English is a waste of life. (2 Viewers)

[me121]

...you high schoolers are stupid and blind when it comes to the basic subjects that are implemented by the board of studies, like maths for an another example. Again it's a life skill that you use everyday.

Perhaps then the school (particularly the teachers) should show students more applications of where the things they are learning in class are applicable in their future and current lives.

A good and eager student should automatically see this and hence want to learn it, and go out of their way to learn it. But unfortunately not everyone can see a subjects value, so perhaps we (by that i mean teachers) should show them.

 

[u-borat]

roflmao, english has more uses in life than any other subject.
you live in AUSTRALIA. THE LANGUAGE IN AUSTRALIA IS ENGLISH FFS.

unless you plain on living life indoors by yourself for the rest of your life, english is far more useful than anything else.

 

[prichardson]

Perhaps then the school (particularly the teachers) should show students more applications of where the things they are learning in class are applicable in their future and current lives.

A good and eager student should automatically see this and hence want to learn it, and go out of their way to learn it. But unfortunately not everyone can see a subjects value, so perhaps we (by that i mean teachers) should show them.

Good call, question is; can it be done?

 

[u-borat]

question; what kind of gimp rants about english and does english extension?

 

[scaredytiger]

And based on previous posts I have identified that HSC English [at least, HSC Advanced English... ESL certainly does] doesn't have a use for anyone.

it actually does.

its there to teach you the skills to see the purpose behind things. most of the modules are on fictional texts, but those skills (if learnt properly) translate to advertising and other media.

i mean, look at today tonight - thats pure hyperbole.
look at the news - thats silencing certain views, for a dominant one.

it also teaches you essay writing for what purpose is required. which you need for pretty much any assignment in university.

my god, i have no problems with the skill base it requires.

 

[prichardson]

roflmao, english has more uses in life than any other subject.
you live in AUSTRALIA. THE LANGUAGE IN AUSTRALIA IS ENGLISH FFS.

unless you plain on living life indoors by yourself for the rest of your life, english is far more useful than anything else.

Maybe if you read the thread (especially since I've pretty much said it on each page) then you'd know my response to that.

And at some stage I do plan on moving out of home and living indoors. But aside from that I have made mention especially to the fact that interaction with other people makes you a far better communicator than HSC English, which has nothing more than interaction with a page... and also, doesn't deal with anything on the spoken side of English (apart from speeches, but a) I can do those for other subjects, and b) knowing how to talk to people is different from preparing a speech).

question; what kind of gimp rants about english and does english extension?

I assume you're talking about me. I don't do English Extension. I did last year, actually, in the hope that it would be more philosophical and allow the student to form their own interpretations of things of their own choice. But it wasn't, and by the end of Pygmalion I knew that, so I did my yearly exam and dropped it.

 

[patty4848]

You can't say that same thing about maths or the sciences or anything else, because those are all subjects which you pick which will contribute to your desired future, and they are also subjects which involve skills which are applicable to some later life/career choice which cannot be found elsewhere.

And based on previous posts I have identified that HSC English [at least, HSC Advanced English... ESL certainly does] doesn't have a use for anyone.

Also, I like to think about why I do things, I tend to think that type of thing stops me from becoming a machine.

2 or 3 of the people on this thread who have said that English sucks [out of not many more, who haven't even said if they're doing well in it, so we don't know, the might be], such as myself, have also said that they are doing well in it. The thread isn't long, why don't you read it?

Doesn't have a use for anyone???
2 or 3 of the people on this thread have already said that its been very helpful in their later life in uni and post-tertiary life. The thread isn't long, why don't you read it?

The topics in English are not designed so that when we are old and grey we will know how powerplay is represented in Antony and Cleopatra or how Emma is transformed into Clueless. They are designed to teach us about writing with a purpose, for a specific audience and in a specific context.

Nobody can disagree with this, but no greater subject is more valuable in post-secondary-school life than English. Its the principles and outcomes behind the topics that benefit you. That is why it is compulsory and that is why people like yourself should stop whinging and whining about English being pointless. You believe English is pointless to you. Your employer won't!

