Raped by her uncle, but can she have an abortion? (2 Viewers)

[boris]

how do you know that a baby does not have feelings?

A BABY OR A FOETUS?

...

 

[emytaylor164]

A BABY OR A FOETUS?

...

A foetus if that is what u you insist on calling it that

 

[boris]

A foetus if that is what u you insist on calling it that

Well I do insist because whilst it is in utero IT IS A FOETUS.

 

[emytaylor164]

Nah because you do the abortion then go "O SOZ JESUS" and then Jesus is like "K GUY UR K!" and it's all forgiven because the big bullshit skyfairy makes everything okay if you say sorry!

you have got the most twisted view on christianity i have ever seen.

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

I disagree with abortion but i know that if it was illegal and hard to access, there would be dodgy clinics, where they take place under sub-standard condidtions, and backyard abortions.



i think it should be given the best chance to survive, it is not of any less worth then any other child

YES IT IS OF LESS WORTH.

IT IS A BABY CONCIEVED BY FORCE, FROM A RAPE BY A BLOOD RELATIVE.

THIS IS NOT NATURAL. THIS WAS NOT WANTED. THIS BABY IS IN ALL LIKELIHOOD GOING TO DIE SO THERE IS NO POINT HAVING THE GIRL GIVE BIRTH TO IT, EVEN IF SHE WAS PHYSICALLY READY, WHICH SHE IS NOT. DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THIS?

You know what? I actually think that I hate you. You have no idea how much rage you cause me to experience every time I read this thread. You are an ignorant moron incapable of seeing the shades of grey in an ethical debate. You make me sick. Shove your Bible up your cunt. Fuck.

 

[boris]

Man, okay.

This is the logic behind why I am pro-choice.

I had a baby at 19. I definitely toyed with the idea of abortion and seriously came close to making the appointment, but my rationale behind not was this;
- stable relationship
- financial security
- i'd be having it for purely selfish reasons such as my social life, etc.

Now this being said, I had the baby and I'm extremely happy I did. He's a fantastic kid and I in no way resent having him. But I have seen and I can understand why others in my predicament would not want to have a child, and I don't think that my experience or personal views should impose on their right to choose.

I look at my kid and I would be inconsolable if anything happened to him, but I can also see the distinction between a foetus and a baby. And had any deformities been picked up in the ultrasound, I would have opted for an abortion immediately.

Point is, until you are faced with such a prospect I really don't know how you can honestly sit here and say that everything is black and white and that your view is applicable to every situation.

 

[emytaylor164]

YES IT IS OF LESS WORTH.

IT IS A BABY CONCIEVED BY FORCE, FROM A RAPE BY A BLOOD RELATIVE.

THIS IS NOT NATURAL. THIS WAS NOT WANTED. THIS BABY IS IN ALL LIKELIHOOD GOING TO DIE SO THERE IS NO POINT HAVING THE GIRL GIVE BIRTH TO IT, EVEN IF SHE WAS PHYSICALLY READY, WHICH SHE IS NOT. DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND THIS?

You know what? I actually think that I hate you. You have no idea how much rage you cause me to experience every time I read this thread. You are an ignorant moron incapable of seeing the shades of grey in an ethical debate. You make me sick. Shove your Bible up your cunt. Fuck.

it is still a baby it is still a small child, growing in a womb, it is of NO LESS VALUE based on how it was concieved it is still a living child that deserves the vest chance on life, it is innocent it is not its fault that it was concieved thus deserves to live. I am not going to bother repeating myself when you clearly do not get what i am trying to say

 

[HalcyonSky]

it is still a baby it is still a small child, growing in a womb, it is of NO LESS VALUE based on how it was concieved it is still a living child that deserves the vest chance on life, it is innocent it is not its fault that it was concieved thus deserves to live. I am not going to bother repeating myself when you clearly do not get what i am trying to say

THIS IS UR OPINION AND SCIENCE SEZ ITS WRONG

 

[boris]

it is still a baby it is still a small child, growing in a womb, it is of NO LESS VALUE based on how it was concieved it is still a living child that deserves the vest chance on life, it is innocent it is not its fault that it was concieved thus deserves to live. I am not going to bother repeating myself when you clearly do not get what i am trying to say

Dude, ffs, we've been through this.
IT IS NOT A BABY. IT IS A FOETUS. WHILST IT IS IN UTERO, WE SHALL REFER TO IT AS A FOETUS. IT IS NOT A SMALL CHILD, IT IS OF LESS VALUE THAN THE 11 YEAR OLD FOR AS LONG AS IT IS AN UNVIABLE LIFE.

No, it's not the foetus's fault. Yes it was conceived during unfortunate circumstances. But allowing the 11 year old to go through the pregnancy is not only cruel to her, IT'S CRUEL TO THE FOETUS.

