Tutoring Colleges are Evil (1 Viewer)

[spoon3er]

evil or not, tutoring colleges will ALWAYS be in demand

 

[Mountain.Dew]

Ah, I think you're a bit of an idiot.

The more you work, the higher your UAI will be. Simple. If you want to go to extra lengths to ensure the work you're doing is done properly, and you want some extra motivation, go to a tutoring college. If you feel you can handle it yourself, good on you. Either way, no one gives a shit when the UAI comes out whether or not you've been through a tutoring college.

reason.

i think Dapto has a point. i do agree with nwatts with the fact that the more u work, the better ur chances are at getting a better UAI, or a greater chance of obtaining the best UAI you can possibly get. However, Dapto has a point that for many poorer people, who do go to no-so-good schools (sorry for being no-so-politically correct) and cant afford tutoring colleges...well, where can they turn to now? of course, they can learn themselves, but some people dont have the...mental capacity to grasp new concepts and learn new content. u might say, because of this, the richer get richer and the poorer get poorer. the socio-economic gap widens.

yes, it really does suck. but, as many people have acknowledged, this is a harsh world. for many employers, one number spells volumes for one person, cos they havent got the time to interview all candidates for a prospectus job. for this reason, for many people, the UAI is a bottleneck of life. if you cant get through it, then ur life is over. tutoring colleges of course exploits high expectations from students themselves, their teachers, their friends and families.

it is a sad thing that tutoring has lost its original definition. tutoring used to be the place where you go to for help when you struggle at school. no longer is that the norm. now, it is full of deluxe methods, rote learning techniques, the "you-will-get-100-UAI" plan that tutoring colleges offer. sad to say that many colleges gives no freedom for the students on how to improve themselves, rather, it is the colleges that dictate this is how u get 100 UAI, not catering for the individual student.

tutoring itself is good, but the "tutoring" colleges is a farcry from what tutoring originally functioned as.

 

[nwatts]

i think Dapto has a point. i do agree with nwatts with the fact that the more u work, the better ur chances are at getting a better UAI, or a greater chance of obtaining the best UAI you can possibly get. However, Dapto has a point that for many poorer people, who do go to no-so-good schools (sorry for being no-so-politically correct) and cant afford tutoring colleges...well, where can they turn to now? of course, they can learn themselves, but some people dont have the...mental capacity to grasp new concepts and learn new content. u might say, because of this, the richer get richer and the poorer get poorer. the socio-economic gap widens.

If the kid is capable of a 95+ UAI, they can land themselves in a selective government school. They aren't paying for private schooling, but are still delivered top education. They're now open to get a UAI reflective of their effort rather than their environment. Most of the top schools in the state are government selective schools. Money isn't an issue.

I don't understand why people think that training kids to score high UAIs is wrong. It's a means to and end, and as I mentioned earlier (and what Mountain Dew here agreed with) it is reflective of effort and work rather than intelligence. Therefore, aiming high UAI-wise is indicative of what career options/university courses you want. Those keen on medicine/usyd/unsw law, I'd recommend you go to a tutoring college to make sure you get the mark you need.

Most people seem to understand that UAI has little to do with intelligence. That's why I find discussions like this baffling. Who cares what your UAI is once you're in your course? It's an index used for university admission. It's not an IQ score.

 

[Riviet]

Keep in mind that not everyone who attends a coaching college achieves a high UAI, and not everyone that doesn't go to a tutoring school gets a lower UAI. It is the effort you put into your study that really determines how well you perform in the hsc.

 

[seremify007]

If the kid is capable of a 95+ UAI, they can land themselves in a selective government school. They aren't paying for private schooling, but are still delivered top education. They're now open to get a UAI reflective of their effort rather than their environment. Most of the top schools in the state are government selective schools. Money isn't an issue.

Whilst selective highs are good at pushing students to achieve higher UAIs I believe it's partially due to the competitive environment whereby the people are all trying to acheive high marks and that in turns motivates others... I've never been in a local govt. high school so I wouldn't know but one of the teachers told us "Unlike in a normal school where some smart people will dumb themselves down so they don't get victimised, here, intelligence and high grades are respected and that's what makes a difference."- I don't know how true that is, but I agree with that smart people tend to be congratulated and respected.

Anyhow, back on topic of tutoring, I'd say at least half my grade did tuition, and I'm not sure about Ruse, but my sister did tutoring when she was at Ruse. Ironically though, the very top students don't do tutoring I don't think... and equally ironic is that those studyholic nerdy stereotype Asians tend to not do so well as they deserve I'd say... of course this is a generalisation but it's still an observation.