 

[prichardson]

it actually does.

its there to teach you the skills to see the purpose behind things. most of the modules are on fictional texts, but those skills (if learnt properly) translate to advertising and other media.

i mean, look at today tonight - thats pure hyperbole.
look at the news - thats silencing certain views, for a dominant one.

it also teaches you essay writing for what purpose is required. which you need for pretty much any assignment in university.

my god, i have no problems with the skill base it requires.

I still disagree, although you have made some good points.

So, you've given an example of something it might help for - why does the study on BNW, for example, help this? Why don't they have certain outcomes of the course in mind, and manipulate the course so that it is ALL useful to those outcomes.

Who cares that Today Tonight is a hyperbole; without HSC English, I would still be able to know that it was a hyperbole even if I was unaware of that label. And it's not a very good reason to do English...

I've already stated that on the topic of essay writing, it differs for every subject. History prepares you much better for writing an Arts essay that English ever does. In fact, the undisputable best subject for it relevance to tertiary study is History Extention.

And the skills that English require I also have no problem with, which perhaps is why I think that HSC English is a drain.

Doesn't have a use for anyone???
2 or 3 of the people on this thread have already said that its been very helpful in their later life in uni and post-tertiary life. The thread isn't long, why don't you read it?

The topics in English are not designed so that when we are old and grey we will know how powerplay is represented in Antony and Cleopatra or how Emma is transformed into Clueless. They are designed to teach us about writing with a purpose, for a specific audience and in a specific context.

Nobody can disagree with this, but no greater subject is more valuable in post-secondary-school life than English. Its the principles and outcomes behind the topics that benefit you. That is why it is compulsory and that is why people like yourself should stop whinging and whining about English being pointless. You believe English is pointless to you. Your employer won't!

And I've said to those 2 or 3 people that they could have aquired those skills elsewhere, therefore still rendering English superfluous. If you were able to comprehend what I've been saying, you would have been able to answer that for yourself. Or maybe you haven't read the thread?

So why can't English be designed for specific contexts which might relate to tertiary study and careeers? There are much simpler and therefore better ways to teach a person how to write for a specific audience and context.

Which part of the HSC English course is currently helping you in your post-school life that could not be found elsewhere? And so I continue to complain about English. And would you like to advise me as to which employer cares that you know how Gwen Harwood uses themes of nature in her poetry? None that I know of. Employers care about a mark. A different English course would also give a mark, as would a different subject if you did not have to do English.

 

[u-borat]

so please enlighten me, what's the point of every other subject?
how does physics/eco/whatever help you in any way?

 

[me121]

Good call, question is; can it be done?

Well, from my personal experience, the best teachers at doing this are the ones that have been teaching for ages with heaps of experience, and those teacher's who have actually worked in the industry they are teaching.

Unfortunately you have to be very lucky to get a teacher like this, but that doesn't mean it can't be done with even the newest teachers to the job with no industry experience.

I'm not just talking about English here, its applicable to all subjects. For example in maths I'm always wondering about off-syllabus interesting topics that I need for other subjects or other random ideas I have. But so many of these problems rely on many aspects of maths that we were taught at school.

But I have to be careful what I say here, because everyone is so used to their teacher saying "you need to be able to write essays for uni, or you need to be able to write reports for the workplace, or you need Pythagoras theorem for being a builder." Although, even me, would not take much notice of this. It is not until you show the student exactly how it can be used and get them to work on the problem that they realise, hey, this is really good and useful stuff, I want to learn it!

Personally I think English is harder than some subject area's to do this, and since I am no expert at English I will not try to provide examples.

 

[scaredytiger]

I still disagree, although you have made some good points.

So, you've given an example of something it might help for - why does the study on BNW, for example, help this?

tell me what BNW stands for and i might be able to.

 

[charlesdinio]

Aerath, I agree to an extent, I am doing pretty average in the subject, this isn't my point though.

If I did any other subject and screwed it up (as you listed a few) I would have myself to blame, because I chose them, but I did not pick english! Which is my point.

It really isn't necessary to life.

And you may say, nor is maths? As someone pointed out, but I chose to do maths because I'm interested (by the way, I dont do too well at maths either, but I still love it )

My proposal, which has no hope of getting anywhere because the Board of Studies are ignorant, is that english can remain compulsory, but don't make it compulsory to count to the best 10 units if it's not strong.

That way we are still studing 'english' but dont necessarily have to be interested. Afterall, dont they encourage choice at the BOS?