 

[Kwayera]

A foetus if that is what u you insist on calling it that

Oh. God. READ THIS AND UNDERSTAND. DID THEY NOT TEACH YOU THIS IN SCHOOL?!

The fetal stage starts at the beginning of the 9th week following fertilization, after the zygote, blastocyst, and embryonic stages. The risk of miscarriage decreases sharply at the beginning of the fetal stage.[7] The fetus is not as sensitive to damage from environmental exposures as the embryo was, though toxic exposures can often cause physiological abnormalities or minor congenital malformation.[citation needed] Fetal growth can be terminated by various factors, including miscarriage, feticide committed by a third party, or induced abortion.


Development

The following describes some of the specific changes in fetal anatomy and physiology by fertilization age (i.e. the time elapsed since fertilization). Obstetricians often use "gestational age" which, by convention, is measured from 2 weeks earlier than fertilization. For purposes of this article, age is measured from fertilization rather than from two weeks earlier, except as noted.


Condition at start of fetal stage

The fetal stage commences at the beginning of the 11th week.[2] At the start of the fetal stage, the fetus is typically about 30 mm (1.2 inches) in length from crown to rump, and weighs about 8 grams.[2] The head makes up nearly half of the fetus' size.[9] Breathing-like movement of the fetus is necessary for stimulation of lung development, rather than for obtaining oxygen.[10] The heart is beating.[11]

The heart, hands, feet, brain and other organs are present, but are not developed sufficiently for the fetus to survive on its own.[12] The fetus is surrounded by amniotic fluid which offers protection and allows room for movement. The pregnant woman's placenta and umbilical cord provide oxygen, nutrients, and allow waste elimination.[12]

According to current data, fetuses are not capable of feeling pain at the beginning of the fetal stage.[13][14] At this point, complex and generalized movements occur.[15]

Weeks 11-17

From weeks 9 to 12, the fetal eyelids close and remain closed for several months, and the appearance of the genitals in males and females becomes more apparent.[16] Tooth buds appear, the limbs are long and thin, and red blood cells are produced in the liver, however the majority of red blood cells will be made later in gestation (at 21 weeks) by bone marrow.[9] A fine hair called lanugo develops on the head. The gastrointestinal tract, still forming, starts to collect sloughed skin and lanugo, as well as hepatic products, forming meconium (stool).[9] Fetal skin is almost transparent. The first measurable signs of EEG movement occur in the 12th week.[17] By the end of this stage, the fetus has reached about 15 cm (6 inches).

Weeks 18-27

The lanugo covers the entire body. Eyebrows, eyelashes, fingernails, and toenails appear. The fetus has increased muscle development. Alveoli (air sacs) are forming in lungs. The nervous system develops enough to control some body functions. The cochlea are now developed, though the myelin sheaths in the neural portion of the auditory system will continue to develop until 18 months after birth. The respiratory system has developed to the point where gas exchange is possible. A woman pregnant for the first time (i.e. a primiparous woman) typically feels fetal movements at about 18-19 weeks, whereas a woman who has already given birth at least two times (i.e. a multiparous woman) will typically feel movements around 16 weeks.[18] By the end of the fifth month, the fetus is about 20 cm (8 inches).

Weeks 28-40

The amount of body fat rapidly increases. Lungs are not fully mature. Thalamic brain connections, which mediate sensory input, form. Bones are fully developed, but are still soft and pliable. Iron, calcium, and phosphorus become more abundant. Fingernails reach the end of the fingertips. The lanugo begins to disappear, until it is gone except on the upper arms and shoulders. Small breast buds are present on both sexes. Head hair becomes coarse and thicker. Birth is imminent and occurs around the 38th week. The fetus is considered full-term between weeks 35 and 40,[19] which means that the fetus is considered sufficiently developed for life outside the uterus.[20] It may be 48 to 53 cm (19 to 21 inches) in length, when born.


Viability

The lower limit of viability is approximately five months gestational age, and usually later.[23] According to The Developing Human:

Viability is defined as the ability of fetuses to survive in the extrauterine environment... There is no sharp limit of development, age, or weight at which a fetus automatically becomes viable or beyond which survival is assured, but experience has shown that it is rare for a baby to survive whose weight is less than 500 gm or whose fertilization age is less than 22 weeks. Even fetuses born between 26 and 28 weeks have difficulty surviving, mainly because the respiratory system and the central nervous system are not completely differentiated... If given expert postnatal care, some fetuses weighing less than 500 gm may survive; they are referred to as extremely low birth weight or immature infants.... Prematurity is one of the most common causes of morbidity and prenatal death.[24]

During the past several decades, neonatal care has improved with advances in medical science, and therefore the point of viability may have moved earlier.[25] As of 2006, the two youngest children to survive premature birth are thought to be James Elgin Gill (born on 20 May 1987 in Ottawa, Canada, at 21 weeks and 5 days gestational age),[26][27] and Amillia Taylor (born on 24 October 2006 in Miami, Florida, at 21 weeks and 6 days gestational age).[28][29][30] Both children were born just under 20 weeks from fertilization, or a few days past the midpoint of an average full-term pregnancy. Despite their premature births, both developed into healthy children.


