Uni Advice - UOW or move to Usyd? (2 Viewers)

[melsc]

I guess it depends which suits you better, loving at home or away from it? Will moving away cause you more troubles?

I have heard on numerous occasions that UoW has a good law program and a very good employment percentage

 

[Not-That-Bright]

because melb has shit weather, shit people, and gay.

I'm assuming the 'gay' is a positive?

 

[neo o]

I'm assuming the 'gay' is a positive?

He does have quite a few bottoms in his signature.

 

[stazi]

AND a few cocks in my mouth

 

[poloktim]

There is no social life in Wollongong. I come from Wollongong. I know. You will find Sydney a much better place to live with more people who are likely to be in line with your social, political and moral outlook.

Wollongong is nothing but dirty bogans, so don't worry about it.

There's no social life in Wollongong if you're a complete loser. Even I can go out and have fun at Wollongong, talk to people I know and you'll find that it's really hard for me to bother going out or enjoy myself while I'm out.

I think we just found Ziff's true calling.

As for Sydney, I think anybody can find people who are in line with their social/political and moral outlooks there.

Hey, was just after some advice. Sorry if us year 12 leavers are getting annoying with all the "which uni" questions, but i'd appreciate any advice. I achieved a uai of 99.8, and am having serious trouble deciding where to study law. I can either;
- go to UOW and still live at home due to it being close
OR
- I could go to Usyd, but have to move up there to go.

I've looked at both uni's, so this isnt a "which uni is better" question. I just feel that there is perhaps more opportunity for things up in Sydney rather than living in a small rural coastal town where I do now. On the other hand, the cost of living would be much higher if I moved away.

Also, for those who have had to move away for uni to study law, is it hard to juggle part-time work and study?

The reason I hadnt planned for any of this before is that I was only expecting to get the uai for wollongong. Now Ive been trying to get all the advice I can. If anyone could share some light from your own experience that would be awesome.

Thanks Heaps!

Where in the region do you live? If you're anywhere from Kiama up, you might consider commuting everyday to USyd (though that'll get long/boring/suicide inducing, I'd imagine).

Otherwise, choose the university you really want to go to? If you do really want to go to Sydney, go there. If worse comes to worse and you run out of money by the end of the year, you could always transfer to UoW and live at home (there are people who do transfer from sandstone universities to the regional/suburban ones).

Sydney definately has the backing of one of Australia's premier universities, especially in the field of Law. It is also a member of the Group of Eight (a "No Homers" club for elite universities), and has a long standing reputation.

Wollongong is a lot smaller than Sydney, therefore has a much more friendly/home-like atmosphere. Wollongong is also Australia's premier university in teaching as selected by the Australian Government, which means you have a higher chance of leaving uni knowing what you're talking about if you go to Wollongong. Also, finally, the campus is a lot cleaner than Sydney (the air is so much clearer in Wollongong than in the City).

As for my opinion of what you should do? I say go to Sydney if you can afford it. It's an opportunity that you shouldn't miss.

In some circles there is still a cultural cringe factor with non-USYD...it's stupid because some of the other unis have really high, perhaps superior teaching.

There's no perhaps about it, the University of Wollongong does have superior teaching.

With your marks you should go to the best law school you can get into.

If Wollongong's teaching is superior to that of Sydney's, then wouldn't that make Wollongong's law school better than Sydney's for jaihson's sake? At least in terms of graduate outcomes?

 

[GoodToGo]

If Wollongong's teaching is superior to that of Sydney's, then wouldn't that make Wollongong's law school better than Sydney's for jaihson's sake? At least in terms of graduate outcomes?

Like I said, cultural cringe factor. Plus being "better taught" is not that important factor in post-graduation career outcome in law. No matter how much USYD lags behind in teaching compared to UOW...law is such a traditional field, USYD will be perceived to be the oldest and the best.

How many clerkships are given to USYD students vs UOW students?

How many associateships do USYD students receive with high court/federal court/supreme court judges comapred to UOW students?

Every other uni in NSW generally gets shat if you consider the above.

It's an extension of the old-boy network...and it can work against jaihson if he goes to UOW over USYD, no matter how kick-arse UOW teaches him.

 

[santaslayer]

Like I said, cultural cringe factor. Plus being "better taught" is not that important factor in post-graduation career outcome in law. No matter how much USYD lags behind in teaching compared to UOW...law is such a traditional field, USYD will be perceived to be the oldest and the best.

How many clerkships are given to USYD students vs UOW students?

How many associateships do USYD students receive with high court/federal court/supreme court judges comapred to UOW students?

Every other uni in NSW generally gets shat if you consider the above.

It's an extension of the old-boy network...and it can work against jaihson if he goes to UOW over USYD, no matter how kick-arse UOW teaches him.

REFORM...no?

People's attitudes change over time.
If it was so 'old boy' we wouldn't have had two people being able to work for the CJ just in these few years.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

You guys don't think that universities perhaps made their teaching appear shoddier in an attempt to get more funding as this was how the government was allocating funding?

Also, just because the teachers are better... does not mean you end up with smarter students. You could have crap teachers, but great facilities and a focus on independant learning that could produce far more qualified students.

Anyway, I would seriously suggest looking at how the teaching survey was conducted before I made any brash comments about the quality of teaching.

 

[poloktim]

Like I said, cultural cringe factor. Plus being "better taught" is not that important factor in post-graduation career outcome in law. No matter how much USYD lags behind in teaching compared to UOW...law is such a traditional field, USYD will be perceived to be the oldest and the best.

How many clerkships are given to USYD students vs UOW students?

How many associateships do USYD students receive with high court/federal court/supreme court judges comapred to UOW students?

Every other uni in NSW generally gets shat if you consider the above.

