VSU Protest Today (3 Viewers)

[walrusbear]

Perhaps the advent of VSU will mean a shift away from the consumer attitude. The purpose of a university is to teach, not make money. Providing compulsory consumer services does not help this.

VSU is born out of consumer attitude

 

[Not-That-Bright]

What is the chance of the unions reforming themselves? They could have been reforming to become something more useful since VSU was introduced and have made a much stronger argument, however they have not.

 

[withoutaface]

why not reform them then?

They've had the threat of VSU hanging over their heads for 15+ years, and haven't reformed themselves, they've just sat there and prayed to God the Liberals never got a majority in the Senate.

EDIT: For the cost of advocacy, I tried contacting the SRC, making it 100% clear I wanted a rough figure on how many students successfully appeal an academic decision, and how much it cost for each one. They replied by telling me the types of claims one can have and telling me that each claim is not costed, completely ignoring my first request, and when I tried again a similar thing happened. I should then think that the number of successful appeals isn't very high if they seem so unwilling to supply it.

 

[Meldrum]

The government really should step in on this. Just say: Okay, you hungry-assed-poor-students-who-can't-afford-anything-with-this-lame-VSU, whilst we can't break up these bolshy-breeding grounds we can help you with paying for food.

So now that anyone with a special "I voted liberal!" card can rock up to a Uni cafe and get a 'Vanstone Special':

- 1x crusty pie lid
- 1x gooey pie base and
- 400g of prime-grade beef from our famed minister for Immigration's left breast.

Think about it, what else does she do for the party?

 

[withoutaface]

Would anyone with communist propaganda in their signature please get the fuck out?

 

[walrusbear]

They've had the threat of VSU hanging over their heads for 15+ years, and haven't reformed themselves, they've just sat there and prayed to God the Liberals never got a majority in the Senate.

i'd rather have the flawed system we have now because it encourages welfare and university as more than a product. i think user pay dislocates society too much and that education should be a holistic experience.

 

[Riewe]

Those that want it will pay for it, and those that don't will not. Simple

 

[walrusbear]

Would anyone with communist propaganda in their signature please get the fuck out?

damn you suck

the che quote isn't even promoting communist prop, it's a promotion of social justice

 

[walrusbear]

Those that want it will pay for it, and those that don't will not. Simple

on the contrary it is nowhere near that simple

 

[Not-That-Bright]

How does forcing people to pay money toward a union make them any more involved with university social life? I doubt there's much of a fluctuation of apathetic people when vsu is introduced.

 

[Riewe]

on the contrary it is nowhere near that simple

How isn't it?

Those that want to continue to get their excellent service provided to them from the student union will pay their union fees next year. While those that feel they do not need/want the union, will not pay their fees.

So where's the complications?

 

[withoutaface]

damn you suck

the che quote isn't even promoting communist prop, it's a promotion of social justice

It's got the word 'comrade' in it, hence communist. Communism in general is flawed policy covered by overly simplistic and appealing slogans, but I don't think we need to get into that here.

 

[walrusbear]

How does forcing people to pay money toward a union make them any more involved with university social life? I doubt there's much of a fluctuation of apathetic people when vsu is introduced.

are you kidding me?
we've discussed this for pages and pages
it supports every university cultural and sporting group

 

[walrusbear]

It's got the word 'comrade' in it, hence communist. Communism in general is flawed policy covered by overly simplistic and appealing slogans, but I don't think we need to get into that here.

i was thinking the same thing for late capitalism

if you'd read the banner you'd see it isn't expressly communist.
anyway, why shouldn't it be allowed in here?

 

[Toodulu]

this thread is so incredibly infuriating and sad at the same time

If university isn't a product then why the hell does it cost me so much?
Unions aren't about monetary benefits, they're about providing services to some at the expense of many tho.


How much exactly would it cost to simply provide advocacy? I imagine very little.

the money goes towards child care, and legal representation for students and providing tutoring for disadvantaged school kids, and bringing you o-week and university life etc. i'm sorry if you think that these are worthless because YOU don't benefit personally from the services. if you think those who provide these services are selfish because you don't think you benefit from a better community, then i guess the whole social welfare thing has flew right past your head.
it's just really sad that because you don't know that there are people who really do need these services in order to have access to tertiary education. and a better university life is something that EVERYONE can benefit from. at the end of the day, if you choose not to participate then fine but you may save a few hundred dollars but we have lost a community.

the whole idea of "getting more than your money's worth" is bullshit.. the thing is, because the whole university community pays the fees, the services can be subsidised. i don't know if you know anything about economics, but generally, costs are set up + maintenance. the set up costs are fixed, and the more people participate the less it is for each individual. that's the whole point of being able to get more than your money's worth, that's why you pay 3 dollars to use a railway system that costs millions to run. just because you own a car doesn't mean the railway system should only be paid for by those who use it. the trains and buses are always there for you in case you will need to use it one day, just like the union always welcomes people to ask where their money is going, and how they can participate and benefit from its services

lastly, don't be so naive about not wanting to fund political agendas you don't support - where do you think our taxes go to?

 

[Xayma]

Toodulu: How can you justify subsidised junk food in that way?

You can't just draw a comparison to trains, trains are more environmentally friendly than cars and result in less congestion on the roads benefiting those who take both the trains and those who drive.

Subsidised coke does none of that. It only benefits the purchaser.

 

[Toodulu]

if there are services that the union provides that you don't agree with, then that still doesn't mean it shouldn't be there.
i guess it can be justified in that university students should be allowed access to all the food available to everyone else. and i guess there are people who need sugar throughout the day like diabetics.

 

[Xayma]

I'm not against unions offering food for profit or even for a cost price to them (so they break even) but I don't believe other students money should be put towards it. (The problem I see with VSU is that while many services I would be fine with it being compulsory eg money to keep student appeals independent, stuff such as subsidised coke shouldnt be)

 

[Toodulu]

hmm, how do you feel about subsidised coffee?

 

[Xayma]

If a loss is made on the coffee then against the subsidisation of it.

The only thing I would possibly consider being in support of subsidisation is bottled water. Everything else should be sold at a cost so as to either break even or make a profit.