Does God exist? (17 Viewers)

[Will Shakespear]

State reasons why. 'No' is not a good enough answer.

it is the default answer though...

 

[x.christina]

Particularly considering we wouldn't need 900 pages in this thread if it was that simple.

Exactly.

 

[rant]

I had an interesting discussion with a christian friend which basically boils down into this neat summary:

I asked her why the Lord of all creation/God/Jesus (all fictitions aside) demands from his intelligent creations, that were (and lets not forget this) modestly made in his own image, unwavering worship and praise. Was it due to his NEED of praise (i.e. he is low on self-esteem) or his enjoyment of it(i.e. he is a narcissist)?

Because being the perfect being that he is, wouldn't that also imply perfect modesty? And creating the whole universe would make you kinda confident in your abilities, don't you think? So why does he demand worship? There's something rotten in denmark, methinks. (the non-existence kind of rotten, probably)

My friend's uncle is a priest and her family is pretty religious, so it's safe to say she's well versed in this stuff. But, and the religious often do this (I've found from personal experience) she basically just dodged the meat and potatoes of the question and her belief. She jumped into her ecclesiastic safe-zone and pulled the 'mysterious ways' card.

Her: "You cannot define God in human terms."
Me: "As a human, how else am I supposed to define him?"

I suppose she had kind of a point, I was anthropomorphising God a little. But if i was made into his image, wouldn't that inherently impose an anthropomorphisation onto him?

Which brings me to my first, perhaps rhetorical, question, why would God need your praise, acknowledgement and worship?

 

[SAVAK]

rant, is she hot? just fuck her. who cares which jesus she believes in.

 

[rant]

rant, is she hot? just fuck her. who cares which jesus she believes in.

hahaha

will keep in mind!

 

[moll.]

god exists til something negative comes up in our lives which we believe we do not deserve and if there was a god he/she would help us out...

Blatantly false. I've never had anything majorly unhappy in my life, yet I'm one of the strongest atheists on this forum.

 

[greekgun]

Ur either religious or ur not. Sure, negative experiences can affect how religious u are, but they dont often turn u off religion completely. In my case, it took a lot of thinking to believe that their is no god.

 

[greekgun]

Yeah ur right, sometimes when someone experiences such a negative thing they can question their faith/beliefs to the point where they are no longer faithful. But i imagine this doesnt happen all that often compared to faithful people just questioning their beliefs but continuing to be faithful.

Actually i have a question to ask all u strongly religious and atheist people.
Are you religious/not religious because your parents are?
How much of ur ubringing by ur parents affect ur religous views?
And if u diverged away from ur parents religous views how did they go about it?

 

[Graney]

true, but that's arguable ,sometimes negatives experiences can have a major impact, completely changing views on god/religion . Lets say ur involved in some major accident which severe's your arms and they cant be replaced (just as an example) this means ur quality of life has just been decreased by 90% (example), as if you wouldnt question the existence of god, and the religion itself.. Coz most people never think of god wen anything good comes up in life, only when bad suff happens to them, should listen to that song "why me lord"
he says:
" you should remember god in your everyday doings.. Not just when it gets bad"

That's really over simplifying the reasons people come to hold their beliefs.

Most people's separation or attachment to religion does not come about due to some major trauma.

People don't generally give up their beliefs over any single unfortunate incident. Sane theists don't expect god to pave the way over every single little pratfall in their lives.

If anything, bad times drive people closer to god. Witness the strong trends in religious growth in the developing world as opposed to the long term decline in religion in the West.

As soon as people start to achieve a level of material comfort, or at least become dedicated to the pursuit of it, god becomes a bit of an irrelevance.

 

[greekgun]

Alright graney wtf is this shit. I could have sworn ur dp was exactly the same a couple of days back but had a bruised banana instead of a perfect 1. Are u changing dp's all the time or am i just fried?

 

[Graney]

You're probably thinking of Nebuchadnezzar, who has a similar avatar.

Or you're ripped off your nut again.

