Does God exist? (3 Viewers)

do you believe in god?


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jimmysmith560

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Honestly, knowing we will probably not get any non-biblical evidence of the existence of any religious figure anytime soon (God, Jesus, etc), I choose to embrace Pascal’s wager as a Christian.
 

Squar3root

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Lmao when did I mention the bible, as if you don't believe Jesus existed, to believe in the divinity of him is one thing, but to not believe that he actually existed? The ample evidence refers to the art (the 2th century catacombs), architecture, tradition if you want more psychical evidence, Caeser and Pontius Pilatus governed and ordered Jesus to crucifixion do you believe that? The new testament consists of multiple stories from witnesses recounting the story of Jesus. They have the tomb of Jesus, when you read the bible it will tell you from brith to death where Jesus went and lived. The church of Christ has everything perserved from the time of Jesus you would be surprised how many artefacts they hold, they have the cross Jesus died on, the belt of Holy Mary, etc.
but like how do we know they weren't all smoking something and just saw some guy walking on water. like yeah i could believe that some guy jesus existed yeah sure but then people wanna throw in weird "facts" about him like he walked on water and turned water into wine. like why would they do that if they wanted to make it credible and believable?

like if I told u a girl got pregnant and she was adamant she never had sex, etc you'd prob believe that she is lying. but when a girl did it 2k years ago apparently it is a miracle?
 

braintic

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Glad to have been able to stir up this thread again. Anyone also feel like challenging the idiocy of Adolf Trumpler?
 

Qeru

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Honestly, knowing we will probably not get any non-biblical evidence of the existence of any religious figure anytime soon (God, Jesus, etc), I choose to embrace Pascal’s wager as a Christian.
My personal problem with Pascal's wager is that there is a 2x2 square for every religion. Every religion rejects every other religion and many of these religions have 'perks' of joining (going to heaven, enlightenment etc.). So really you are only in one 2x2 square out of millions.
 

jimmysmith560

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My personal problem with Pascal's wager is that there is a 2x2 square for every religion. Every religion rejects every other religion and many of these religions have 'perks' of joining (going to heaven, enlightenment etc.). So really you are only in one 2x2 square out of millions.
The way I see it, as long as the core belief in God is there, Pascal's wager would be viable, regardless of one's religion. At the end of the day, it's the person's relationship with God that matters. This works pretty well with Abrahamic religions as they share this core belief (of course there are differences between other minor beliefs within those religions).
 

SylviaB

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The way I see it, as long as the core belief in God is there, Pascal's wager would be viable, regardless of one's religion. At the end of the day, it's the person's relationship with God that matters. This works pretty well with Abrahamic religions as they share this core belief (of course there are differences between other minor beliefs within those religions).
no its not viable lmao you are a blasphemer under Islam and will go to hell if islam is true
 

jimmysmith560

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no its not viable lmao you are a blasphemer under Islam and will go to hell if islam is true
That could be the case regardless of Pascal's wager.

My initial point was aimed at the uncertainty of the existence of God and how Pascal's wager would be a better option than atheism (for me). Which religion is true (if any) is a completely different issue.
 

SylviaB

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That could be the case regardless of Pascal's wager.

My initial point was aimed at the uncertainty of the existence of God and how Pascal's wager would be a better option than atheism (for me). Which religion is true (if any) is a completely different issue.
Except you didn't demonstrate that pascal's wager is a better option.
 

jimmysmith560

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Except you didn't demonstrate that pascal's wager is a better option.
A better option than atheism? I mean, if one chooses to be an atheist rather than embracing Pascal's wager and a religion like Chrisitanity or Islam turns out to be true, I don't think the outcome will be favourable for that person. On the other hand, there is no actual considerable loss if one acknowledges the existence of God. I guess that's where agnosticism becomes relevant, due to the ambiguity of this thread's main topic and the lack of conclusive evidence that could be used to permanently silence a particular side.

Also, can you elaborate on how I would be considered a blasphemer and be sent to hell if Islam turns out to be the true religion? I'm pretty sure that in Islam, non-Muslim people are forgiven in such circumstances, provided they were at least acknowledging the existence of God and being good people throughout their life.

