Does God exist? (25 Viewers)

[Dr_Doom]

i thought we were created in the image of god, so shouldn't we be capable of understanding that which he understands?

Image doesn't mean we are capable of doing what GOD does or the way he thinks.

 

[davin]

All religions agree that the time we see and work on is not the time of God. We have lready discussed that so the big bang might be big for us and like a dot for God or not even that. Time is again a human construct, but God is not.
I think the difference of opinion here over belief can hardly be removed coz its the intention that matters here. I intend to believe in him so I do. You are adamnt not to intend so you dont.

time is not a human construct any more than something, say, distance, is. the units were created by humans to break it up, but that doesn't mean there wasn't time prior to humans

and its not that i'm adamant not to believe, i've just never had any reason TO believe

 

[Analyst]

I was using an analogy that I felt was a particularly good one. That doesn't mean I have to have the exact same beliefs as him and follow blindly and without thought. Second, I would like to see your arguement that he believes in a god, since quickly searching, I find this quote attributed to him at wikipedia:
"The whole history of science has been the gradual realisation that events do not happen in an arbitrary manner, but that they reflect a certain underlying order, which may or may not be divinely inspired." which does not indicate belief, and also him writing the following:
"there would be no singularities at which the laws of science broke down and no edge of space-time at which one would have to appeal to God or some new law to set the boundary conditions for space-time . . . The universe would be completely self-contained and not affected by anything outside itself. It would neither be created nor destroyed. It would just BE . . . What place, then, for a creator?"
so i wonder how you claim he believes there is a god.

write him an email and ask him. I already have!

 

[crazyhomo]

Image doesn't mean we are capable of doing what GOD does or the way he thinks.

what does it mean?

 

[Analyst]

what does it mean?

It means Man has Gods attributes in very limited capacities, so although we have the attributes, we cant use them in the way god can, unless he wills so. even if He wills,its to a limit hence obviously man can never be as capable as God.

 

[davin]

write him an email and ask him. I already have!

in other words, you're making stuff up outright and assumed that no one would pay attention to it, or take the time to show that you have no basis in reality.

i also am going to HIGHLY doubt that you had any correspondance with Hawking, given the fact that a. you've not earned any credibility thus far, b. you've not backed up that claim, and c. i don't think that Hawking has the capability to communicate via a computer easily and the time it would take for any response would be too long for him to be answering random emails from people.

 

[Analyst]

in other words, you're making stuff up outright and assumed that no one would pay attention to it, or take the time to show that you have no basis in reality.

i also am going to HIGHLY doubt that you had any correspondance with Hawking, given the fact that a. you've not earned any credibility thus far, b. you've not backed up that claim, and c. i don't think that Hawking has the capability to communicate via a computer easily and the time it would take for any response would be too long for him to be answering random emails from people.

I seriously suggest you should read his work, and not just quote randomly from it. you know what thats called...a word bite

 

[crazyhomo]

It means Man has Gods attributes in very limited capacities, so although we have the attributes, we cant use them in the way god can, unless he wills so. even if He wills,its to a limit hence obviously man can never be as capable as God.

http://putercomposer.com/Goal.jpg

 

[davin]

i've unfortunitly not had the chance to read his works in full yet, but i HAVE heard him in person twice now, the most recent time, he talked about the beginning of the universe. its where i got the analogy about the south pole from.

however, you didn't address any of the three points i made as to why i disbelieved your claim, and while the first is based on my own judgement, you've done nothing to refute b. or c.

 

[The Brucemaster]

I seriously suggest you should read his work, and not just quote randomly from it. you know what thats called...a word bite

First of all there is nothing wrong with QUOTING from someones work, besides what do you suggest he does, posts Hawking's entire thesis? I think not.

Secondly, i seriously doubt that you yourself have read Hawking's works as you have demonstrated no familiarity with it thus far.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

he believes in God, so should you.

Stephen Hawking believes in God? I don't think so.

I seriously suggest you should read his work, and not just quote randomly from it. you know what thats called...a word bite

lol shut up dude, you try so hard to be smart and fail so miserably.

I again ask you how you know the bible is not the word of the devil.

 

[Dr_Doom]

Would the devil write about how to help others and forgive our sins? I don't think so.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Would the devil write about how to help others and forgive our sins? I don't think so.

Well in order to trick people, eh?

There are things in the bible, that don't corrospond with what we've discovered in the natural world, things that seem wrong... now God I'm sure by most people's definition, was the creator of the natural world... so how could he get it wrong? ZOMG IT WAS THE DEVIL.

 

[katie_tully]

Honestly. I can’t be bothered reading 10 pages since my last post, especially considering they’re roughly of the same content.

