Questions about ranks/UAI (1 Viewer)

[mirann]

So I've been hearing at school that, say:
I'm coming 3rd in..Ancient History this year, but I get the top mark in the HSC, the person coming 1st will get my mark and then I get theirs?
Is this correct?

Also, if I am not coming in the first half of my class say - for english adv I'm coming 40th out of 70 or something, will this completely affect my chances of doing well even if I get a very high mark for english in the HSC?

Third question!
Say my assessment mark total is 75 for a subject, but I get 95 for the HSC exam, is there a good chance my assessment mark will be pulled up closer to my HSC mark?

Any insights would be great thanks

 

[runnable]

Not quite true. If you get the highest external mark, that will become the 1st ranked's internal mark. While you keep your own external mark as your external portion and get your internal mark moderated and calculated.

 

[cem]

You keep your exam marks at all times.

Your cohorts internal marks are moderated by your exam marks as follows:

Students - A, B, C, D, E -

IA = Internal Assessment
EM = Exam Mark
MA = Moderated Assessment
FH = Final HSC


A - IA 93 - EM 91 - MA 92 - FH 92
B - IA 86 - EM 92 - MA 87 - FH 89
C - IA 82 - EM 88 - MA 84 - FH 86
D - IA 71 - EM 71 - MA 76 - FH 74
E - IA 48 - EM 68 - MA 68 - FH 68




The above example Students B, C, and D are moderated to keep the relative gaps for the moderated assessment mark based on the marks and gaps sent in by the school.

The exam determines the range of and total number of marks to be awarded to this class for their moderated assessment marks. The same number of marks is awarded for the moderated assessment as for the exam.

The exam marks are NOT just swapped around as that would make it meaningless to submit that actual assessment marks. If you look carefully at my example above you can see that Student A was 7 marks better than Student B in the assessment but in the final exam Student B was better than Student A by 1 mark. Simply giving Student B Student A's mark as the assessment mark would mean that Student B ended up being only 1 mark behind A in the school assessment mark but the school says that their is a 7 mark gap. This gap has to be preserved, bearing in mind that the is a smaller range of marks to be used as well. That is why the gap will close a bit but not to 1 mark.

This is also the case with the other marks.

NB I hope my actual adding up is correct as I am not a mathematician but I believe that I have awarded 410 marks to this cohort in the exam and also 410 marks in the internal assessment marks. Student E has made the biggest improvement but that is also reflected in their exam performance - so if you are coming last you can really help yourself by doing well as it can also pull up your assessment mark.

 

[runnable]

cem has got it pretty right. Its hard to find one nowadays who can get this right and not give the 1st gets the top external mark, 2nd gets the 2nd external mark and so on bullshit.

 

[mirann]

You keep your exam marks at all times.

Your cohorts internal marks are moderated by your exam marks as follows:

Students - A, B, C, D, E -

IA = Internal Assessment
EM = Exam Mark
MA = Moderated Assessment
FH = Final HSC


A - IA 93 - EM 91 - MA 92 - FH 92
B - IA 86 - EM 92 - MA 87 - FH 89
C - IA 82 - EM 88 - MA 84 - FH 86
D - IA 71 - EM 71 - MA 76 - FH 74
E - IA 48 - EM 68 - MA 68 - FH 68




The above example Students B, C, and D are moderated to keep the relative gaps for the moderated assessment mark based on the marks and gaps sent in by the school.

The exam determines the range of and total number of marks to be awarded to this class for their moderated assessment marks. The same number of marks is awarded for the moderated assessment as for the exam.

The exam marks are NOT just swapped around as that would make it meaningless to submit that actual assessment marks. If you look carefully at my example above you can see that Student A was 7 marks better than Student B in the assessment but in the final exam Student B was better than Student A by 1 mark. Simply giving Student B Student A's mark as the assessment mark would mean that Student B ended up being only 1 mark behind A in the school assessment mark but the school says that their is a 7 mark gap. This gap has to be preserved, bearing in mind that the is a smaller range of marks to be used as well. That is why the gap will close a bit but not to 1 mark.

