I think I'm the same as you and need facts to believe something as opposed to faith. But I can see religion as 'hope' for some people so I don't wanna tell em ur wrong but if they start saying some nonsense like ur broke and sick cos it's God's plan then I'll give it to them.
Yes lol this is horrible. Epicurus had many many flawed beliefs, like for instance holding to the position contrary to Aristotle's nicomachean ethics that pleasure, despite consequences of the preceding actions to reach pleasure, is the ultimate good and desire for all humankind. He even opposed all formulations of teleology and instead was a mechanist, essentially meaning that everything that is in motion or filled with potential i.e everything natural and existing within the universe can always be explained by essential universals and empiricism like sciences such as physics. This is because he adopted a deistic, pagan multi-deity worldview. Obviously this is just wrong and it's formulated so horribly it makes me think epicurus was very ignorant or not classic by any means.
Self refuting.
So does secular discourse? Is that really your main objection to religion? That actions carried out from self-determined individuals are what the religion entails? Lol please get your head checked.
It's concerning that you want to engage in debate without utilising appropriate rhetoric, like I don't know spelling words correctly? Firstly, the first claim is flawed by virtue of the fact that people may be raised a certain religion yet have the option to internally change their beliefs as they grow older. Your point is that you just may be born into a religion yet this is digressive after the fact that people grow older, are exposed to different beliefs and positions.
Just a multiplicity of such flawed claims and it's so concerning that people like you, most atheists, try to argue against the theistic worldview with 0 understanding of theology, philosophy, metalogic, epistemology.
Mh hm.
how is free will without evil nonsensical? the analogy is closer to can there be shapes without edges (circle) rather than can a circle be a square.
Notice how you didn't even provide a single valid retort to any of my propositions, I'm referring to agency expounding external multiplicity of choices as opposed to internal of the same choice, there is no virtual distinction otherwise. Please go ahead.
how is free will without evil nonsensical? in understandable language.
So repeating myself for a second time, what part of my point did you think you were responding to? I already proposed the absence of any flaw that being perfection would be a state of which you can possess free will to an extent of it being actual in the sense that the all decisions are not free outside of the same state and mode of existence i.e internally multiple decision options. Whereas, free will, to be self determined must entail external multiple options in so far as whatever the subjects state of existence is. So it's self refuting to even posit a claim because preceding factors from making internal options with the state of perfection would entail having the possibility or ability to change your state of existence
So repeating myself for a second time, what part of my point did you think you were responding to? I already proposed the absence of any flaw that being perfection would be a state of which you can possess free will to an extent of it being actual in the sense that the all decisions are not free outside of the same state and mode of existence i.e internally multiple decision options. Whereas, free will, to be self determined must entail external multiple options in so far as whatever the subjects state of existence is. So it's self refuting to even posit a claim because preceding factors from making internal options with the state of perfection would entail having the possibility or ability to change your state of existence
Can you not flood this serious chat with your immaturity? Go elsewhere and do this.