For the record - Shakespeare is a waste of time. His language is dead. Read if you want, but dont bore the rest of us with it.

 

[kaz1]

My summary of English:

English is crap and I don't want to analyze texts. I want to drop it.

 

[charlesdinio]

You are a waste of life. But frankly my dear, I don't give a damn.

Moreover, English is probably the most fun HSC subject and definitely worth studying. I say this as somebody who did 4 unit maths and is doing computer science at uni.

ahahahaha.

mate.

"english is the most fun subject"

Either QUIT or get a life.

 

[scaredytiger]

Aerath, I agree to an extent, I am doing pretty average in the subject, this isn't my point though.

If I did any other subject and screwed it up (as you listed a few) I would have myself to blame, because I chose them, but I did not pick english! Which is my point.

It really isn't necessary to life.

it teaches you to express yourself well and analyse appropriate to context. i think it might be.

And you may say, nor is maths? As someone pointed out, but I chose to do maths because I'm interested (by the way, I dont do too well at maths either, but I still love it )

maths is also vital, not only in its pure form, but in honing problem solving skills.

My proposal, which has no hope of getting anywhere because the Board of Studies are ignorant, is that english can remain compulsory, but don't make it compulsory to count to the best 10 units if it's not strong.

That way we are still studing 'english' but dont necessarily have to be interested. Afterall, dont they encourage choice at the BOS?

english is compulsory to be counted towards your UAI because it uses skills that are applicable to all university courses.

For the record - Shakespeare is a waste of time. His language is dead. Read if you want, but dont bore the rest of us with it.

shakespeare was a major influence on the language we speak today. it is also one of the best sources of figurative language, as well as playing with syntax and double entendre.

study of shakespeare contextualises our language and allows you to see how language can be utilised to effect.

 

[charlesdinio]

It teaches you to expess yourself?!

Legal studies teaches you how to put together a legal argument.
PDHPE teaches you how to maintain good health.
Business teaches you how to manage business.

And so, english teaches you to express yourself? Personally, I think learning good health is more important, why not make PE compulsory?

Maths IS vital in a problem solving sense, your right, but you can get through life without it. You can get through life without the HSC, my argument is that english is not necessary to the point in making it compulsory.

And if english is important in all uni courses, think again! I've spoken to MANY students, who say it has absolutely no use.

My two sisters study medicine/ law and law, and neither of them see the relevance in english and are still managing great marks.

Shakespeare WAS a major influence, lets give him a clap and move on to the 21st century.

We studied powerplay, I can PROMISE you that when I leave school, I wont need to know, nor will want to learn what powerplay is and how it is relevant to Shakespeare.

 

[scaredytiger]

my sister also studied law. and her teachers were horrible at english. and she still cannot write grammatically correct.

i think that might be important.

yeah sure, you can get through life without any schooling. but there are educated norms of vocabulary, logic and general intelligence.

last time i checked, parents were supposed to teach good health.

legal studies is pretty much useless to a law student - ive heard this from several law students.

english's relevancy is not about the content. a lot of people will not understand what they have actually learnt from doing the course, and some will only understand 5-10 years later.

 

[bored of sc]

Re: Anyone else hate English as much as me?

Anyone else sick of English or is it just me?
Ment to be doing an assignment right now...
Anyone know anything good about Physical Journeys?
Merry Christmas

You used grammar, question, ellipsis, capitalisation, syntax, spelling, the English language, nouns, verbs and adjectives to contruct your post so I believe the language skills developed in English are absolutely paramount.

 

[prichardson]

so please enlighten me, what's the point of every other subject?
how does physics/eco/whatever help you in any way?

Physics... not sure exactly since I don't do it, but like the sciences it applies to post-school education and careers as whichever few sciences relate to physics.

Economics is a very bad example for you to use, very very bad. Not only are there a whole plathera of mainstream jobs which involve economics, but also for any sort of personal fund management (ie. doing your own tax) applies to economics.

[EDIT] -oh... and you also have the choice to do those subjects.

tell me what BNW stands for and i might be able to.

Ummm... it's about a dystopian society which suppresses the individual and so on.

Anyway, obviously it serves as a good warning to humanity, but why can't I just read the book?

 

[scaredytiger]

ummm...because youre supposed to know HOW that has been done.

already said that its not about the content.