It would be great if any Muslim people here can provide some info about the accuracy of that statement :)
 

B1andB2

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no its not viable lmao you are a blasphemer under Islam and will go to hell if islam is true
A better option than atheism? I mean, if one chooses to be an atheist rather than embracing Pascal's wager and a religion like Chrisitanity or Islam turns out to be true, I don't think the outcome will be favourable for that person. On the other hand, there is no actual considerable loss if one acknowledges the existence of God. I guess that's where agnosticism becomes relevant, due to the ambiguity of this thread's main topic and the lack of conclusive evidence that could be used to permanently silence a particular side.

Also, can you elaborate on how I would be considered a blasphemer and be sent to hell if Islam turns out to be the true religion? I'm pretty sure that in Islam, non-Muslim people are forgiven in such circumstances, provided they were at least acknowledging the existence of God and being good people throughout their life.

It would be great if any Muslim people here can provide some info about the accuracy of that statement :)
To claim that a blasphemer will go to hell if islam is true also implies that muslims are saved from hell. This dichotomy is not true.

So, those who argue this would question: What then, is the point of being a muslim; making daily prayers, ongoing fasts, charity, and such ? Isn't it unfair for someone who fulfils all the core obligations (righteousness, belief in god, etc) to be granted the same afterlife as someone who fulfils not only the core obligations but much more than that?

Firstly, this argument assumes that you are going to be held to account according to someone else’s standards. Each of us will be held to account according to a unique standard applied to us, according to our personal circumstances.

Secondly, Heaven and Hell are not two simple categories. As the Quran alludes to in its reference to various levels of Heaven and Hell, punishment and reward differ according to a person’s faith and deeds.

However, If a person rejects Islam after knowing Islam and fully understanding its truth he will be asked about it by God. Otherwise he will be judged according to his own religion and his understanding of right and wrong. Simply being a Muslim is not enough to enter paradise. It is the righteous who are rewarded by God

{Chapter 2. Verse 62}

"Surely, those who believed in Allah, and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabians, -whosoever believes in Allah and in the Last Day, and does good deeds - all such people will have their reward with their Lord, and there will be no reason for them to fear, nor shall they grieve"

Hope this clears it up @jimmysmith560 !
 

jimmysmith560

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To claim that a blasphemer will go to hell if islam is true also implies that muslims are saved from hell. This dichotomy is not true.

So, those who argue this would question: What then, is the point of being a muslim; making daily prayers, ongoing fasts, charity, and such ? Isn't it unfair for someone who fulfils all the core obligations (righteousness, belief in god, etc) to be granted the same afterlife as someone who fulfils not only the core obligations but much more than that?

Firstly, this argument assumes that you are going to be held to account according to someone else’s standards. Each of us will be held to account according to a unique standard applied to us, according to our personal circumstances.

Secondly, Heaven and Hell are not two simple categories. As the Quran alludes to in its reference to various levels of Heaven and Hell, punishment and reward differ according to a person’s faith and deeds.

However, If a person rejects Islam after knowing Islam and fully understanding its truth he will be asked about it by God. Otherwise he will be judged according to his own religion and his understanding of right and wrong. Simply being a Muslim is not enough to enter paradise. It is the righteous who are rewarded by God

{Chapter 2. Verse 62}

"Surely, those who believed in Allah, and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabians, -whosoever believes in Allah and in the Last Day, and does good deeds - all such people will have their reward with their Lord, and there will be no reason for them to fear, nor shall they grieve"

Hope this clears it up @jimmysmith560 !
This is great! I actually found this same verse you included today while doing some research, along with some other information. Thanks! :D
 

Queenroot

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you should probably look into that haha, its a life or death decision literally
wat lmao
However, If a person rejects Islam after knowing Islam and fully understanding its truth he will be asked about it by God. Otherwise he will be judged according to his own religion and his understanding of right and wrong. Simply being a Muslim is not enough to enter paradise.
Or lack thereof? 😂
 

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