Israel preparing strike against Iran (3 Viewers)

[Trefoil]

So does Palestine.

I agree with the whole pacifist approach, but if the problem is to be solved, it must take to heart, the interest of all those who call/ed the land that Israel is on, home.
So...does anyone have any ideas how to solve this issue?
Something practical, and one that does not require mass death and destruction please.

Well, for a start, Palestine's neighbours could let Palestinians migrate there.

All Arab states currently ban Palestinian immigration.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

^You might then want Israel to allow practical Palestinian migration into Palestine. We can claim Israel later. I mean Gaza, the ENTIRE West Bank, Golan Heights and all of East Jerusalem. Currently Israel does not allow a lot of migration there, nor do they allow supplies to reach these territories. Stop being a dumb fuck Trefoil and wake up. For a start, Israel can do something, since they're the root of the problems.

The point is that medieval thinking like yours (assuming youre genuine) prevents a satisfactory solution and prolongs the violence.

No. If Jews simply got on boats and headed back to where they came from, all would be settled without violence. You all seem to be caught in this little sphere where it is inconceivable to you all that Israel ceases to exist. It has been a little over 100 years since Jews started mass migration into Palestine. This is not a long time. A return of Palestine to Palestinians should still be on the table.

A two state solution is the next best thing to the utter anihiliation of Israel. For the time being, I am a vigorous supporter of the two state solution. No-one can seriously not be. Israel must vacate Palestinian territories, meaning ALL Palestinian territories. Trade to and from Palestine must be allowed. Supplies must be able to reach Palestinian territories. No more blockades must be allowed. Palestine must NOT be dimilitarised. To do so simply makes it the bitch of Israel and will provoke the situation further.

If these things are done then all would be well for the time being. For ever? Well, we'll see. Sadly ISRAEL DOES NOT ALLOW ANY OF THIS TO HAPPEN.

Israel has a right to exist

How so? So far as I can tell, the Jews just kinda moved in there, the UN declared it to be a nation and the Arabs who used to live there were told to live with it. You acknowledge this, Iron?

Take a leaf out of Mandella or Ghandi's book. Islam's a religion of peace, right?

I honestly couldn't give a fuck. I'm an agnostic white male. My beef with Israel has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with morals and reason.

 

[Trefoil]

How about instead being a shithouse bastard and promoting terrorism, you take a leaf out of Mandella or Ghandi's book, Neb.

(Sorry to plagiarise you Iron, but he just totally ignored you and claimed they're not relevant because he's not religious.)

 

[JaredR]

Am Yisroel Chai!

 

[rasengan90]

No. If Jews simply got on boats and headed back to where they came from, all would be settled without violence. You all seem to be caught in this little sphere where it is inconceivable to you all that Israel ceases to exist. It has been a little over 100 years since Jews started mass migration into Palestine. This is not a long time. A return of Palestine to Palestinians should still be on the table.

Are you Aboriginal? No? Then gtfo of the country you were born in, hold citizenship to, have a family in and go back to your ancestral homeland which you have never stepped foot in. Leave Australia to the Aboriginies.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

Are you Aboriginal? No? Then gtfo of the country you were born in, hold citizenship to, have a family in and go back to your ancestral homeland which you have never stepped foot in. Leave Australia to the Aboriginies.

k mang.

Does this make what the Israelis have done any less wrong though. :rofl:

How about instead being a shithouse bastard and promoting terrorism, you take a leaf out of Mandella or Ghandi's book, Neb.

K TREFOIL LOL. You're the shittest BoS member ever and whenever an Israel related topic comes up you sit there and throw out random replies that mean shit. Go suck a circumsized cock. I've responded in full, you've sat there and rammed your head against the wall like a douche.

And I've never promoted terrorism, but whatever demonises the sensible points of view offered by those who haven't been indoctrinated by the Zionist cause. :rofl:

 

[Trefoil]

I've never promoted terrorism

Um, you do it all the time. You even said the Mumbai attacks would be completely justifiable if it were for a "good cause" like fighting "Western oppression".

You're basically just a completely deranged individual. You sit there on your computer seething with white guilt and preaching about the benefits of socialism and the evils of Israel. It's sickening.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

Um, you do it all the time. You even said the Mumbai attacks would be completely justifiable if it were for a "good cause" like fighting "Western oppression".

Yeah I responded to that but eh, sedition laws are not my friend. I'm pretty harmless but I don't want to break the law.

