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Labor's Future (2 Viewers)

Generator

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Leaving sam04u behind...

The Conversation Hour - John Black and Clive Hamilton

Former Labor Party Senator John Black and Australia Institute Executive Director Clive Hamilton share a significant interest in the future of the Australian Labor Party - and it seems in their eyes, the future may not be all that good, with Clive Hamilton suggesting in his recent Quarterly Essay, "What's Left?", that "The Australian Labor Party has served its historical purposes and will wither and die as the progressive force of Australian politics."
The above link provides both a brief overview and a few links to a recording of the conversation.
 

Generator

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Insight (SBS) - 'Labor Pains'. For those who aren't watching it right now, I'll post up a link to the transcript sometime tomorrow.
 

Iron

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It was ok. Fairly elementary though. Unfortunately they cowered away from bigger analysis about general political apathy etc. (from what I saw)
Glaring absence of Kim. Would've gone off with Latham.

But im just jaded because I couldnt pursue my impure thoughts r.e. Jenny Brockie
 

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To me it was as though some of those representing the ALP were completely oblivious to the idea of political apathy and the true extent of the 'problem'. For example, when one of the voters said that for him it was purely a case of voting for John Howard and nothing else, one of the women representing the ALP went on to say something about the issue not being that simple - to me, for many the issue is that simple, and to suggest otherwise is nothing more than an expression of political naivety (in an Australian sense, that is). I should point out that I'm not disputing the idea that the issue is quite complex, rather I just don't agree with the point of view that rejects the centrality of the leadership issue out of hand. Of course, I do realise that many, if not all, would have been careful not to speak ill of Big Kim, but still, my point still stands (till I read the transcript, anyway).

It's an interesting problem, really. On the one hand the ALP must lose the messiah complex and create (and promote) decent policies, yet at the same time they must effectively counter John Howard as a leader by offering their own alternative.

On a final note, I should also say that though I consider political apathy to be a problem, I know that there are many (both politically-active and politcally-apathetic) who disagree.
 

Iron

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I sincerely cant find a solution until Howard leaves (under his own steam). There is just no better alternative. I mean, even if Labor's wet dream were to occur tomorrow - a huge jump in interest rates - Howard/Costello would still be seen as best capable to manage the crisis. The millions of proles who would lose their homes and irresponsible lifestyle (credit is an institution more solid than slavery), would flock to the Libs in desporation, while Kim would support any move of the governemnt in shock.

Under Howard, the Liberal Party has really reasserted itself as the natural party of government: with its pragmatism, structure and consistency.
Times are good, and Australians are conservative, but Labor is utterly rotten. People are entitled to be apathetic. The talent is going to the private sector now and the non-union team wins by default.
 

Enlightened_One

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Not a bad cartoon. A Paul Jennings is credited with the voices. I wonder if it's the author Paul Jennings.

Nothing actually constructive to political argument to add. It has been summed up already that Labor is stuffed unless it reasserts itself drastically.
 

MoonlightSonata

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No way out
The Australian - May 6, 2006


Labor's leadership dilemma has become excruciating. Political editor Dennis Shanahan reports on the next moves.

RIGHT now Labor can't win an election with Kim Beazley as leader. Neither can it win an election without him as leader. Even as a losing bet, Beazley is Labor's best bet. There is no doubt Beazley's leadership is under enormous pressure from within the broader church of the ALP and the labour movement. [...]

Full Article
Labor's woes.
 

Iron

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KEATING! 7.30 REPORT!
Fly you fools! Fly!
 

Iron

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Aaah. Still got it. What a legend.
Pity he hasn't been able to take on a Clinton-esque role for Labor.
All those numbers were making Kerry swoon and blush like a little school-girl. Serious bedroom eyes going on.
<lights cigarette>
 

erawamai

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Iron said:
Aaah. Still got it. What a legend.
Pity he hasn't been able to take on a Clinton-esque role for Labor.
All those numbers were making Kerry swoon and blush like a little school-girl. Serious bedroom eyes going on.
<lights cigarette>
Hahaha. On many points he is very right. Federal Labor has been weak to counter and give explanations to counter Howards continual evocation of the ALP in government a 13 to 20 years ago.
 
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http://au.news.yahoo.com/060513/2/yy2j.html
NSW Premier Morris Iemma says Bill Shorten would make a good federal Labor leader - but not yet.

Senior members of Mr Iemma's powerful NSW Right faction of the ALP want the Australian Workers' Union national secretary to enter parliament before the next federal election, The Daily Telegraph newspaper reported.
*sigh*

Labor fetishists are once again jumping the gun. They are falling into exactly the same trap that they did with Latham.


"Wow, a new face.. Any face besides howards has got to be good. Therefore, wow, i'm baracking for this new dude... Even though i've barely even heard him speak or know anything about him.. He's NOT John Howard, and that's all that matters! *has an orgasm*"

At least Iemma is taking an OK approach about it. That said; someone who people have never heard speak before (a person randomly picked off the street for example) would have more chance of being elected than Beazely ever would.
 

Iron

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TerrbleSpellor said:
*sigh*

Labor fetishists are once again jumping the gun. They are falling into exactly the same trap that they did with Latham.


"Wow, a new face.. Any face besides howards has got to be good. Therefore, wow, i'm baracking for this new dude... Even though i've barely even heard him speak or know anything about him.. He's NOT John Howard, and that's all that matters! *has an orgasm*"

At least Iemma is taking an OK approach about it. That said; someone who people have never heard speak before (a person randomly picked off the street for example) would have more chance of being elected than Beazely ever would.
Shorten is Labor's candidate for their safe seat of Maribyrnong next election, fool.
Other than your fallacies, im not engaging with such baseless inflammation.
 

Optophobia

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He's not contesting his ability to be elected (FFS, Peter Garret got elected. As long as its labor, some pathetic electorates will always vote that way).

He's contesting his ability to get the faith of Australians to become a Prime Minister. Its unlikely, but labor followers are just hoping to strike it lucky.
 

Iron

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Shorten has the talent and ability. Make the case against him, or zip it.
 

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