The Abortion Debate... (2 Viewers)

[girlanachronism]

im sorry if thats the way you feel and if they are your values but i am trying my best to look from the perspective of someone involved but to me a life is far more important than a career. most mothers would put their life on the line for their children and thats how it shud be. i think that is extremely selfish and it just shows that the world is sooooooo greedy. i would honestly force myself to have the baby. just because a baby doesnt breeth it doesnt mean its not alive. i could never kill a person because it is inconvenient

hey you didn't respond to my post before about children with disabilities and how much it completely changes the parent's lives. (usually the mother's). can i get your thoughts on that please?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Mother has abortion, unborn baby definately dies, possibility of being upset over loss of baby, possibility of judgement from other people, possibility of mother leading pretty much the same life as before.

Mother doesn't have abortion, baby has the chance at a good life, possibility of the baby having a bad life, mother defiantely will go through some hardship, loss of time, drop out of school, leave job for a while, harder to find new employment.

 

[lukebennett]

forcing people into the backyard and to jump down stairs and use coathangers...


I wasnt aborted was i...my parents where not in a dire situation were they?

no you werent aborted but i wouldnt want you to try and look at this situation from another perspective would i ? people are not forced to self abort, only if they have no morals or guts or can live with the fact they have just killed someone. society has almost convinced its self that a fetus is not real and has not rights. this is ridiculous. and i can understand that some people have it really really tough such as young single mothers but i know of someone who live on the streets and was a drug addict and couldnt cope at all and was trying to get clean at the same time as being a prostitute. she escaped from this brothel for the sake of her child even though she had no money, she got through this and otherwise she would have been forced to abort her child. she got off drugs and had no money, found herself a job and made alife for herself for the sake of a baby. she faced up to her responsibilites even though her baby was actually the result of a rape and it was not on her to do list.

 

[lukebennett]

hey you didn't respond to my post before about children with disabilities and how much it completely changes the parent's lives. (usually the mother's). can i get your thoughts on that please?

i cant believe how immoral you are. if you were struggling would you honestly abort a disabled child because you cant cope. could you live with the thought that you had been responsible for the loss of a life. it does change parents lives and its difficult but real life is difficult and abortion is obviously a covenient short cut for some people. i think that if this is such a problem for people to deal with the gov shud have support plans so that no one has to abort. but i still cant believe how selfish you are sounding. abort because it changes your life? thats ridiculous

 

[girlanachronism]

no you werent aborted but i wouldnt want you to try and look at this situation from another perspective would i ? people are not forced to self abort, only if they have no morals or guts or can live with the fact they have just killed someone. society has almost convinced its self that a fetus is not real and has not rights. this is ridiculous. and i can understand that some people have it really really tough such as young single mothers but i know of someone who live on the streets and was a drug addict and couldnt cope at all and was trying to get clean at the same time as being a prostitute. she escaped from this brothel for the sake of her child even though she had no money, she got through this and otherwise she would have been forced to abort her child. she got off drugs and had no money, found herself a job and made alife for herself for the sake of a baby. she faced up to her responsibilites even though her baby was actually the result of a rape and it was not on her to do list.

well the thing is, thats all good and well in that situation, and i really admire that woman if what you've said is true... but not everyone has the capacity to do that. i mean, should we all be as saintly as mother teresa?

 

[lukebennett]

well the thing is, thats all good and well in that situation, and i really admire that woman if what you've said is true... but not everyone has the capacity to do that. i mean, should we all be as saintly as mother teresa?

wouldnt you strive to be the best person you can be or is that too much effort for you to do?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I agree, i think abortions are ok.

I'm against the small minority who are doing it to avoid the sacrafice, but are constantly making the same mistakes, feel no sorrow at all for having an abortion & are still being funded for it.

 

[Generator]

Why should a catholic mother be the yardstick for determing a 'good' person?

 

[girlanachronism]

i cant believe how immoral you are. if you were struggling would you honestly abort a disabled child because you cant cope. could you live with the thought that you had been responsible for the loss of a life. it does change parents lives and its difficult but real life is difficult and abortion is obviously a covenient short cut for some people. i think that if this is such a problem for people to deal with the gov shud have support plans so that no one has to abort. but i still cant believe how selfish you are sounding. abort because it changes your life? thats ridiculous

fuck you. i have tried to be considerate and polite to you because even though i don't agree with your views, i respect your right to have them. you obviously know NOTHING about what it is like to have a child with a severe disability. it's not a matter of adjusting your life for a few months, it COMPLETELY turns things around. you haven't read this whole thread so i'll reiterate - i have a 7 yr old sister, my mum was 35 when she had her, so it was a relatively high risk birth purely because of that. the doctors told her that my sister might have downs syndrome. now, this would have completely turned my mother's life around. she would have had to give up working (which is her passion) and devote her life entirely to this one child. there was some reason why she couldn't abort, i think it was at a late stage in the pregnancy or something. in any case, she had my sister, obviously. there was absolutely nothing wrong with her. i love my sister to death and of course i'm glad she's alive, my mother made what could have been a great sacrifice. so i am coming to my conclusions from the pov of someone who could have potentially not had something incredible in their lives thanks to a doctor's mistake. however i still thoroughly believe that it is entirely up to the discretion of the parents in these situations, and until you are the one who is facing such a dilemna, you don't know shit.

