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Muhammad Cartoon Controversy (5 Viewers)

veterandoggy

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davin said:
is anyone else angry that one of the cartoons obviously says that all muslims keep oranges on their heads?



and i'm not Jewish, but I recall that i had matza once
i didnt really look at the pictures carefully, i did a quick scan so that if someone talked about one of them i knew which one they were talking about.

all muslims eh? hmmm......
 

davin

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well, if the bomb is saying that all muslims are terrorists, supposedly, then the one of an orange on his turban likewise implies that all muslims have oranges on their heads.
 

Simpson Freak

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"I've suggested that the purpose of the cartoon was the illustrate the way in which muhammed's teachings have been hijacked by these terrorists - it seems to fit in better with the nature of the article it accompanied."

I have agreed with you on alot in this particular thread, but you cant seriously believe that these cartoons came out as a way of saying "mohammad wouldnt want this".......the message is clear "mohammad condones and inspires this"

It took a week or so for governments to say what i and many others were saying from the beginning. I orginally said that the main reason there is all this violence only because of cartoons was not because they are just so outrageously insulting that any non-muslim is too ignorant to understand, but rather it was just an excuse or trigger or spark that blew up this powder keg of disdain to the west.

the US government finally announced that it will be investigating whether this violence was fuelled by the influence of extremists, i think that would have been the obvious starting point, but many seemed to think (especially at the first few pages of this thread) that muslims were just angry that they were being mocked.

also there are countries like syria and iran that are supporting the violence just so the people support the dictators.

i hope we can all now acknowledge that the violence is wrong and motivated by a deep rooted mistrust of the west (well especially in middle eastern countries, you dont see any australians or americans violently protesting because they were published in europe). its not purely a thing of "insult us and die"

that said, that does NOT mean that the Danish newspaper was the angel in all of this. why should freedom speech mean reckless spouting of inflamatory communication.

the media was irresponsible, what good could have possibly came out of this, if they truly wanted the extremist "muslims" to look at themselves and how they are not following the life of mohammad, there would have been far better ways than showing him with a bomb on his head. the foreign minister for pakistan had a good point, she said that the newspaper was extremely insensitive or just ignorant.

i saw news reports where many jews and christians also show disdain to such "freedom" since it basically insights violence. the "muslim" world and the west have not been the best of buddies at late for a few ignoramouses to start mocking the other, just giving the "crazies" an excuse and actually allowing them to recruit more people into their terrorist cells.

You here of political correctness gone mad, but if "freedom" causes all this, i think it would be better for some level of control to what some whack thinks he wants to say.

Gavarillo Princip killed Franz Ferdinand, but he should not be eternally tortured for triggering World War 1. Similarly, the danish cartoons made mindless and mocking signals, where extremists can hi-jack them, just like the teachings of mohammad, and use it to their own ends. They use a protest against denmark to say "death to europe" and "death to america" even though it is basically targetted against denmark.

a far more annoying thing is, people say muslims (thats the billion of us) should NOT be offended to such a scale since "we" were not so angry after 9/11 and Bali. Such comments are stupid and only reinforce the image that a billion muslims support the actions of a few "crazies" that blow themselves up. heck it was the WORLD trade centre, i heard that there were some muslims (i think from turkey or sumthing) that were killed, to these terrorists no price is too big just so they can get 24/7 air time, at the end of the day the terrorists win because we report their actions and thats just what they want.

i heard a few "crazies" its okay for children to be blown up since they are innocent and won't go to hell or anything. and then he said a few muslims blown up in a bus full of jews is worth it.....like the guy is a hack and is lost (kinda like george lucas) but such comments liken the mainstream muslims to the few fanatics.
 

ihavenothing

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I don't see how the cartoon is critical of Islam itself, only Mohammed who seems to be connected to it as its prophet but he is NOT Islam. And you have to admit that it is impossible for his parents to be Muslims as they died before he even started hallucinating and writing the Koran (apparently).
 

Simpson Freak

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davin said:
is anyone else angry that one of the cartoons obviously says that all muslims keep oranges on their heads?



and i'm not Jewish, but I recall that i had matza once
again thats not really the point, i bet if a guy said "islam" accidently in a news broadcast....al-jazeera will make it look like it making fun, and extremists will try and use it to gain support and justify more bloodshed.
 

HotShot

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davin said:
well, if the bomb is saying that all muslims are terrorists, supposedly, then the one of an orange on his turban likewise implies that all muslims have oranges on their heads.
yes thats what it implies, i was wondering though, if you have an orange on your head are u a muslim?