And I didn't list western oppression as a reason. Is it fun to make stuff up, Trefoil? You're no good at arguing for the Zionist cause so you just make stuff up. Is it good fun?

An example of a good reason might be genocide.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

You're basically just a completely deranged individual. You sit there on your computer seething with white guilt and preaching about the benefits of socialism and the evils of Israel. It's sickening.

Not only this, but I attend rallies, distribute petitions and engage in other utterly useless activities!

 

[Zephyrio]

I personally disagree with the UN creating the state of Israel, but replacing an injustice with another would only be an idiot's option. How the hell is destroying Israel going to be a viable option?

And yeah, Israel should treat the Palestinians better. Digging through what the media puts out can show you heaps of stuff Israel's doing tantamount to blatant discrimination and provocation.

 

[Ben Netanyahu]

So does Palestine.

I agree with the whole pacifist approach, but if the problem is to be solved, it must take to heart, the interest of all those who call/ed the land that Israel is on, home.
So...does anyone have any ideas how to solve this issue?
Something practical, and one that does not require mass death and destruction please.

I, as the leader of the soon-to-be-elected Likud party have devised the following Israel/Palestine peace strategy:

1. Build giant wall around Palestine
2. Gas Arabs
3. Assume control of Palestinian territories.

 

[Zephyrio]

K now I think this whole subforum is run by trolls and writers from encyclopaediadramatica.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

^I've said about a thousand times before that my opposition to Israel is very genuine. I might be trolling a big with insinuations about pork and utter destruction of Israel, but my opposition to the existence of Israel in the long term is very, very genuine.

 

[Iron]

No. If Jews simply got on boats and headed back to where they came from, all would be settled without violence. You all seem to be caught in this little sphere where it is inconceivable to you all that Israel ceases to exist. It has been a little over 100 years since Jews started mass migration into Palestine. This is not a long time. A return of Palestine to Palestinians should still be on the table.

A two state solution is the next best thing to the utter anihiliation of Israel. For the time being, I am a vigorous supporter of the two state solution. No-one can seriously not be. Israel must vacate Palestinian territories, meaning ALL Palestinian territories. Trade to and from Palestine must be allowed. Supplies must be able to reach Palestinian territories. No more blockades must be allowed. Palestine must NOT be dimilitarised. To do so simply makes it the bitch of Israel and will provoke the situation further.

If these things are done then all would be well for the time being. For ever? Well, we'll see. Sadly ISRAEL DOES NOT ALLOW ANY OF THIS TO HAPPEN.

How so? So far as I can tell, the Jews just kinda moved in there, the UN declared it to be a nation and the Arabs who used to live there were told to live with it. You acknowledge this, Iron?

I honestly couldn't give a fuck. I'm an agnostic white male. My beef with Israel has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with morals and reason.

How could you be so small-minded as to say that the entire area is Palestinian and anything else is invalid? You realise that there was a history before your pre-1948 nirvana, right? I'd be surprised if there was a strip of land that has had so many different owners throughout history. In my opinion, virtually no ownership of the land has crystalized beyond the ancient Jewish claim. It's the oldest, most mythic, most nationalistic claim in human history. The Jewish claim is superior in terms of time, culture and power linked to the land.

And I like how you generously list a bunch of demands on Israel and fall silent on Palestinian obligations. How can you not understand that Israel has been essentially acting for its own security, and not for a sinister desire to torture a supposedly harmless people? Why are you silent on the religious and racial elements that your criticism is tied up in and that blocks a sensible solution? To even claim that your refusal to renounce violence is based on "morals" and "reason" is beyond a joke.

The two state solution is the only one. Anything else is murder

 

[Zephyrio]

^I've said about a thousand times before that my opposition to Israel is very genuine. I might be trolling a big with insinuations about pork and utter destruction of Israel, but my opposition to the existence of Israel in the long term is very, very genuine.

So you don't actually think that destroying Israel should be a solution? Or should that still be on the table?

Personally I disagree with the state of Israel and the way in which it was conceived but it's a reality I've got to live with.

 

[westronham]

A two state solution is the next best thing to the utter anihiliation of Israel. For the time being, I am a vigorous supporter of the two state solution. No-one can seriously not be. Israel must vacate Palestinian territories, meaning ALL Palestinian territories. Trade to and from Palestine must be allowed. Supplies must be able to reach Palestinian territories. No more blockades must be allowed. Palestine must NOT be dimilitarised. To do so simply makes it the bitch of Israel and will provoke the situation further.