The point of this is that just because you're in a selective high doesn't mean you are in the comfort of having higher quality teachers- whilst this may be the case, I'd say alot of it has to do with the fellow classmates also being equally interested in performing academically... as for the saving money on tuition, whilst there are free tutoring services (I was a member of this at my school), there are a lot of people who take external tutoring very seriously... but I guess our school's results prove that you don't need to have tutoring to go well, but I'm sure it improves your odds... or at the very least, gives you a bit more confidence.

 

[Mountain.Dew]

as riviet said, going to tutoring isnt an automatic guarantee you will get good grades. going to a selective school isnt going to automatically get u good marks. it is merely just that u get more CHANCES or more OPPORTUNITIES to get good marks because the resources, the attitude and the motivation is there.

and unlike nwatt's opinion, money IS an issue. with money, u can afford more books and textbooks. with money, you can afford more tutoring fees, or afford to have a private tutor. with money, u can afford to go to better schools. with money, u can afford to make numerous phone calls to tutoring colleges to judge with one is the best to maximise a student's marks without breaking the budget. money IS an issue --> more money you get, more opportunity for better UAI, therefore a greater chance of getting that better UAI than another person who hasnt got that opportunity to consider. tutoring colleges just enjoys the ride, the cycle continues.

 

[blackfriday]

hsc, as mentioned before, is only a game. what you write in the exam is not an indication of your intelligence or hard work - you write what you think will make the examiner give you a high mark. other people, like tutors, can easily write essays for you to memorise and copy down. uai only indicated how well you played this game, and im guessing after a semester at uni no one will care who got what uai someone has. its about what you do with the opportunities you are given.

 

[SeDaTeD]

After a semester? How about even before uni begins .

 

[blackfriday]

even better. its hard trying to explain to people why they couldnt have got more uai. hey you do advanced maths, i want to do it but i hate studying (which may sound strange as i want to do maths in uni). is it hard?

 

[SeDaTeD]

Haha, well if you are able at maths and can learn and understand it pretty well, it's not too hard. Actually, well at least for first year, it seems the talented ones can bludge most of maths and still do well haha.

Uni maths, (well at least at USYD), is more organised than high school, ie. not a whole bunch of topics stuck together in a course. The areas are sepaarate and things are explained more formally and rigorously, compared to the perhaps fudginess of high school.

 

[_dhj_]

it is reflective of effort and work rather than intelligence.

It's all down to luck actually... if you're born a genius you can still get 100 uai with very little work.

 

[nwatts]

as riviet said, going to tutoring isnt an automatic guarantee you will get good grades. going to a selective school isnt going to automatically get u good marks. it is merely just that u get more CHANCES or more OPPORTUNITIES to get good marks because the resources, the attitude and the motivation is there.

and unlike nwatt's opinion, money IS an issue. with money, u can afford more books and textbooks. with money, you can afford more tutoring fees, or afford to have a private tutor. with money, u can afford to go to better schools. with money, u can afford to make numerous phone calls to tutoring colleges to judge with one is the best to maximise a student's marks without breaking the budget. money IS an issue --> more money you get, more opportunity for better UAI, therefore a greater chance of getting that better UAI than another person who hasnt got that opportunity to consider. tutoring colleges just enjoys the ride, the cycle continues.

Mate, you have no point.

Of course selective schools open up more opportunity for higher marks. As do tutoring colleges. Which is what I said earlier. Students do not have to goto tutoring colleges or private schools to get high UAIs. However, for those who want the security of scoring extremely well (for whatever reason) the gate is there.

I don't care if you've got more money. Tutoring/textbooks/etc. goes only so far. There needs to be the motivation there. And it's the motivated students who get themselves into tutoring colleges anyway. You are rambling, about nothing.

 

[Mountain.Dew]

yes, tutoring colleges and selective schools do offer MORE opportunities to maximise HSC and UAI marks. but, to enrol in selective school, in tutoring colleges, u need to have the money there for fees and what not. oh, u might say selective schools may be cheap, but it is those people who take tutoring classes for the OC test that has greater chances of getting into selective schools. a person who is well prepared stands more chances against a person who prepared little. and the catch is, money is involved. money is clearly an issue.

but i do agree that tutoring/help/books can only get u so far. i agree that the missing piece of the puzzle is the student's motivation for learning, and determination to maximise their marks GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY. and yes, it is those motivated people that win in the end.

And a Happy New Year to all!

 

[_dhj_]

Well obviously you can do everything with money. Hell.. why not just lower the cut-off by full-fee paying instead of making the effort to get tutored.

 

[Mountain.Dew]

there u go again...the people with the money have the most opportunities still --> for uni. and yes, i agree that money can only get u so far...but we all have to admit that its better to have some money than have no money at all, no?

 

[nwatts]

Haha, mate I think you need to go and just chill for a moment. Either that or join a communist party.

Money is far from everything.