You’re all lucky I don’t have a social life. And remember! “Anyone willing to be corrected is on the pathway to life. Anyone refusing has lost his chance” Proverbs 10:17

Analyst, this especially relates to you. For this is the last time I am going to say this. My comments were concerning the way in which certain religions are undertaken. The way in which the followers of certain religious promote their chosen faith. I have more respect for religions such as Buddhism, over Christianity or Islam, because their doctrines are not based on violence, and nor has their histories been completely clouded by crusades, suicide bombers and murder. This is not an admission in a belief in any God, for I did not state I believe the God’s in their religions are any more valid than the God in Christianity/Islam. Do you comprehend? Because it seems everybody else does, except you.

Oh Sam04u, I often wonder, with your infinite wisdom concerning religion, whether you have actually ever read the entire Bible. Reading your rants, I decided to pull out my copy and have a little read. Allow me to quote some of my favourite proverbs, which I think pertain especially to you.

“Don’t be conceited, sure of your own wisdom”
“Don’t talk so much, you keep putting your foot in your mouth”

Genevania, I hope you understand how hypocritical it is to dismiss Genesis and Leviticus, because the New Testament is “revised”. So because the New Testament contradicts the Old Testament how can you be sure which is the most correct? You can’t, so like most 21st Century Christians you choose the text which is less extreme and hardcore, so that it conforms to your idea of Christians being the holiest and peaceful people on Earth. I happen to regard the Old Testament as being a more reliable indication of the true nature of Christianity. From John comes a nice quote. “Someone may say I am a Christian, I am on my way to heaven. I belong to Christ’, but if he doesn’t do what Christ tells him to, he is a liar”.
I think that is interesting, especially in your haste to accuse me of reading and not comprehending either the Old and New Testaments. Oh my, how presumptuous of you, you Christian!

Anyway, you’re all hypocrites in your attempts to dismiss our, (the non believers) arguments. I can be presumptuous, because I am not a Christian, therefore I’m already going to hell (apparently)

 

[crazyhomo]

Would the devil write about how to help others and forgive our sins? I don't think so.

the devil works in mysterious ways

 

[Captain Gh3y]

Matthew 7:12: "Always treat others as you would like them to treat you: THAT IS THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS [ie. the OT]"

Whenever the New and Old testaments disagree, for Christians the NT always overrules the OT.

 

[katie_tully]

Whenever the New and Old testaments disagree, for Christians the NT always overrules the OT.
__________________

Yes, and why is this? Because the NT is watered down, and they don't want to admit that their religion is based on violence and propaganda!
Just listen to the Pope's Easter speach and you will understand what true Christianity sounds like.

Extreme and illogical.

 

[Captain Gh3y]

Yes, and why is this? Because the NT is watered down, and they don't want to admit that their religion is based on violence and propaganda!
Just listen to the Pope's Easter speach and you will understand what true Christianity sounds like.

Extreme and illogical.

It's actually because Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus, which for some bizarre reason (hmm...) just happen to be in the New Testament.

Clearly if it wasn't, we wouldn't be Christians, but Jews. That seems pretty obvious to me. Nothing to do with watering down.

...

Edit: Though it is of course, still debated by NT scholars to what extent Jesus meant to grant exceptions from Mosaic law. Clearly some of his teachings are incompatible with the demands of the Laws in Deuteronomy and Leviticus. One popular argument is obviously that those laws were largely for the ancient Hebrews in that context.

Even Orthodox Jews and fundamentalist Christians that attempt to adhere to Mosaic law clearly don't follow through with many of the aspects of capital punishment and sacrifice.

 

[stalk_if_u_dare]

Yes, and why is this? Because the NT is watered down, and they don't want to admit that their religion is based on violence and propaganda!
Just listen to the Pope's Easter speach and you will understand what true Christianity sounds like.

Extreme and illogical.

dont like the pope....
The Arch Bishop of Cantebury's speech was much more interesting

 

[katie_tully]

It's actually because Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus, which for some bizarre reason (hmm...) just happen to be in the New Testament.

Clearly if it wasn't, we wouldn't be Christians, but Jews. That seems pretty obvious to me. Nothing to do with watering down.

And who is Jesus? Ah, the son of God. So Christians are willing to dismiss the word of God, for the word of Jesus. Christianity isn't based purely on the teachings of Jesus.

The Christians on here dismiss the teachings in the OT, and I want a valid reason as to why. As far as I am concerned, you're either a Christian or you're not. If you are, then you consider the OT as valid as the NT. Picking and choosing which aspects of your religion you think should be taken literally or metaphorically isn't good enough.