Fetal pain

Fetal pain, its existence, and its implications are debated politically and academically. According to the conclusions of a review published in 2005, "Evidence regarding the capacity for fetal pain is limited but indicates that fetal perception of pain is unlikely before the third trimester."[13][14] However, there may be an emerging consensus among developmental neurobiologists that the establishment of thalamocortical connections" (at about 26 weeks) is a critical event with regard to fetal perception of pain.[31] Nevertheless, because pain can involve sensory, emotional and cognitive factors, it is "impossible to know" when painful experiences may become possible, even if it is known when thalamocortical connections are established.[31]

Whether a fetus has the ability to feel pain and to suffer is part of the abortion debate.[32] [33] For example, in the USA legislation has been proposed by pro-life advocates requiring abortion providers to tell a woman that the fetus may feel pain during the abortion procedure, and that require her to accept or decline anesthesia for the fetus.[34]

 

[*TRUE*]

WHAT DO YOU THINK? CANT YOU THINK FOR YOURSELF FOR ONCE INSTEAD OF LITTERING THE FORUMS WITH THESE RIDICULOUS QUESTIONS?

I KNOW WHAT I THINK.
I am asking those who posted what they think. Can you write a single non - antagonistic sentence?

 

[*TRUE*]

Well you have to choose, because either way at least one of them is going to die.

I'm obviously not God, but I know if I was I would not be sitting on my cloud frowning over an eleven year old incest rape victim aborting a baby.

I have to be honest with you , nor would I.

 

[boris]

I KNOW WHAT I THINK.
I am asking those who posted what they think. Can you write a single non - antagonistic sentence?

NO YOU!

We've explained fuck knows how many times.

WHILST IN UTERO IT IS A FOETUS.

 

[*TRUE*]

Can YOU?

Of course I can
Read my posts Shroe.
I asked that guy because all his posts towards me have been antagonistic.
You dont need to be so rude. He disagrees with me in alot of things , and he attacks me personally as a rebuttal.
Apart from that I dont have a problem in the world with him. He seems smart enough.
For all i know he might just be messing.

 

[Hollieee]

Just like to point out that emytaylor, you are a moron, and if you find it 'moral' that an 11 year old should give birth to something she does not want, was forced on her by her own uncle, then I hope to God you get hit by a bus.
Seriously. That is far worse than ending a life that hasn't even properly begun yet.
Yes, abortion is awful and life is sacred, but for fucks sake. 11 year olds are not meant to have children. They're not supposed to be raped. They're not supposed to have inbred children. That is far worse, imo than killing a foetus.
Poor little chook, she probably just wants a hug, not to hear about some moral fundamentalist fucks determining such a huge part of her life.

P.S, if I were in her situation and was told I couldn't have an abortion, I think I'd have to pay someone to beat me in the stomach with a baseball bat. How dare someone play God with an 11 year old.

 

[*TRUE*]

NO YOU!

We've explained fuck knows how many times.

WHILST IN UTERO IT IS A FOETUS.

we? Lol.
AND as a foetus it has less value.
OKAY!
My problem is not with those who think this.
My problem is with those who say girl & baby are of equal value, but poor little girl , this time BABY ( who is of equal value usually) must go.

 

[*TRUE*]

It's the MEDICAL FUCKING TERM. It's like we call a Kangaroo a KANGA FUCKING ROO and not SKIPPY.

You stupid FUCK.

Chill. No need to write things like that.
It is the medical term. Yes. Emy probably doesnt like to use it because of its connotations. She doesnt differentiate in value between a baby and a foetus.

 

[boris]

we? Lol.
AND as a foetus it has less value.
OKAY!
My problem is not with those who think this.
My problem is with those who say girl & baby are of equal value, but poor little girl , this time BABY ( who is of equal value usually) must go.

What are you talking about

 

[Hollieee]

rofl @ poppycock.

From now on, everytime I see a duck the word whale will perhaps come to mind.

 

[*TRUE*]

Stop. Arguing. Semantics. You. Idiot.

A foetus is called a FOETUS BECAUSE IT'S IN UTERO.

WHY IS A BABY IN THE UTERUS TRUE?

WHY AREN'T ALL BABIES JUST CREATED FULLY FORMED?

If you can answer this one I'll not think you're horribly retarded.

I KNOW WHY IT IS CALED A FOETUS!
Far out.
I wont bother. You already think i am "horribly retarded'.
You will willfully misunderstand & stereotype me no matter what.