The Abortion Debate... (2 Viewers)

[MoonlightSonata]

Sure it does, since a girl can still get pregnant even with the use of a condom. I don't think a 16 year old is old enough to deal with the decision of terminating what could possibly be seen as a life. Even if she believes that the unborn foetus is just a collection of cells, like dandruff or something, she might not believe that when she is more mature.

I think IF they got pregnant and IF they weren't mature enough to handle the decision, two big IFs, then the guidance and support of family/doctors would be enough to give them as much information as they need to make a good choice.

I mean let's face it the only possible bad choice at that age is to not have the child aborted in circumstances when you should have.

 

[Phanatical]

you're quoting individual cases to prove immaturity which is exactly the same as me saying "well *I* was mature enough, therefore everybody is".

hey, considering that the drinking age in countries in america is 21 (in the majority of states), do you reckon they should raise the age of consent to 21 as well?

As the great Chris Rock said, you can go off to war, you can get your arms and legs blown off, then you can come home, go to the bar and they'll ask for your ID. That don't seem right to me. If you're responsible enough to put yourself in the line of fire for your country, then you're damn well old enough to go get pissed at your local.

Personally, I think that even a 17 year old is in a better position to consider the issue of abortion than a 16 year old. The 17 year old has finished school, gone off to uni. If you're old enough to attend uni, then in my opinion you're old enough to drink, vote, smoke, fuck. But I don't know any 16 year olds at uni.

 

[ur_inner_child]

I reckon the only example where a 16 year old was never mature enough to have sex is one that:

*knows she's pregnant and hasn't told anyone because she's too scared, is not thinking ahead about finance and her future, is not taking any precautions, is just letting herself grow big...

THAT is immature.

 

[katie_tully]

Or it might have something to do with the fact that those of us who WERE more mature than the rest of our age group were the ones who weren't getting pregnant at 16. Ironically, it's the ones who are the most immature for their age who have to make the most mature decisions, and they quite frankly aren't ready to face that sort of decision. Society should take some responsibility and take action to prevent 16 year olds being forced into that position.

So, you automatically assume that everybody who has sex at 16 is immature?
You assume that everybody who has sex is going to get pregnant? I think you're an idiot living in 1950.
You are basically saying that if you have sex at 16 you are displaying immaturity, and that if you get pregnant you dont have the capacity to make an informed decision...
My god. Take your friends, and crawl back into your hole. It's probably a good thing if you don't breed.

You cannot prevent a 16 year old from having sex. THAT, you uninformed git, is why we have sex education, it TEACHES the dangers of having unprotected sex and the dangers of pregnancy.

It appears that you consider people who have sex and get pregnant all immature and immoral.
Go fuck yourself.

 

[waterfowl]

But I don't know any 16 year olds at uni.

Actually there may be a few...there are a lot of kids out there who are freakishly smart and do go to uni at 16

 

[katie_tully]

As the great Chris Rock said, you can go off to war, you can get your arms and legs blown off, then you can come home, go to the bar and they'll ask for your ID. That don't seem right to me. If you're responsible enough to put yourself in the line of fire for your country, then you're damn well old enough to go get pissed at your local.

Personally, I think that even a 17 year old is in a better position to consider the issue of abortion than a 16 year old. The 17 year old has finished school, gone off to uni. If you're old enough to attend uni, then in my opinion you're old enough to drink, vote, smoke, fuck. But I don't know any 16 year olds at uni.

Im 17.
I was 16 earlier this year.
Because I am NOW 17, I automatically can make more informed decisions, than I could 6 months ago?
What fucking planet are you on?

 

[Phanatical]

your example is a rather exceptional example

I quote what I know. One of my Other classmates (at 13) was worried for months that he was the father, until the kid ended up being black.

 

[glycerine]

Aha, not necessarily. I turned 17 in August, I just started yr 12, and will have been 18 for approx 2-3 months by the time I finish school and ~6 months by the time I start uni. About 70% of people in my grade were born in 1987, ie they have or will have turned 17 well before graduating, and most will be 18 by the time of the HSC.

Also, Nancy(babydoll) was 16 at the beginning of this year, and goes to uni. There's a considerable percentage I think, thanks to the fact that quite a few people are skipped ahead for whatever reason.

When I was 16 I had done the following:
1. worked
2. been having sex for ~2 years
3. gotten myself off drugs
4. emotionally supported myself through the aftermath of a rape
5. emotionally supported my mother to a degree after considerable marital problems

I'm sorry, I think I was mature enough to understand the implications of abortion. End of story.

HOWEVER - I realise this is my *individual* case. Not every 16 year old has done those things. Some are quite naive. Whereas there are also 16 year olds who have supported themselves through more than that and are much more in tune with 'the real world' than I was. You should reward the majority, not punish the minority.

 

[katie_tully]

Not all 16 are mature.
To say none at all are is a gross generalisation, worthy of fuckhead status.

 

[ur_inner_child]

Woo Hoo MY TURN

at 16 I :

1. Decided to follow my passion for music through to tertiary education
2. Therefore was out of home (parents disagreeing and forcing me to do law/medicine - ie: mature enough to realise that they cannot control my life)
3. Supported myself while out of home
4. Was mature enough to talk to as many adults as I can - teachers, principal, counsellors, outside counsellors.
5. Had sex after a long wait (still with the guy now and I'm turning 18)

I was classified as an independent while out of home. ie: society saw me as mature?