 

[xiao1985]

can't help to put my opinion into this argument...

firstly, i agree some one said old hsc is better... i fully agree.. .it is truly reflective of how much hard work you put into your study... unlike rote learning of syllabus

2ndly, i suppose many of you has not touched the unfortunate half of the society yet?! not all high school has the facility / resource to foster high uai students... not even alot of libraries out there are capable of doing that either... ALOT of public school teacher are poorly trained and that has a major downgrading effect on students' motivation to study... why do i know?! because i tutored kids who were in those situation ... but more of that later

3rdly, tutoring colleges. like selective schools, should provide an environment with intense friendly competition, and appropriate guidance (from the tutor). this will stimulate students motivation, and aid them in their course (honestly, who really WANTED to learn?! initially... dont' u rather watch tv and play ur xbox instead)... the urge to be the top of the class created handlable pressure, which has themselves forced to learn

4th, there do exist ppl who jsut don't want to learn... learning under one roof with those people are truly a frustrating process... even u are not corrupted by them, u will be distracted, which prevents those who want to learn to learn properly. tuition colleges SHOULD create an atmosphere that every one want to learn, so no one distracts.

5th... money is not every thing... well at least it wasn't... school tutoring program at usyd is jsut one of the programmes around sydney helping misfortunate kids with their academics... voluntary tutors give up 1 hr each week to help community school kids with their school work...

conclusion: there's still hope in the society

 

[shinji]

can't help to put my opinion into this argument...

firstly, i agree some one said old hsc is better... i fully agree.. .it is truly reflective of how much hard work you put into your study... unlike rote learning of syllabus

2ndly, i suppose many of you has not touched the unfortunate half of the society yet?! not all high school has the facility / resource to foster high uai students... not even alot of libraries out there are capable of doing that either... ALOT of public school teacher are poorly trained and that has a major downgrading effect on students' motivation to study... why do i know?! because i tutored kids who were in those situation ... but more of that later

3rdly, tutoring colleges. like selective schools, should provide an environment with intense friendly competition, and appropriate guidance (from the tutor). this will stimulate students motivation, and aid them in their course (honestly, who really WANTED to learn?! initially... dont' u rather watch tv and play ur xbox instead)... the urge to be the top of the class created handlable pressure, which has themselves forced to learn

4th, there do exist ppl who jsut don't want to learn... learning under one roof with those people are truly a frustrating process... even u are not corrupted by them, u will be distracted, which prevents those who want to learn to learn properly. tuition colleges SHOULD create an atmosphere that every one want to learn, so no one distracts.

5th... money is not every thing... well at least it wasn't... school tutoring program at usyd is jsut one of the programmes around sydney helping misfortunate kids with their academics... voluntary tutors give up 1 hr each week to help community school kids with their school work...

conclusion: there's still hope in the society

wow.
well said !

i'd liek to add; that just because u ARE going to a tutorial college doesn't mean that you are going to suceed. as when i was in James An tuition, i did NOT knw (that well) what i was tehre for.. thus i didn't really put that much effort into it.

stayed at the back of the class .. hardly graspin new concepts ( although it helped me in yr 7 & 8 )...

i didn't succeed goin to selective coz i didn't put in the required effort to actualli succeed in the test. ( however, im not regretting it atm! )

but now, im putting in 110% effort ( if its possible) to get the highest uai possible ... im aimin at 'round 96+. which is possible ...

my mum is going to ( i thnk ) enrol me into James An again to help me understand new concepts in physics and 3-unit maths. however, it is pretty expensive and i feel guilty wasting ~$1000 in yr 6 >_<

im not gonna waste it now however, coz i am determined to get into uni .. determined to get a good job.


your uai all comes down to one thing ... your determination to succeed ( in life, or wateva ).


( and i also have been a victim of the whole 'people don't want to learn' in my classes. which resulted in a whole degradation in my grades. Eg : english i just barely passed. got around 50%. coz of my friend that didn't ahve ne energy in class therefore, draining MY energy in class making it dull, etc etc.

 

[seremify007]

yes, tutoring colleges and selective schools do offer MORE opportunities to maximise HSC and UAI marks. but, to enrol in selective school, in tutoring colleges, u need to have the money there for fees and what not. oh, u might say selective schools may be cheap, but it is those people who take tutoring classes for the OC test that has greater chances of getting into selective schools. a person who is well prepared stands more chances against a person who prepared little. and the catch is, money is involved. money is clearly an issue.

Uhh... since when do you have to have money to afford a selective high? i think a lot of people who got into my school did so without attending any tutoring for it...

 

[Mountain.Dew]

okay, okay, u all win. money isnt an issue. motivation, committement is everything. the most determined, hard working and resourceful students will get high UAIs.

i hate playing the devils advocate.