At least 2U math, so people are able to think more logically etc
> A computing course, since we're pretty much always using computers nowadays for everything would be useful to know how to use them properly
> A Humanities and Science subject, so you're a well educated person that knows a more variety of things

I think making maths and science compulsory is a good idea because it will teach students to learn a more variety of things and have a more educated society

 

[Drongoski]

Make our Federal politicians take Maths (no,no, not General Maths level) and a Science subject, at the HSC level. See how they fare.

For future elections, a minimum of Credit in these subjects should be a prerequisite for standing for public office. We have too many lawyers in Federal politics.

 

[isildurrrr1]

Talking about compulsory Maths and Science for Year 11/12, how about making Christopher Pyne and all the MPs and Senators take a Maths(not General Maths level) and a Science subject at the Year 11/12 level - and see how they go. The overwhelming majority of our Federal MPs are from the Humanities; with a Legal training mostly. As for the Senators, some are semi-literate.

There's a reason why most politicians are lawyers, you know they're the people who understand law/write them better than others?

 

[Trebla]

But honestly, all these subjects ARE compulsory from year 7-10.

It's only 2 years that they either do those subjects or don't. Will those 2 years REALLY make such a big difference in the "education of our nation" in our future?

Yep definitely. It's the use it or lose it principle which you can definitely see when you look at students in uni.

Also, in HSC maths for example, there is more emphasis on logical reasoning than in Years 7-10 (where it is more computational maths than anything). So missing out on being sharper in logical reasoning is a pretty noticeable thing.

 

[isildurrrr1]

But honestly, all these subjects ARE compulsory from year 7-10.

It's only 2 years that they either do those subjects or don't. Will those 2 years REALLY make such a big difference in the "education of our nation" in our future?

People forget a lot over the course of summer vacation. 1-2 year is even greater. Even people taking gap years and going into uni have a harder time than someone whose gone straight into uni.

 

[pomsky]

But honestly, all these subjects ARE compulsory from year 7-10.

It's only 2 years that they either do those subjects or don't. Will those 2 years REALLY make such a big difference in the "education of our nation" in our future?

But did you actually learn anything in 7-10?
cos I didn't.

I honestly think the junior four years were the biggest waste of time. A year 7 could easily jump to Year 10 or even year 11 after a term of studying. I mean, I entered prelim Chem knowing nothing but what an atom, molecule and a element was, in addition to how to 'balance' equations. English was a joke. My school (selective) didn't teach us how to properly write essays until prelim Eng. Math was a joke. Most subjects were a joke.

Having said that stuff like Australian history probably needs to be taught over 1-2 years but overall there should be some serious restructuring of the 7-10 syllabus.

 

[RivalryofTroll]

Make our Federal politicians take Maths (no,no, not General Maths level) and a Science subject, at the HSC level. See how they fare.

For future elections, a minimum of Credit in these subjects should be a prerequisite for standing for public office. We have too many lawyers in Federal politics.

I'm not sure why all Federal politicians would need a Science background.

I don't see why most Politicians should be doing degrees outside of Arts/Law (or perhaps, Economics/Law). Lawyers have a background in not just the legal system, but also the political system (in Law school, at the theoretically level, you learn about Public Law, Constitutional Law, etc.). Engineers, for example, simply do not have this background.

Are you arguing for 'diversity' in the Legislature, or merely that every profession/career path should require people to have a minimum level of Mathematics and Science?