 

[Phanatical]

So, you automatically assume that everybody who has sex at 16 is immature? You assume that everybody who has sex is going to get pregnant? I think you're an idiot living in 1950.
You are basically saying that if you have sex at 16 you are displaying immaturity, and that if you get pregnant you dont have the capacity to make an informed decision...
My god. Take your friends, and crawl back into your hole. It's probably a good thing if you don't breed.

You cannot prevent a 16 year old from having sex. THAT, you uninformed git, is why we have sex education, it TEACHES the dangers of having unprotected sex and the dangers of pregnancy.

It appears that you consider people who have sex and get pregnant all immature and immoral. Go fuck yourself.

I am not saying that everybody who has sex is going to get pregnant. But it's like letting the 1 metre tall person ride the big ride at the carnival, with a minimum height of 1.2 metres. Sure, they Might not fall off, but there's a chance of it.

I get the feeling that you're just pissed off that somebody like me could tell you that your actions might possibly be considered wrong. I bet if I argued that society should lower the voting age to 16 years old, and that we should allow a 16 year old to buy a car and drive at 150kmh on a 50 road without supervision and without penalty, the 16 year old would agree with me because it would mean more ways they can fuck up their lives.

 

[katie_tully]

I am not saying that everybody who has sex is going to get pregnant. But it's like letting the 1 metre tall person ride the big ride at the carnival, with a minimum height of 1.2 metres. Sure, they Might not fall off, but there's a chance of it.

I get the feeling that you're just pissed off that somebody like me could tell you that your actions might possibly be considered wrong. I bet if I argued that society should lower the voting age to 16 years old, and that we should allow a 16 year old to buy a car and drive at 150kmh on a 50 road without supervision and without penalty, the 16 year old would agree with me because it would mean more ways they can fuck up their lives.

You're a dickhead.

I'm pissed off at you for being a narrow minded tool, not because "somebody like yourself" is telling me my actions are considered wrong.
Considered wrong by whom. Yourself? Hey, care factor 0.
I'm pissed off because you think that 16 year olds can't make a rational decision, yet suddenly at 18 they can.
I dont think they should vote at 16, because them fucking and having a kid or an abortion doesn't affect the rest of the country.
I don't think you'll find many 16 year olds agree with you over the car thing either.

Your analogies are shit.
You are shit.

 

[Phanatical]

Not all 16 are mature.
To say none at all are is a gross generalisation, worthy of fuckhead status.

You certainly aren't mature enough.

I'm sure there are 16 year olds out there who are mature enough. They will, most of the time, be the ones who AREN'T putting themselves at risk of being parents.

 

[katie_tully]

OH.. I get it... I get it now!

HE'S TALKING ABOUT 16 YEAR OLD GIRLS! Because what other 16 year old gets pregnant?!

Hey, are you against women? Do you have a sexism thing going on? Is that it!!?

 

[katie_tully]

You certainly aren't mature enough.

I'm sure there are 16 year olds out there who are mature enough. They will, most of the time, be the ones who AREN'T putting themselves at risk of being parents.

You dont know me, therefore your statement is redundant.

You think because at 16, and you didnt have sex, that you were suddenly more mature than others?
By NOT putting yourself at risk, you aren't displaying as much maturity as somebody who DOES, and then takes full responsibility.
See the distinction?

 

[ur_inner_child]

You certainly aren't mature enough.

I'm sure there are 16 year olds out there who are mature enough. They will, most of the time, be the ones who AREN'T putting themselves at risk of being parents.

does that mean not having sex?

Or using the pill & condom so you have 1 out of 1000 chance of getting pregnant?

 

[glycerine]

Hey, did you actually respond to my post about how teenage pregnancy rates have been lowered since the increased focus in education rather than indoctrination? Of course not, who needs FACTS when you have gross generalisations to be made

 

[Phanatical]

OH.. I get it... I get it now!

HE'S TALKING ABOUT 16 YEAR OLD GIRLS! Because what other 16 year old gets pregnant?!

Hey, are you against women? Do you have a sexism thing going on? Is that it!!?

I'm talking about both 16 year old boys and girls. If anything, we should be focusing on preventing boys from going around and fucking girls, because they Especially don't face the consequences of their actions. They make the mistake, AND they don't learn from it, so they grow up thinking that what they do has no consequences.

 

[Phanatical]

Hey, did you actually respond to my post about how teenage pregnancy rates have been lowered since the increased focus in education rather than indoctrination? Of course not, who needs FACTS when you have gross generalisations to be made

Teenage pregnancy rates should be at 0. I'm not saying don't teach safe sex. I've been saying the whole time that abstinence should ALSO be at least mentioned in class as a possible way of avoiding becoming a mummy or a daddy. They don't even mention it - hell, that teacher I mentioned who went to fuck my classmate - he derided it. And the students listened.

The media also has a responsibility to tone down the sexuality of its teenage-focused product. The fact that we have tweens who are acting all sexual without even understanding what sexuality is is a testament to this fact.

My point, once again, is that the 16 year old shouldn't Have to consider whether or not to abort a child. If they do ever end up in that situation, then that's up to them, but I'd much rather people not put in that situation in the first place.

 

[MoonlightSonata]

Alrite I can't be bothered with this anymore I'm out of this discussion.

I will just say, on my leaving note, that Phanatical, you need to have sex