 

[emytaylor164]

true, but that's arguable ,sometimes negatives experiences can have a major impact, completely changing views on god/religion . Lets say ur involved in some major accident which severe's your arms and they cant be replaced (just as an example) this means ur quality of life has just been decreased by 90% (example), as if you wouldnt question the existence of god, and the religion itself.. Coz most people never think of god wen anything good comes up in life, only when bad suff happens to them, should listen to that song "why me lord"
he says:
" you should remember god in your everyday doings.. Not just when it gets bad"

Personally I find hard times is when i rely on God more then ever, it is when things are easy i do not rely on him as much

 

[Musi_Zhang]

god is like a sort of ideology
it depends on different ppl who got diff images

 

[moll.]

god is like a sort of ideology
it depends on different ppl who got diff images

Thanks Captain Obvious. What would we do without you and your amazing powers of observation? [rhetorical question; do not respond]

 

[rant]

lol I like how he says 'sort of' an ideology.

ALSO, I fear my wall of text is being sadly ignored ~~

I had an interesting discussion with a christian friend which basically boils down into this neat summary:

I asked her why the Lord of all creation/God/Jesus (all fictitions aside) demands from his intelligent creations, that were (and lets not forget this) modestly made in his own image, unwavering worship and praise. Was it due to his NEED of praise (i.e. he is low on self-esteem) or his enjoyment of it(i.e. he is a narcissist)?

Because being the perfect being that he is, wouldn't that also imply perfect modesty? And creating the whole universe would make you kinda confident in your abilities, don't you think? So why does he demand worship? There's something rotten in denmark, methinks. (the non-existence kind of rotten, probably)

My friend's uncle is a priest and her family is pretty religious, so it's safe to say she's well versed in this stuff. But, and the religious often do this (I've found from personal experience) she basically just dodged the meat and potatoes of the question and her belief. She jumped into her ecclesiastic safe-zone and pulled the 'mysterious ways' card.

Her: "You cannot define God in human terms."
Me: "As a human, how else am I supposed to define him?"

I suppose she had kind of a point, I was anthropomorphising God a little. But if i was made into his image, wouldn't that inherently impose an anthropomorphisation onto him?

Which brings me to my first, perhaps rhetorical, question, why would God need your praise, acknowledgement and worship?

give me an answer, religious bosers!

 

[Iron]

Well the first most important commandment is to fully love God. You mustnt think of this as some sort of pettiness on His part - that's thinking in human, worldly terms, where we are reluctant to bow down to men who are basically our equals/brothers. Rather, think of it as submitting to Truth in its most complete form; if youre a Christian you simply have to acknowledge that God created the heavens and the earth, and he has a divine plan for our very own lives. This is a great thing and is worthy of praise. It cannot be simply ignored.

If you disagree, then youve come to the wrong shop

 

[Iron]

-I have MS and I didn't tell anybody.
Yeah. So, you're having a little bit of a day
-Are you going to make jokes?
God doesn't make cars crash and you know it. Stop using me as an excuse
-The party's not going to want me to run
The party will come back. You'll get them back.

 

[rant]

Well the first most important commandment is to fully love God. You mustnt think of this as some sort of pettiness on His part - that's thinking in human, worldly terms, where we are reluctant to bow down to men who are basically our equals/brothers. Rather, think of it as submitting to Truth in its most complete form; if youre a Christian you simply have to acknowledge that God created the heavens and the earth, and he has a divine plan for our very own lives. This is a great thing and is worthy of praise. It cannot be simply ignored.

If you disagree, then youve come to the wrong shop

I would say that it's Christians in general who think of God in the most 'human, worldly terms'. The Christian conception of God often suggests that worshipping him, acknowledging him is, like you said, necessary for salvation and that God is 'good' and 'loves us'.

I can really only understand either assuming that what we're dealing with here is a God whose psychology is very similar to ours, with strong narcissist tendencies (and very high empathy, if he genuinely does love us). In fact, most traits attributed to God imply very strongly that his psychology is that of a human with personality disorders.

We have to define God in human terms, otherwise the situation becomes completely incomprehensible - there is absolutely no reason for a random divine being to care about us or our worship, let alone have a concept of 'good' that relates to us.

 

[Iron]

I dont know if you want a response to that. I cant agree with your considered analysis that God is a defective human, or your contention that He cares nothing for His creation

 

[rant]

lol i would't mind a response.

but we can agree to disagree~