should english be compsory (1 Viewer)

[~ ReNcH ~]

To be elegible for a UAI then English (ESL / Standard / Advanced) should be compulsary. But for people not wanting a UAI, you should be able to get an HSC without having to do English.

I think English is to focused on things we don't need, and it should be changed.

There should be a COMMON English course that people take which focuses on things we need (e.g. writing essays etc) in relation to our other courses. Why do we have to go over and over crap like poems?

Poetry, Film etc should all be EXTENTION courses (worth one unit each).

The only problem is that you can't really spend a whole year learning how to write essays, particularly when you have nothing to write about. The poetry and Shakespeare (that we all loathe) allows for analysis and critical thinking. Our ideas about the texts can then be conveyed through an essay or some other written form.

I agree with you on your first point i.e. that English shouldn't be compulsory for students opting against receiving a UAI. However, the decision over whether or not to do English in Years 11 and 12 must be made in Year 10 - I'm not sure whether students are ready at this stage to make a decision about receiving or not receiving a UAI.

 

[ujuphleg]

Yes it should definatley be compulsory.

Why?

Because at every level of society, you need speaking, reading and writing skills in some way shape or form. Even if you are a dole bludger, you need to know how to read your Centrelink form, just as a barrister needs to be able to write English in the correct manner to create those laws that allow people to get their Centrelink payments.

I do agree though that the current HSC Syllabus is full of pointless trash that the average person is never going to sneeze at again.

I reckon they should bring back two of the old subjects: 2 Unit Maths in Society (practical Maths like mortage repayments and how to work out how much you save on flour at the supermarket) and a practical course in English (like how to write a good resume/official letter/maybe some basic speeches and interview techniques plus spelling and grammar.)

 

[elisabeth]

Yes it should definatley be compulsory.

Why?

Because at every level of society, you need speaking, reading and writing skills in some way shape or form. Even if you are a dole bludger, you need to know how to read your Centrelink form, just as a barrister needs to be able to write English in the correct manner to create those laws that allow people to get their Centrelink payments.

Exactly.

Imagine you were suddently transported to a land where you only know a little bit of the language. Save some less verbal jobs, such as trades, and language teaching, what hope have you got of getting a job without language skills? Whilst you could very easily get a good job without much knowledge of maths.

 

[AsyLum]

Every year theres a discussion of this being compulsory, every year it remains so..see a trend?

 

[Casmira]

I don't think theres not much with the content, (standard), I enjoyed image/poetry but i hate institutions and dont understand it at all

 

[FoodForThought]

NO!! NOT COMPULSARY!!! if you want to go its thats cool.. but forcing you to do it is a bit over the top. my school forces us to do advanced on top of it which is just fucked.

i believe none of it should be compulsary... i mean if you talk to any tracher they will say they are supposed to correct spelling and grammer and shit whenever you make a mistake... and thats the only reason to force english. if its already done why bother??

 

[LiL_JeN_JeN]

Two Words...
HELL NO....
If people are able to read, write and speak, why have English...thinking about what I have done in English, its amazing how the only places Ive ever used what Ive learnt is in an English lesson and its the same with maths...the majority of the stuff learnt I will only ever use in a maths lesson...

 

[~ ReNcH ~]

Two Words...
HELL NO....
If people are able to read, write and speak, why have English...thinking about what I have done in English, its amazing how the only places Ive ever used what Ive learnt is in an English lesson and its the same with maths...the majority of the stuff learnt I will only ever use in a maths lesson...

You may be able to read, write and speak but can you do it well? (Btw. I am in no way suggesting that you can't). Would you be able to confidently give a presentation to an audience of 200 people? Would you be able to write a fluent report for your boss in 15 years time? English provides you with the skills necessary to perform in what's now a highly competitive world...particularly when seaching for a job.

 

[The Intergrator]

I am doing well in English but I don't think it shouldbe compulsory.
Basically, everything in the syllabus is drivel. There really isn't anything that will help after school unless you plan on doing a uni course.

There is also the fact that most of the stuff we derive from the text probably wasn't intentional on the composers behalf.

Just play the game

 

[pLuvia]

i hate english so much, if i had the choice to drop it.. i would immediately

but by the looks of the poll, it seems very equal~

 

[Carnivour]

I want to put forward a question, how many people that vote "No", do so because they dislike or are struggling with english?

It should not be compulsary in the form that it exists now. Essentially, what Advanced and Extension English are based on is the ability to see philosophical links between texts and the real world, thus learning more about the deeper issues that exist in our so-called 'society'. Now, this is imposed on students in a disgustingly contrived way, where the texts are often twisted beyond recognition. Come on, everyone, lets have a good wank while we're at it.