If these things are done then all would be well for the time being. For ever? Well, we'll see. Sadly ISRAEL DOES NOT ALLOW ANY OF THIS TO HAPPEN.

A two-state solution was proposed back in 1947. The Arabs declined....

 

[Zephyrio]

A two-state solution was proposed back in 1947. The Arabs declined....

Who wouldn't have?

Taking the punishment for something you had nothing to do with - that's unbearable for most/all people.

 

[Zephyrio]

How could you be so small-minded as to say that the entire area is Palestinian and anything else is invalid? You realise that there was a history before your pre-1948 nirvana, right? I'd be surprised if there was a strip of land that has had so many different owners throughout history. In my opinion, virtually no ownership of the land has crystalized beyond the ancient Jewish claim. It's the oldest, most mythic, most nationalistic claim in human history. The Jewish claim is superior in terms of time, culture and power linked to the land.

And I like how you generously list a bunch of demands on Israel and fall silent on Palestinian obligations. How can you not understand that Israel has been essentially acting for its own security, and not for a sinister desire to torture a supposedly harmless people? Why are you silent on the religious and racial elements that your criticism is tied up in and that blocks a sensible solution? To even claim that your refusal to renounce violence is based on "morals" and "reason" is beyond a joke.

The two state solution is the only one. Anything else is murder

However I would have problems accepting your notion that the Jewish claim to that area is the most valid for time, culture and power. After all, many Jews who were involved in the Holocaust were not born in Israel - they were Yiddish, part of the generations of Jews who'd been born in Europe and elsewhere... who didn't know Hebrew. I would argue that their claim to the land would not be as strong as a Palestinian family who'd been farmers in current Israel for ages and ages, since the Diaspora. There's a strong difference, one that needs to be acknowledged. Many of those who came back to Israel did so because it was the only place they felt safe (ironically); their ties to their religious homeland...? I would question that and its supposed superiority to the aforementioned lineage of farmers who cultivated what is now Israeli soil.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

A two-state solution was proposed back in 1947. The Arabs declined....

Yes I can picture it now.

UN: Ok Arabs. You've been living here for centuries. Jews want to live here now. Please divide your territory into two so the Jews can occupy one half.
Arabs: ...

So you don't actually think that destroying Israel should be a solution? Or should that still be on the table?

Destruction? No. But I do support the eradication, I suppose, of Israel. Long term. See, thing is, trolling aside I'm generally not someone who likes war or violence or whatever, and would prefer to see almost anything in place of violence. If you refuse to acknowledge a country for very good reasons (which have not as of yet been confronted on this forum, and some pro-Israeli members have been so kind as to admit that I'm quite right), then it would be somewhat odd to say that you support its permanent foundation in the land it is occupying. I would like to see Israel gone from the Mid-East and returned to its rightful owners. This will take time. For the time being, a two-state solution is the only way to go.

How could you be so small-minded as to say that the entire area is Palestinian and anything else is invalid? You realise that there was a history before your pre-1948 nirvana, right?

Yes. In 1880 or so Jews began mass migration into Palestine, which caused problems. In the early 1900's Britain took control and limited Jewish migration. The Jews did not enjoy this. Post-WWII the UN decided to divide Palestine in two.

In my opinion, virtually no ownership of the land has crystalized beyond the ancient Jewish claim. It's the oldest, most mythic, most nationalistic claim in human history. The Jewish claim is superior in terms of time, culture and power linked to the land.

lol troll. I see through your facade Iron. But no seriously. See, thing is, Arabs had been living there for an awfully long time.

And I like how you generously list a bunch of demands on Israel and fall silent on Palestinian obligations.

Palestinian obligations include the protection of its own borders and of Israel's borders, preventing rocket attacks on Jewish soil. Generally acting as a proper nation with interests.

How can you not understand that Israel has been essentially acting for its own security, and not for a sinister desire to torture a supposedly harmless people?

Security in a palce where they ought not be, Iron. It is quite simple, really. See, if I walked into your house and began pelting knives at you, this would not be defense, it would be offense and should not be tolerated.

How can you not understand that Palestine has been acting for its own security, hmm?

Why are you silent on the religious and racial elements that your criticism is tied up in and that blocks a sensible solution?

Because it warrants no further explanation? Not really much that can be done about it. One half are Jewish, the other half are Arab. Both sides are violent.

 

[Nebuchanezzar]

This discussion is thankfully become serious! BoS anti-Israel league unite!

Water!