 

[lukebennett]

im not comparing anyone to mother teresa but im saying that people shud do their best to be honorable people. to me abortion is an easy way out. it is a shame that some people get a worse deal with life but thats how life is and thers no excuse to go and kill a baby because you have it tougher than other people. by being a good person youd be giving the baby who cant make a choice a chance. that would be just a small fraction of what mother teresa would do

 

[girlanachronism]

wouldnt you strive to be the best person you can be or is that too much effort for you to do?

what the fuck is your problem?
of course i strive to be a good person, but the fact is not everyone is a goddamn saint

 

[Not-That-Bright]

You obviously know NOTHING of what it's like to be killed because you're going to inconvenience someone elses life.

 

[Generator]

not-that-bright, if an entity (yes, not a baby) is aborted, how could it have such a thought?

 

[girlanachronism]

You obviously know NOTHING of what it's like to be killed because you're going to inconvenience someone elses life.

that is just the most retarded argument anyway. even ignoring the iffy arguments about when you can feel pain and be self aware, the procedure lasts ~15 minutes, and once you're dead, you're not aware that you're dead. you're comparing ~15 mins of what is arguably pain to a lifetime of sacrifice and hardship

 

[lukebennett]

fuck you. i have tried to be considerate and polite to you because even though i don't agree with your views, i respect your right to have them. you obviously know NOTHING about what it is like to have a child with a severe disability. it's not a matter of adjusting your life for a few months, it COMPLETELY turns things around. you haven't read this whole thread so i'll reiterate - i have a 7 yr old sister, my mum was 35 when she had her, so it was a relatively high risk birth purely because of that. the doctors told her that my sister might have downs syndrome. now, this would have completely turned my mother's life around. she would have had to give up working (which is her passion) and devote her life entirely to this one child. there was some reason why she couldn't abort, i think it was at a late stage in the pregnancy or something. in any case, she had my sister, obviously. there was absolutely nothing wrong with her. i love my sister to death and of course i'm glad she's alive, my mother made what could have been a great sacrifice. so i am coming to my conclusions from the pov of someone who could have potentially not had something incredible in their lives thanks to a doctor's mistake. however i still thoroughly believe that it is entirely up to the discretion of the parents in these situations, and until you are the one who is facing such a dilemna, you don't know shit.

i am sincerely sorry if i have insulted you i just cant see how a disability is an excuse to kill someone or not let them have a life. i know it rally turns peoples lives around , but would you have been extremely disappointed if your sister ahd down syndrome. does that all of the sudden make her life not worth living. it is convenient she doesnt have down syndrome but in either way she has just as uch of a right to live

 

[Not-That-Bright]

not-that-bright, if an entity (yes, not a baby) is aborted, how could it have such a thought?

ok, let me say it a different way...
You obviously don't know what it's like to have your limbs ripped off.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

woo hoo collateral damage? War in iraq?

Well at least the people in the war on iraq... on both sides have done something wrong, even the young civilians.
A Foetus has never done anything wrong in its entire life and it still dies.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

If the hardship is so bad and 15 minutes of pain then death is so easy, how's bout the second you get pregnant you kill yourself and the baby.

 

[girlanachronism]

i am sincerely sorry if i have insulted you i just cant see how a disability is an excuse to kill someone or not let them have a life. i know it rally turns peoples lives around , but would you have been extremely disappointed if your sister ahd down syndrome. does that all of the sudden make her life not worth living. it is convenient she doesnt have down syndrome but in either way she has just as uch of a right to live

ah! you are not getting me here!
it is all good and well to say that people are selfish. however until you have been in that situation, how can you possibly judge? moral righteousness is all good in theory. doesn't always hold up in practise.
p.s. please don't try to emotionally blackmail me with my sister, of course i am glad she's alive and i will always love her no matter what, however i would have understood if my mother had not wanted to take the risk

 

[lukebennett]

that is just the most retarded argument anyway. even ignoring the iffy arguments about when you can feel pain and be self aware, the procedure lasts ~15 minutes, and once you're dead, you're not aware that you're dead. you're comparing ~15 mins of what is arguably pain to a lifetime of sacrifice and hardship

so you would sacrifice a life to have an easier more convenient one and less hard for yourself. i just cant get over how cruel that sounds even with the thought that youd be eliminating a lifetime of hardship. it just sounds so selfish not to allow a fetus or baby their right to a life. the can actually experience emotions at the fetal stage when they are aborted