Not to mention the fact that English is cross-marked twice, often thrice, emphasising the complete fallacy of this rudimentary, compulsory subject which is meant to encompass all levels of skills. Advanced English is a joke, nothing more. Let english test what is truly necessary - the ability to communicate clearly, to argue verbally, to compose an exposition in a logical, structured way - without airy-fairy post-modern mindfucking.

By the way, I'm ranked first in English.

 

[PoP 'n' Fresh]

Let english test what is truly necessary - the ability to communicate clearly, to argue verbally, to compose an exposition in a logical, structured way - without airy-fairy post-modern mindfucking.

Well said. Except that these things can be tested in most other subjects anyway.
Though I firmly stand by my view that maths should be compulsory (I heard this will be the case in a few years time?). For example, at work there was this year 12 girl whos basically got the whole english/drama subjects. Deadset this girl could not add 22.95 + 7.95 without a calculator. While she was able to talk with flair and all that, she got fired cause she constantly gave out way more change.

Realistically it shouldn't be compulsory, yet optional to those who find intrest in that field, and who may apply it to use to later life. That girl who got fired sure sucks at addition, but she might be going for some non-maths career. Conversly, people who go into scientific/math careers do not need hsc english as it offers nothing useful that has not been learnt before hand to be applied to the field.

Guess this topic is in opinions only, mainly BOS seeing as they made it compulsory. Not much we can do about it... just accept it, do it, burn everything after it and dance on it, and move on.

 

[Meldrum]

English is just going to stay there. If we remove it we remove the last vestage of the classical education - English, Maths, Science, Humanities.

 

[haboozin]

I definitely think English should be compulsory, however it should <b>not be compulsory towards your UAI</b>


Courses at uni already have eg at least a band 4 in English standard is required.
They can put them on most courses if they want. It doesn't matter.
I just don’t think English counting towards your UAI is very fair.

 

[~ ReNcH ~]

I definitely think English should be compulsory, however it should <b>not be compulsory towards your UAI</b>

But then that would result in a group of unmotivated students who don't want to be in class. They would likely disrupt students who do wish to do well in English and have it count towards their UAI. What's more, given the current moderating system, having unmotivated students in the cohort will disadvantage the remainder of the students. That said, English is a fundamental subject in Australia. So the only way to prevent the above scenarios from occurring is to make it both compulsory to complete and compulsory towards one's UAI.

 

[kami]

But then that would result in a group of unmotivated students who don't want to be in class. They would likely disrupt students who do wish to do well in English and have it count towards their UAI. What's more, given the current moderating system, having unmotivated students in the cohort will disadvantage the remainder of the students. That said, English is a fundamental subject in Australia. So the only way to prevent the above scenarios from occurring is to make it both compulsory to complete and compulsory towards one's UAI.

Then why not set a minimum standard in english rather than compulsory UAI inclusion?

 

[Libbster]

Plus another thing, English is soooo subjective unlike maths: right or wrong. Our teacher (a HSC marker) was telling us that she gave an essay 18/20 for one of the modules and the other marker gave it 6! Yes that's right 6 out of 18.

Now tell me people, how can we say English should be compulsory when teachers have admitted they don't even understand the syllabus definitions, it has no real applications in life unless you want to study English at uni and it is one of the most subjective courses around even though there are certain 'parameters' an essay has to meet. Well, obviously the above essay, according to one teacher was outstanding and according to another, was crap while they both 'applied the same marking criteria'

 

[kami]

it has no real applications in life unless you want to study English at uni

at every level of society, you need speaking, reading and writing skills in some way shape or form. Even if you are a dole bludger, you need to know how to read your Centrelink form, just as a barrister needs to be able to write English in the correct manner to create those laws that allow people to get their Centrelink payments.

It also surprises me that since you do Extension History, that you can't see the point of learning about English.

 

[Libbster]

I love extension history because you can basically argue however way you want. You choose your own historians to reinforce your argument, you choose what do your major work on, you get to offer your own perspective on your case study. Yes it is essay writing, but you put forth your own interpretations and are rewarded for it. As in the examiners comments 'Evidence of thinking is always rewarded.'

Whereas in English, you are constrained by the syllabus, you have to write about what the markers want. I don't think we are actually 'learning about English.' I believe we are learning the now popular 'post-modernist' deconstruction of texts that have gained life beyond what they were chiefly meant for: enjoyment. Although the texts we study all portray messages, the extrapolation that they now reflect our society, I believe, is a poor attempt at creating relevance.

 

[jm1234567890]

what I don't understand is why some level of maths/science isn't compulsory.