It's an extension of the old-boy network...and it can work against jaihson if he goes to UOW over USYD, no matter how kick-arse UOW teaches him.

"You can get a better job for a not-as-good education, and only on the basis of what university you go to."
Compared with:
"You can get a job based on what you know and how well you can do it."

I think I'd prefer the latter. But as I said, Sydney is a nice opportunity and if he can afford it, he should try.

 

[= Jennifer =]

i would chose usyd, in the end both law courses will allow you to become a lawyer, but usyd has the added prestige

 

[poloktim]

i would chose usyd, in the end both law courses will allow you to become a lawyer, but usyd has the added prestige

That's what I think. Glad somebody is on the same page.

 

[Frigid]

But how many High Court judges are from UOW ?
And how many are from Sydney ?

that's not a very fair comparison mr poohboy considering the fact that "The Faculty of Law at the University of Wollongong was established in 1990".

it could hardly be expected that someone could start and finish their law degree, start practising and be selected as a high court judge within the space of 15-16 years.

and remember McHugh J never went to uni so ner

 

[charlie_charlie]

Yeah, I agree...the reason why Sydney U even has such a wide and successful alumni in the first place is because its old-ness (hence the proliferation of Hogwarts'-like buildings) No one else can compete cos they weren't even around when Sydney Uni was established!

it depends what you value more out of the degree really. And what kind of law you're going to practice: if you wanna be a top-tier lawyer, Sydney Uni is going to be a safer bet, compartatively speaking. But if you want to do other legal related things, theres no reason why UOW wouldn't be as sufficient, especially if you already live down there.

 

[Frigid]

meh. i'm sick of Top-Tier-menTality... coz i realise after beating three gallizion other applications to get that summer and grad position, you're gonna come out as a little shitkicker getting paid an equivalent wage of $20/hour after tax...

 

[charlie_charlie]

Becoming disheartened with the corporate legal scene already Frigid? haha....and only halfway through the law degree....

But seriously, would the AG, when looking to assess a High Court judge when they're like 60, go "hmmm....you went to (not-USYD)- sorry, we can't give you this role". Uni prestige only really counts in the first graduate job....and then its all about your prowess in the court/office

 

[Frigid]

Becoming disheartened with the corporate legal scene already Frigid? haha....and only halfway through the law degree....

you realise why the firms get past summers to talk to us and not the first year graduates? coz a summer is just about fun: they go muck around the firm, do a little bit of work, follow the partners to lunch, go to socials and get drunk, then they market these summers to us guillible suckers. once we get sucked into top tier firm, "mean rotten & nasty", they'll make us kick shit for 12+ hrs a day for at least 5-7 years... haha.

frankly, i'm just shitted about not getting paid enough. tax rate too high, salary too low.

 

[neo o]

you realise why the firms get past summers to talk to us and not the first year graduates? coz a summer is just about fun: they go muck around the firm, do a little bit of work, follow the partners to lunch, go to socials and get drunk, then they market these summers to us guillible suckers. once we get sucked into top tier firm, "mean rotten & nasty", they'll make us kick shit for 12+ hrs a day for at least 5-7 years... haha.

frankly, i'm just shitted about not getting paid enough. tax rate too high, salary too low.

There's always Hong Kong

 

[BillytheFIsh]

...you're gonna come out as a little shitkicker getting paid an equivalent wage of $20/hour after tax...

HAHAHA... 0 POA solicitors in top-tiers will get nowhere near 20/hour net.

This is all silly talk. Which uni you go to really makes no difference if you're motivated and reasonably intelligent about how you go about seeking out your career.

I was contemplating writing up a new thread on this but to be honest I can't be bothered - however, here is an abridged version - the trick to getting jobs is to be personable and social. You should be going to all those "meet the profession" things and try to make as many contacts in as many different places as you can. Try to communicate and socialise with these people on topics other than law - yes this can be hard, but lawyers spend their whole lives talking about law. It's refreshing when you can actually talk to someone about something interesting.

It's not about being part of the "boys club" (although this may well help in forging the initial contact) it's about expanding your circle of contacts with people who think you're reasonably intelligent, hard-working and would be easy to work with. You can do this regardless of which uni you went to.

Although I would say that unless you intend on practicing somewhere else - you really do need to do this in your capital city. Some areas just have no clientele outside the big cities.

Also - obviously big firms do have their hoops that you have to jump through - and you will have to do this if that's the choice you make - but having contacts certainly won't hurt in this regard.

It's all about your social skills - whether it be at social functions or interviews... it's about how you can relate and interact with other lawyers that will determine where you end up. Also - it's great to get to know lawyers on a more personal level so you get a feel of what life is like at a particular firm - rather than what Frigid was talking about - them just showing you what they want you to see.

If you do manage to set up these contacts before you graduate, you'll have a whole variety of options open to you in a much broader scope of posibilities and that's really the best way to be rather than to have pasted yourself into limited options.

AND

You never know when you might need a favour from someone. It saves a hell of a lot of hassle if you need something from an area your unfamiliar with and there's someone you can call directly and ask.

 

[Frigid]

HAHAHA... 0 POA solicitors in top-tiers will get nowhere near 20/hour net.

This is all silly talk. Which uni you go to really makes no difference if you're motivated and reasonably intelligent about how you go about seeking out your career.

I was contemplating writing up a new thread on this but to be honest I can't be bothered...

what's POA?

write us a thread billy, stop being so lazzzy.

 

[santaslayer]

Bearpooh, I'd choose Oxford over UoW if I could ever get my stupid arse there. I have to congratulate you again.

You sorta described the only major advantage USYD has over ANY university in Sydney. The thing is, any university has a very real potential of overcomming it with time.