Iran to publish Holocaust cartoons (Contest)
Agence France-Presse ^ | February 6, 2006


Posted on 02/06/2006 6:32:56 PM PST by RWR8189



IRAN'S largest selling newspaper announced today it was holding a contest on cartoons of the Holocaust in response to the publishing in European papers of caricatures of the Prophet Mohammed. "It will be an international cartoon contest about the Holocaust," said Farid Mortazavi, the graphics editor for Hamshahri newspaper - which is published by Teheran's conservative municipality.

He said the plan was to turn the tables on the assertion that newspapers can print offensive material in the name of freedom of expression.

"The Western papers printed these sacrilegious cartoons on the pretext of freedom of expression, so let's see if they mean what they say and also print these Holocaust cartoons," he said.

Iran's fiercely anti-Israeli regime is supportive of so-called Holocaust revisionist historians, who maintain the systematic slaughter by the Nazis of mainland Europe's Jews as well as other groups during World War II has been either invented or exaggerated.

Iran's hardline President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad prompted international anger when he dismissed the systematic slaughter by the Nazis of mainland Europe's Jews as a "myth" used to justify the creation of Israel.


Mr Mortazavi said tomorrow's edition of the paper will invite cartoonists to enter the competition, with "private individuals" offering gold coins to the best 12 artists - the same number of cartoons that appeared in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten.
Last week, the Iranian foreign ministry also invited British Prime Minister Tony Blair to Teheran to take part in a planned conference on the Holocaust, even though the idea has been branded by Mr Blair as "shocking, ridiculous, stupid".

Mr Blair also said Mr Ahmadinejad "should come and see the evidence of the Holocaust himself in the countries of Europe", to which Iran responded by saying it was willing to send a team of "independent investigators".
 

Simpson Freak

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ihavenothing said:
I don't see how the cartoon is critical of Islam itself, only Mohammed who seems to be connected to it as its prophet but he is NOT Islam. And you have to admit that it is impossible for his parents to be Muslims as they died before he even started hallucinating and writing the Koran (apparently).
Don't see it? or don't want to. But then again you are actually having signatures that are supporting denmark, you do realise it is their ignorance and/or insensitiveness that caused this whole thing. THEY KNEW THERE ARE TERRORISTS OUT THERE, AND THEY KNEW THAT THEY WOULDNT BE TOO HAPPY, THEY BASICALLY ASKED FOR MORE VIOLENCE INSTEAD OF TRYING TO MAKE PEACE AS SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TRIED TO DO.
 

HotShot

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Simpson Freak said:
Don't see it? or don't want to. But then again you are actually having signatures that are supporting denmark, you do realise it is their ignorance and/or insensitiveness that caused this whole thing. THEY KNEW THERE ARE TERRORISTS OUT THERE, AND THEY KNEW THAT THEY WOULDNT BE TOO HAPPY, THEY BASICALLY ASKED FOR MORE VIOLENCE INSTEAD OF TRYING TO MAKE PEACE AS SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TRIED TO DO.
SPOT ON!
 

davin

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how could a paper be asking for that when its not a major paper? if a MAJOR paper said this, then taht would be different, but this was a small paper in Denmark, in Danish, a language few outside the country speak.

I will say...Lebanon's violence that seemed out of place to me does make more sense now that it looks like Syria had a strong hand in the violence there, potentially
 

Not-That-Bright

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THEY KNEW THERE ARE TERRORISTS OUT THERE, AND THEY KNEW THAT THEY WOULDNT BE TOO HAPPY, THEY BASICALLY ASKED FOR MORE VIOLENCE INSTEAD OF TRYING TO MAKE PEACE AS SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TRIED TO DO.
They didn't ask for more violence, there is no one in the world that could have predicted the violence which has come as a matter of these cartoons.
 

ihavenothing

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Simpson Freak said:
Don't see it? or don't want to. But then again you are actually having signatures that are supporting denmark, you do realise it is their ignorance and/or insensitiveness that caused this whole thing. THEY KNEW THERE ARE TERRORISTS OUT THERE, AND THEY KNEW THAT THEY WOULDNT BE TOO HAPPY, THEY BASICALLY ASKED FOR MORE VIOLENCE INSTEAD OF TRYING TO MAKE PEACE AS SO MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE TRIED TO DO.
I doubt it, as it was a LOCAL paper that was unintended for people overseas and it may have been created for people to see how stupid and pointless religion is. If i had made pictures mocking pink flying elephants would it prompt such a violent backlash for people who claim they believe in that. It can also be outlined to understand such ridiculous reasons why people would resort to violence by criticising (supposedly) fictional characters.
 

Not-That-Bright

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Whatever i feel about the first newspapers that did it, i think it was stupid for the newspapers to continue to print it after they well knew the violence it had already caused (yes the people who are doing the violence/death threats are nutcases/terrorists). I actually think the issue should be more about the later newspapers that published the cartoons than the initial papers, who probably didnt know what it would cause.
The later newspapers were doing it in response to the protests against the danish newspaper and apparent attacks on free speech.

