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The faggot store.

I think you should find another way to get around my problem... because tbh, you've now really pushed god out of all the gaps. What does god exist to do? We have the universe existing, we have time beginning, we have all the matter/stars/planets etc forming, we have life, we have evolution, we...

a deistic god that cannot determine his own fate, has no personality and makes no decisions can exist outside of time. So sure, it could just "be"... but it would "be" something much less than what any theist would want :p u know this anyway though.

I'm not applying my sense of 'time' to what it was like at time=0, I am explaining what it's like when you have no time. It isn't that it "doesnt make sense" per se, I'd say that it's that it's impossible. Free will? You can't have free will outside of time.

What understanding would you like me to approach it from? I'm explaining it insofar as we understand time. A thing without time is in 1 state of existence, if it 'creates the universe' it was 'stuck' in the state of 'create the universe'. Without a 'human notion of time' the idea of a decision...

Causation only exists inside of time. |-----------------TIME---------------------| Event A >--------------------> Event B Without time it's just. A IS. B IS.

Something which is timeless can only be in one state, if god exists outside of all time then he could only do one thing (perhaps this thing is create the universe, but he would be unable to decide to do so, it would essentially be a deistic god) if it is not in one state then there is some new...

The best current data we have shows absolutely no evidence that could prove an omnipotent god or anything supernatural at all... Of course these things may exist in data that we have not yet been able to/will never be able to collect, but that's also the realm full of flights of fantasy and it...

An agnostic is someone who believes it cannot be proven either way, it is an epistemological position... but you can still have beliefs based on probabilities from the best current data, obviously your beliefs are not 'proven' absolutely, but most people don't need that sort of validation.

I'm an atheist, but by your definition... an agnostic. TBH I think your definition is a useless distraction.

Maybe. What if he were to say he was as agnostic about God as he is fairies, would you consider him an 'atheist' or an 'agnostic'.

a brief history of time by hawking or a short history of everything by bryson? latter is more interesting. edit: yeah i'll guess the first one given the topic atm :/

True enough, but my point is that basically the building blocks of the universe existed, everything that is in the universe now existed at t=0, it was just in a different form (matter & energy are interchangeable). Something can not have a cause without time, what exists now in the universe...

What I mean is that the matter/anti-matter/space/time existed at time=0, merely in a different form, the big bang didn't "create" the most basic building blocks of the universe.

Shortly after it? My understanding would be that time began with matter/energy/space existing, what happened once time began was that these components changed form.

Space, Matter & Energy existed at time=0... They don't exist "before" time comes into existence, there is no before, merely time=0. The only thing which can exist outside of time is something which is in 1 state, if god exists outside of time then he cannot cause anything, he cannot 'change'...

Always? You mean as in, infinity? No. They existed... there's no comment you can make regarding the amount of time they existed for before time=>0, but they existed at time=0. They have "always" existed insofar as they have existed during the history of time, yes.

Well, obviously in the end this all comes down to a value judgement... but I personally can't see myself valuing 'being with god' just because he's god, unless obviously by his decree. It sounds like words that have no more meaning than to say "the meaning in my life is to be", well... you are...

If you say "always" that implies time has already begun. What I mean by 'then time begins' is that time goes from time=0 to time=>0, time=0 is a state where we can't talk about before, it isn't that it has "always" existed it just exists.

What origin point of the universe? This idea of a 'point' seems to be stuck in the thinking of time existing. The way it works is like this... Space, matter, energy etc exist at time=0 - Then time begins. There is no 'before' then, there is no 'time' before the begining of time.