The Abortion Debate... (1 Viewer)

[Not-That-Bright]

maybe if your wonderful prime minister didn't want to ban gays from adopting!

Well it's not just gays adopting, couples who can't have babies.... there's alot of families out there who wanna adopt ( my neighbours for example, she keeps having miscarages ), she has applied for and can't wait to adopt a child....

 

[girlanachronism]

Oh so there's more trauma in giving a child up to adoption than killing it?

There are many parents out there, including some gays etc, who would make great parents to your child.. why not give them a chance?

1 - YOU DO NOT KNOW WHETHER THE EMBRYO FEELS PAIN DURING THE PROCEDURE. EVEN IF IT DOES, BOO FUCKING HOO, IT'D HURT ME MORE TO ACTUALLY HAVE THE CHILD.

2 - If I were to become pregnant again for whatever reason, I would consider the adoption route more carefully. In fact, it's 95% likely that that's the road I would go down. However when you're barely 16 you're not thinking 'gee, I want to get really big and get sick every morning and have extreme mood swings all summer so some couple I don't know can have a child'.

3 - You're still a tool. Of course there is more trauma in the adoption route. Having a child to give it up for adoption entails 9 months of discomfort and pain, not to mention giving birth itself...only to give the result away. An abortion lasts 15 minutes, you don't feel anything during, you may get some slight cramping later and if you do it fully aware of the ramifications there is minimal trauma.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

1 - YOU DO NOT KNOW WHETHER THE EMBRYO FEELS PAIN DURING THE PROCEDURE. EVEN IF IT DOES, BOO FUCKING HOO, IT'D HURT ME MORE TO ACTUALLY HAVE THE CHILD.

Yes, lets not care about other humans... let me remind u that the embryo is a living creature with human dna. It wouldn't hurt you more than the pain that the foetus went thru (however i believe u had urs at 6-7 weeks, at which point i don't think they feel pain).

2 - If I were to become pregnant again for whatever reason, I would consider the adoption route more carefully. In fact, it's 95% likely that that's the road I would go down. However when you're barely 16 you're not thinking 'gee, I want to get really big and get sick every morning and have extreme mood swings all summer so some couple I don't know can have a child'.

That's why we should have laws meaning that u have to have the child after the 12 week period, it's plainly inhumane to kill it, taking it thru so much pain. And as you've pointed out, in retrospect now you would go for the adoption route, people at 16 shouldn't be faced with such tough choices..

3 - You're still a tool. Of course there is more trauma in the adoption route. Having a child to give it up for adoption entails 9 months of discomfort and pain, not to mention giving birth itself...only to give the result away. An abortion lasts 15 minutes, you don't feel anything during, you may get some slight cramping later and if you do it fully aware of the ramifications there is minimal trauma.

What if a mother of 3 year old decides she's tired of the child... should she get rid of him because he's putting her through too much pain, annoying her? Perhaps abortion is the easier route for the mothers if they're ignorant and like to think that they just killed some cells (not a living creature which all scientists i've read so far say the embryo/foetus is), but is it morally right just because it's easier for the mother? The embryo doesn't have a voice, the mother does.. which is why she usually wins out in these sorts of decisions.

 

[crazyhomo]

And as you've pointed out, in retrospect now you would go for the adoption route, people at 16 shouldn't be faced with such tough choices..

she said if she were to get pregnant today she would probably go for adoption. she stands by her previous decision

 

[crazyhomo]

not-that-bright, do you believe that sex without the intent to conceive is ok?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

yes but it's obvious that she can see why abortion is a good thing now, and in retrospect realises that it's the better route than abortion... i don't believe 16 year olds are smart enough to make these decisions on their own sadly...

I also think it's odd that all the girls here don't think guys should have a say, if you have a child they share the legal burden of the child, you both had sex, you both created the child... however he ends up with no say in the matter, it can ruin the 16 year old guys life as much as it can ruin the girls however he has no say - How is that fair?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

not-that-bright, do you believe that sex without the intent to conceive is ok?

Yes of course it's ok, i believe u should wear protection to minimise the risk...but i wasn't a planned baby, i was an accident..

I believe before you have sex you should be ready for the responsibility of a child just incase (especially if you're a guy because you will have no say in the matter).

 

[crazyhomo]

Yes of course it's ok, i believe u should wear protection to minimise the risk...but i wasn't a planned baby, i was an accident..

I believe before you have sex you should be ready for the responsibility of a child just incase (especially if you're a guy because you will have no say in the matter).

so you believe that neither the sperm nor the egg are human until the moment of conception?