If you find YOURSELF (and not just some random stranger in a random country) getting blown up in a bus as revenge for the cartoons, i bet then you would have prefered that those later newspapers just didnt publish those cartoons.
Yeah perhaps, but at the same time I imagine i'd be more pissed off at the person whom actually did blow up the bus and the people that convinced him that was a good idea.

I think that says it well. We know we have freedom of speech, yet we should also understand that we can choose to not use it when it means it knowingly is disrespectful to something or someone.
What? So no disrespectful cartoons? This is the height of hypocricy...

By the way, for those of you whom continue to claim these protests were to be expected - please read this article.
Las Vegas Sun said:
COPENHAGEN, Denmark (AP) -

The Associated Press protested Wednesday the misleading inclusion of an AP photograph in a pamphlet purporting to show images offensive to Islam.

The picture shows a bearded man wearing fake pig ears, a pig nose, and a pink embroidered cap on his head. He was wearing the costume while participating in a pig-squealing contest at an annual festival in a farm village in southern France last summer.

The AP sent out the photo describing the pig-squealing contest on Aug. 14, 2005. The photo had no connection with Islam or the caricatures of the Prophet Muhammad published in a Danish newspaper in September.

A blurry, black-and-white copy of the picture was included in a brochure that a delegation of Danish Muslim leaders carried on a Mideast tour to Syria, Lebanon, Egypt and Turkey, in December and January.

"The photograph was taken at an agriculture fair last summer and is totally unrelated to the current controversy," said AP's Director of Photography Santiago Lyon.

Jack Stokes, an AP spokesman, said the picture was used "completely out of context and without permission.

"AP is attempting to contact the distributors of this unrelated photo to protest its misrepresentation and demand that they stop immediately," he said.

The brochure purported to show examples of anti-Muslim images from Europe, said Ahmed Akkari, a spokesman for the group. Included were 12 controversial drawings of the Prophet Muhammad that were published in Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten, he said.

The group received copies of the AP picture in threatening anonymous letters last year, Akkari said.

"We did not find it ourselves," he told the AP, saying he had been unaware of the origin of the photograph and said he believed it was sent to the group as an example of a provocation.

When told about the background of the original AP photo, Akkari said: "I have no comments."
http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/w-eur/2006/feb/08/020807856.html

For those of you whom want to see it ->



http://msnbcmedia.msn.com
 
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Generator

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Cyan_phoeniX said:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/02/02/gaza.cartoon/

heres something:

"CNN has CHOSEN to not show the cartoons out of RESPECT for Islam."

I think that says it well. We know we have freedom of speech, yet we should also understand that we can choose to not use it when it means it knowingly is disrespectful to something or someone. Thats at least what the later newspapers should have done. Even if they were not to be waivered by the violence of terrorists (who are just murderers anyway), they should feel more obliged to respect the millions of followers who are hurt by the cartoons portrayal of their prophet yet would not even think of being violent in response to it.
Where does it end, phoenix? If millions of Muslims are 'hurt' by poor political cartoons, then what about the many necons in the US, the Israelis, the Catholics, the Royalists, the socialists, the social democrats, the factional leaders, etc. who are in all likelihood just as hurt by the cartoons routinely published within other papers? Why should Islam stand above other ideologies?
 

ihavenothing

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Generator said:
Why should Islam stand above other ideologies?
Exactly, I don't particularly think it is a good ideology to work in practice inbetween issues about women's rights, apostasy, separation of church and state, homosexuality, pornography, slavery and freedom of speech and expression. But neither is Christianity, but at least most of it has been "watered down"
 

Not-That-Bright

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But neither is Christianity, but at least most of it has been "watered down"
I think you'll also notice that when it comes to a conflict between the interests of christianity and one of those ideals... christianity usually loses out.
 

Lundy

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Because Islam uses bully tactics to frighten people into a sort of false respect.
 

Not-That-Bright

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Lundy said:
Because Islam uses bully tactics to frighten people into a sort of false respect.
Which is EXACTLY what the danish article that accompanied the cartoons was about. People have censored themselves over islam because they're scared of the retaliations from islam... this is not a good or fair situation.
 
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Personally I think sign #1 that you're taking life, your shitty religion, and everything else much too seriously is when you feel the need to react violently to a cartoon.

Joke gone wrong or deliberate provocation, this response does not seem to fit with the fact that these individuals were protesting about the suggestion that they were part of an overtly violent faith, and I think that if anything these clowns have done the cause they attempted to champion yet another huge disservice.
 

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