This is also the case with the other marks.

NB I hope my actual adding up is correct as I am not a mathematician but I believe that I have awarded 410 marks to this cohort in the exam and also 410 marks in the internal assessment marks. Student E has made the biggest improvement but that is also reflected in their exam performance - so if you are coming last you can really help yourself by doing well as it can also pull up your assessment mark.

Thank you very much

 

[BoyNextDoor]

You keep your exam marks at all times.

Your cohorts internal marks are moderated by your exam marks as follows:

Students - A, B, C, D, E -

IA = Internal Assessment
EM = Exam Mark
MA = Moderated Assessment
FH = Final HSC


A - IA 93 - EM 91 - MA 92 - FH 92
B - IA 86 - EM 92 - MA 87 - FH 89
C - IA 82 - EM 88 - MA 84 - FH 86
D - IA 71 - EM 71 - MA 76 - FH 74
E - IA 48 - EM 68 - MA 68 - FH 68




The above example Students B, C, and D are moderated to keep the relative gaps for the moderated assessment mark based on the marks and gaps sent in by the school.

The exam determines the range of and total number of marks to be awarded to this class for their moderated assessment marks. The same number of marks is awarded for the moderated assessment as for the exam.

The exam marks are NOT just swapped around as that would make it meaningless to submit that actual assessment marks. If you look carefully at my example above you can see that Student A was 7 marks better than Student B in the assessment but in the final exam Student B was better than Student A by 1 mark. Simply giving Student B Student A's mark as the assessment mark would mean that Student B ended up being only 1 mark behind A in the school assessment mark but the school says that their is a 7 mark gap. This gap has to be preserved, bearing in mind that the is a smaller range of marks to be used as well. That is why the gap will close a bit but not to 1 mark.

This is also the case with the other marks.

NB I hope my actual adding up is correct as I am not a mathematician but I believe that I have awarded 410 marks to this cohort in the exam and also 410 marks in the internal assessment marks. Student E has made the biggest improvement but that is also reflected in their exam performance - so if you are coming last you can really help yourself by doing well as it can also pull up your assessment mark.

Thanks, now I fully understand how it all works out.

 

[omniscience]

You keep your exam marks at all times.

Your cohorts internal marks are moderated by your exam marks as follows:

Students - A, B, C, D, E -

IA = Internal Assessment
EM = Exam Mark
MA = Moderated Assessment
FH = Final HSC


A - IA 93 - EM 91 - MA 92 - FH 92
B - IA 86 - EM 92 - MA 87 - FH 89
C - IA 82 - EM 88 - MA 84 - FH 86
D - IA 71 - EM 71 - MA 76 - FH 74
E - IA 48 - EM 68 - MA 68 - FH 68




The above example Students B, C, and D are moderated to keep the relative gaps for the moderated assessment mark based on the marks and gaps sent in by the school.

The exam determines the range of and total number of marks to be awarded to this class for their moderated assessment marks. The same number of marks is awarded for the moderated assessment as for the exam.

The exam marks are NOT just swapped around as that would make it meaningless to submit that actual assessment marks. If you look carefully at my example above you can see that Student A was 7 marks better than Student B in the assessment but in the final exam Student B was better than Student A by 1 mark. Simply giving Student B Student A's mark as the assessment mark would mean that Student B ended up being only 1 mark behind A in the school assessment mark but the school says that their is a 7 mark gap. This gap has to be preserved, bearing in mind that the is a smaller range of marks to be used as well. That is why the gap will close a bit but not to 1 mark.

This is also the case with the other marks.

NB I hope my actual adding up is correct as I am not a mathematician but I believe that I have awarded 410 marks to this cohort in the exam and also 410 marks in the internal assessment marks. Student E has made the biggest improvement but that is also reflected in their exam performance - so if you are coming last you can really help yourself by doing well as it can also pull up your assessment mark.

Can I just print this page out? I need to show this to my school colleagues.

 

[cem]

Can I just print this page out? I need to show this to my school colleagues.

No problems

 

[BoyNextDoor]

^
Thanks for the example. Can I just clarify something. With your example, if student B who is ranked 2nd internally to student A........and student B gets a super high mark for the external compared to student A....