 

[LadyBec]

having a child screws up a girl's life far more then its fathers. Thats a simple fact. The father doesn't have to leave school/work to take care of it, as well as at the end of the pregnancy. Aside from that, in the case of young women (who most commly have abortions) the guy isn't ready to commit and raise a family. The fact is that it has a much greater imapct on the life of the mother.

 

[ur_inner_child]

As bizarre as it sounds, I think the woman holds more "say" in it. I agree that the man's opinion is valuable, and those similarities in legal terms etc are valid too.

The thing is 9 months is a fucking long time. It involves a constant sick feeling. You get bigger: employers, peers, teachers parents etc see a pregnant young teenager - its quiet "humiliation" (if you want me to elabourate that, please say so).


Life becomes harder - constant interruptions meaning that going to school or going to work becomes almost impossible. She then makes more sacrafices than a man does, where he doesn't get huge, doesn't get silently looked down upon and forced to give up work or school.


It's much the same value as your parents word about what you should do with your life - it's valid, but to a degree.

 

[girlanachronism]

Yes, lets not care about other humans... let me remind u that the embryo is a living creature with human dna. It wouldn't hurt you more than the pain that the foetus went thru (however i believe u had urs at 6-7 weeks, at which point i don't think they feel pain).

Are you fucking kidding me? 9 months worth of morning sickness and cramping and backaches not to mention the pain involved in labour such as contractions not to mention the pushing the child out compares to ~15 minutes of what is arguably pain? Get a grip

That's why we should have laws meaning that u have to have the child after the 12 week period, it's plainly inhumane to kill it, taking it thru so much pain. And as you've pointed out, in retrospect now you would go for the adoption route, people at 16 shouldn't be faced with such tough choices..

Now, I am a bit older, I'm more self reliant and (I believe) my mother would be more supportive of me. I would have a support system there that I would not have had 14 months ago. Many women do not have this support system, regardless of age.

What if a mother of 3 year old decides she's tired of the child... should she get rid of him because he's putting her through too much pain, annoying her? Perhaps abortion is the easier route for the mothers if they're ignorant and like to think that they just killed some cells (not a living creature which all scientists i've read so far say the embryo/foetus is), but is it morally right just because it's easier for the mother? The embryo doesn't have a voice, the mother does.. which is why she usually wins out in these sorts of decisions.

That is a completely different situation. The child you are talking about is autonomous and not physically reliant on the mother's BODY. That is the distinction.

 

[LadyBec]

Yes of course it's ok, i believe u should wear protection to minimise the risk...but i wasn't a planned baby, i was an accident..

i was an acident too actually....just goes to show that contraception doesnt always work

 

[Sophie777]

Well it's not just gays adopting, couples who can't have babies.... there's alot of families out there who wanna adopt ( my neighbours for example, she keeps having miscarages ), she has applied for and can't wait to adopt a child....

Why would you go through 9 months of pregnancy and risk your life to give the baby away? It is rediculous.

 

[thejosiekiller]

how do you know you were accidents- did ur parents tell u that?

 

[Sophie777]

Embryo has no say, it isn't alive yet. It is unethical yes, a minefield. But, the mother's life is that which is most important. It is, in many cases, far worse for the child to bring it into the world where the mother may then murder it, kill herself or ruin its entire life.

 

[ur_inner_child]

DAMNIT! my post was at the end of the other page... No one will read it!

But yeah, pretty much what LadyBec said

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I would rather go through sickness, cramps and whatever than have my limps sucked off me only to meet my death... i'm sure you would too

YES it's hard, YES it's difficult but does it justify you ending the short life of something that IS a devloping human being?!

10 WEEKS
First Trimester
- http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/AbortionPictures/27.html
- http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/AbortionPictures/10_weeks-13.jpg

22 WEEKS
- http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/AbortionPictures/22_weeks-01.jpg
- http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/AbortionPictures/22_weeks-03.jpg

When does it become human? When is it killing another human?!

Sophie : How bad it's life will be is just speculation, it might end up having a FINE life, however if it is aborted there is NO chance of it having a life at all.

 

[LadyBec]

how do you know you were accidents- did ur parents tell u that?

they did as a matter of fact. But i don't mind i was a happy suprise
or so they claim....

 

[girlanachronism]

HOLY SHIT! I have said approx 838580 times that I generally disagree with abortion past a certain point!

I'm sorry, but ~15 of pain of a non autonmous creature is far more preferable to me than pregnancy and childbirth. Especially considering that childbirth has physical ramifications, ie stretchmarks not to mention decreased bladder control and it also can make sex less enjoyable.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

oh no decreased bladder control, less enjoyable sex....
How's bout death?

And where would your point be?