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Does God exist? (1 Viewer)

do you believe in god?


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Atheist/agnostic slayer

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in equally obnoxious language: one might volley a sophisticated retort positing that the inherent nature of volitional agency is not inexorably tethered to the dichotomy of moral judgements—good versus evil. Rather, it is the plethora of potentialities and the exercise of choosing from these manifold alternatives that encapsulates true free will. Perfection, in its unblemished splendor, need not be the antithesis of choice, but could indeed be the zenith of it, if such a state still encompasses a spectrum of preferable outcomes, each resonating with the individual's inner symphony of values and dispositions. The crux of free will, hence, is not diminished by the absence of evil; instead, it is affirmed by the autonomy to navigate through a labyrinth of equally luminous pathways, unfettered by the shadowy presence of malevolence.
This doesn't answer anything I said. Do better please, you just told me a story.
 

Atheist/agnostic slayer

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@Atheist/agnostic slayer The burden of proof is on you. Prove to me there is a God.
It's so amusing when atheists always say this same burden script, hilarious.

Anyways ... Let's do this

P1-A: Some things are in motion.
P2-A: If some things are in motion, then they are put in motion by another.
C-A: Therefore, they are put in motion by another.

P1-B: If they are put in motion by another, then either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.
P2-B: They are put in motion by another. C-B: Therefore, either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other

P1-C: Either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other
P2-C: But this cannot go on to infinity.
C-C: Therefore it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.


Superlatively proven:

Premise 1: Amongst existences, there are certain beings that are greater/lesser in respects of being (hot, cold, funny).

Premise 2: Greater and lesser are terms that necessitate superlatives.

Premise 3: Superlatives of the respects are the cause of the gradations of being in said respect (heat energy would be ultimately responsible for the gradation of heat in all things that are hot/cold).

Premise 4: If superlatives do not exist, then there is no objective referent for these degrees. Premise 5: Statements without an objective referent are non-cognitive.

Conclusion 1: Therefore the superlatives of these respects of being objectively exist.

Premise 6: Degrees of certain respects resemble the superlative of that respect. (PPC).
Premise 7: Transcendentals have gradation. (Truth, Goodness, existence, reality, unity)
Conclusion 2: The superlatives of these gradations exist (From P5 and C1)

Premise 8: Existence, Truth, Goodness and unity itself have gradation. (Transcendentals)
Conclusion 3: There is a superlative existence and reality which is the necessary foundation for all other grades of existence, goodness, truth and unity. (P3 and P6)

Conclusion 4: The necessary superlative existence is what is known as God.

If you want the predicate notation tell me, otherwise list the premise which you disagree with and explain why
 

idkkdi

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It's so amusing when atheists always say this same burden script, hilarious.

Anyways ... Let's do this

P1-A: Some things are in motion.
P2-A: If some things are in motion, then they are put in motion by another.
C-A: Therefore, they are put in motion by another.

P1-B: If they are put in motion by another, then either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.
P2-B: They are put in motion by another. C-B: Therefore, either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other

P1-C: Either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other
P2-C: But this cannot go on to infinity.
C-C: Therefore it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.


Superlatively proven:

Premise 1: Amongst existences, there are certain beings that are greater/lesser in respects of being (hot, cold, funny).

Premise 2: Greater and lesser are terms that necessitate superlatives.

Premise 3: Superlatives of the respects are the cause of the gradations of being in said respect (heat energy would be ultimately responsible for the gradation of heat in all things that are hot/cold).

Premise 4: If superlatives do not exist, then there is no objective referent for these degrees. Premise 5: Statements without an objective referent are non-cognitive.

Conclusion 1: Therefore the superlatives of these respects of being objectively exist.

Premise 6: Degrees of certain respects resemble the superlative of that respect. (PPC).
Premise 7: Transcendentals have gradation. (Truth, Goodness, existence, reality, unity)
Conclusion 2: The superlatives of these gradations exist (From P5 and C1)

Premise 8: Existence, Truth, Goodness and unity itself have gradation. (Transcendentals)
Conclusion 3: There is a superlative existence and reality which is the necessary foundation for all other grades of existence, goodness, truth and unity. (P3 and P6)

Conclusion 4: The necessary superlative existence is what is known as God.

If you want the predicate notation tell me, otherwise list the premise which you disagree with and explain why
proving some higher form of existence that is god is one thing. proving a biblical human god is another.
 

Atheist/agnostic slayer

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not a human god. and if its not a human god then whats the point of thinking about it?
A human God lol. This repetition gives me strong feelings that you are muslim from my personal experience but anyways, what's the objection to Jesus being God?
 

HazzRat

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It's so amusing when atheists always say this same burden script, hilarious.
Right dickhead let's do this :chainsaw: (you can't get offended by me calling you a dickhead, cause you start every message with an ad hominem attack)

Anyways ... Let's do this

P1-A: Some things are in motion.
P2-A: If some things are in motion, then they are put in motion by another.
C-A: Therefore, they are put in motion by another.

P1-B: If they are put in motion by another, then either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.
P2-B: They are put in motion by another. C-B: Therefore, either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other

P1-C: Either this goes on to infinity or it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other
P2-C: But this cannot go on to infinity.
C-C: Therefore it is necessary to arrive at a first mover, put in motion by no other.


Superlatively proven:

Premise 1: Amongst existences, there are certain beings that are greater/lesser in respects of being (hot, cold, funny).

Premise 2: Greater and lesser are terms that necessitate superlatives.

Premise 3: Superlatives of the respects are the cause of the gradations of being in said respect (heat energy would be ultimately responsible for the gradation of heat in all things that are hot/cold).

Premise 4: If superlatives do not exist, then there is no objective referent for these degrees. Premise 5: Statements without an objective referent are non-cognitive.

Conclusion 1: Therefore the superlatives of these respects of being objectively exist.

Premise 6: Degrees of certain respects resemble the superlative of that respect. (PPC).
Premise 7: Transcendentals have gradation. (Truth, Goodness, existence, reality, unity)
Conclusion 2: The superlatives of these gradations exist (From P5 and C1)

Premise 8: Existence, Truth, Goodness and unity itself have gradation. (Transcendentals)
Conclusion 3: There is a superlative existence and reality which is the necessary foundation for all other grades of existence, goodness, truth and unity. (P3 and P6)

Conclusion 4: The necessary superlative existence is what is known as God.

If you want the predicate notation tell me, otherwise list the premise which you disagree with and explain why
Your argument combines two separate ideas: the cosmological argument, and the argument from perfection. I'm gonna poke some holes in both of them (to the best of my ability).

Cosmological argument
  • As a counterargument to P2-A, it isn't necessarily true that everything needs an external mover. Perhaps the universe is its own source of motion. Or our understanding of causality (cause and effect) breaks down at the origin of the universe.
  • Even if you accept the need for a first mover (C-B), it doesn't guarantee that mover is God (C-C). The first mover could be a natural principle or force, not a conscious being.
Argument from perfection
  • To challenge Premise 1, the idea of "greater" and "lesser" in being can be subjective. What one person sees as perfect good, another might see as flawed.
  • To challenge Premise 6, just because things exhibit degrees of a quality, doesn't mean there must be a "superlative" version of that quality existing outside everything else. I believe your argument commits a fallacy of composition: that if something is true for some part of a whole, then it must be true for the whole. E.g. "This tire is made of rubber; therefore, the vehicle of which it is a part is also made of rubber." (from Wikipedia)
Additionally
  • All these arguments offer explanations, not conclusive evidence. If I wanted to test the theory of gravity, I could drop a pen to the floor, and see it being pulled to the Earth. However, you still haven't empirically proven God exists.
 
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