So you mean whatever happens student B will never be able to get a higher mark than student A no matter what?

 

[tommykins]

回复: Re: Questions about ranks/UAI

^
Thanks for the example. Can I just clarify something. With your example, if student B who is ranked 2nd internally to student A........and student B gets a super high mark for the external compared to student A....

So you mean whatever happens student B will never be able to get a higher mark than student A no matter what?

Student A will get a higher intneral mark than B. But student B keeps his external mark, meaning his external mark > student A's external mark.

A(internal) + A(external) divided by 2 = A(Final HSC)
same with B.

 

[cem]

^
Thanks for the example. Can I just clarify something. With your example, if student B who is ranked 2nd internally to student A........and student B gets a super high mark for the external compared to student A....

So you mean whatever happens student B will never be able to get a higher mark than student A no matter what?

In my example Student A had 93 internal and Student B 87 internal.

If Student B then got 99 for his external mark he would keep that 99 but Student A's moderated assessment mark would become 99.

Now is Student A got 90 for his external mark he would end up with 95 as his final mark 90+99= 189/2= 94.5 which would round up to 95.

Student B would keep his 99 and get something like 94 (the difference was 6 but with moderation would probably reduce to 5) so he would be 99+94=193/2=96.5 rounded up to 97 as his final mark.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Cool, thanks for helping tommy & cem.

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Sorry, one more question!

Does the same apply for example where Student C (Ranked 3rd internally) may end up getting a higher mark than Student B (Ranked 2nd internally)? What I mean is can a student ranked 3rd beat a student ranked 2nd externally?

 

[tommykins]

Sorry, one more question!

Does the same apply for example where Student C (Ranked 3rd internally) may end up getting a higher mark than Student B (Ranked 2nd internally)? What I mean is can a student ranked 3rd beat a student ranked 2nd externally?

Yes. Technically the person coming last internally can beat the person coming first EXTERNALLY, but that won't necessarily mean that the person coming last will have the highest Final HSC Mark.

Remember, you keep your external mark, they use the external mark to determine your internal mark.

 

[duy.le]

SIF MODERATE MARKS!!!!!!!!!!!! ARRRRRRRRRRRR
i always thought it was the instant change of marks like 1st gets top and then 2nd gets second highest etc etc..

Nooooooooooooooo im screwed then for maths, top guys beating me by 5 i think and that means my mark will get moderated some how, so that there is a difference of 5 (or around there) in the moderated assessment mark.!?

now that is queer.

oh and thanks for killing my hopes and dreams. jokes. the guy deserves his mark, but at the price of my mark.

question: But say that i under perform, ie he beats me by more then 5, say 10, what will happen? will i drag the people below me down even further by taking some of their marks?

 

[tommykins]

回复: Re: Questions about ranks/UAI

SIF MODERATE MARKS!!!!!!!!!!!! ARRRRRRRRRRRR
i always thought it was the instant change of marks like 1st gets top and then 2nd gets second highest etc etc..

Nooooooooooooooo im screwed then for maths, top guys beating me by 5 i think and that means my mark will get moderated some how, so that there is a difference of 5 (or around there) in the moderated assessment mark.!?

now that is queer.

oh and thanks for killing my hopes and dreams. jokes. the guy deserves his mark, but at the price of my mark.

How is it queer? It's fair, he beat you by 5.

question: But say that i under perform, ie he beats me by more then 5, say 10, what will happen? will i drag the people below me down even further by taking some of their marks?

He gets the top external mark, your internal mark difference will be according to the margin between each rank. The higher the difference between the marks internally, the bigger the difference between internal marks (if that makes sense).

 

[BoyNextDoor]

Yes. Technically the person coming last internally can beat the person coming first EXTERNALLY, but that won't necessarily mean that the person coming last will have the highest Final HSC Mark.

Remember, you keep your external mark, they use the external mark to determine your internal mark.

Oh that sucks then. So the only benefit is if your first. So then there really is nothing important about our internal rankings if we're not first then....

Thanks.