Is western civilisation better than aboriginies of the past? (1 Viewer)

[Riet]

Yes, life expectancy now is 20 years lower than the rest of the population and that is a big problem, but 60 is still double what it was 100 years ago. You realise that prior to (and into) the 20th century Europeans were still dying of smallpox, polio, measles and such?

 

[Riet]

Knock yourselves out
Guns Germs and Steel_1 of 3

 

[Misericorde]

[citation here]

Most civilisations started farming around Neolithic.

 

[Riet]

[citation here]

Most civilisations started farming around Neolithic.

Suggest you watch Guns, Germs & Steel too. Farming started in the fertile belt (the middle east, more or less) and spread.

 

[cxlxoxk]

This does not erase the fact they had a hunter/gatherer lifestyle pre-colonisation. Whilst it's all very well to say, that sounds like good exercise and so much fun, it is not the optimal way to live and life expectancies of such primitive practices are (as have been mentioned) 30.

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life expectancy =/= greatness

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and bahahahaah

NT:Rudd can't deliver on Aboriginal life expectancy:experts | Article from AAP General News (Australia) | HighBeam Research

inaccurate statistics

 

[Misericorde]

Suggest you watch Guns, Germs & Steel too. Farming started in the fertile belt (the middle east, more or less) and spread.

Yes, they had the right animals and crops to domesticate. But I was saying when humans started farming. Unless I've misunderstood, or am just plain wrong?

No it wasn't that it was just that optimal was too undefined. Optimal seemed like the entirely wrong word, it just 'stuck in my craw' as one would say.

I agree it was rather pithy word choice.

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life expectancy =/= greatness

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and bahahahaah

NT:Rudd can't deliver on Aboriginal life expectancy:experts | Article from AAP General News (Australia) | HighBeam Research

Beats me why there's healthcare, then.
Not sure why you dismiss the whole argument and then provide evidence, but Aboriginal life expectancies would a lot worse if there was no Rudd at all.

 

[cxlxoxk]

the conquistadors led the way, a few 100 men who came to the new world and decimated the native population.

wow i'm so proud of being part of a murderous society/culture.

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i'll continue watching just to get what this has to say...

 

[Misericorde]

the conquistadors led the way, a few 100 men who came to the new world and decimated the native population.

wow i'm so proud of being part of a genocidal society/culture.

I am.
I prefer centuries of Western arts, philosophy, history and innovation over ritual sacrifice and a very accurate calendar.

EDIT: And wealth. Let's not forget wealth. Mmmm.

 

[Misericorde]

Spaghetti isn't bad, either. Or pornography.

 

[Riet]

The internet is pretty fucking sweet to, eh.

 

[cxlxoxk]

"In this environment, i'd be helpless without them." Diamond - Guns Germs Steel

 

[Misericorde]

"In this environment, i'd be helpless without them." Diamond - Guns Germs Steel

"In this environment," Diamond said, looking around at the purple jellybean world, "I'd be helpless without them." He touched his toes appreciatively.

Context, please?

 

[Riet]

Like I said, anyone from the city regardless of race would die in the outback within a week. If you think that's proof of their cultural achievements: do you think they could survive in the swiss alps? or the moors of england? or in siberia? Or on the steppes of Eurasia? Or in the Andes? Or on the savannahs?

 

[cxlxoxk]

He was saying, that, in a environment like the bush, people in the modern world could not survive. We had to cut everything down, and build a city (something artificial to survive.

Also Diamond "You number 1, me number 2", i think i like Diamond, thanks for Guns Germs and Steel link.

He actually acknowledges, that some cultures are better at some things than others, and that each way of life does have advantages, whether or not, it's lifespan.

 

[Riet]

Cultural relativism is bullshit. Seriously get over it.

 

[Kwayera]

And you know, I hate being held responsible by cultural relativists for the crimes my ancestors perpretrated. Yes, 'we' as a 'race' massacred the Aborigines, but that was 250 years ago. I am not guilty for that, and neither are modern Spaniards for the accidental genocide of the South American Indians by disease. Neither are modern Aborigines for their own tribal warfare.

Give it a rest.

 

[ongitsanjali]

are you indian ?

yess

 

[ongitsanjali]

And you know, I hate being held responsible by cultural relativists for the crimes my ancestors perpretrated. Yes, 'we' as a 'race' massacred the Aborigines, but that was 250 years ago. I am not guilty for that, and neither are modern Spaniards for the accidental genocide of the South American Indians by disease. Neither are modern Aborigines for their own tribal warfare.

Give it a rest.

what is it with you and ur stupid cultural relativism line you keep parroting every time?

it's simple. yes, 250 yrs ago they were expolited and destroyed and all that and it was ENTIRELY THE CONVICTS' FAULT, and, yes, that has nothing to do with us today.

BUT the fact remains that until the seventies, children were being taken away from their parents by force (then raped, abused, forced to work, whatever else) or they were being herded into reserves like animals. the fact also remains that jerks like yourself and pretty much most people in this forum are NOT making it any better, because of your narrow, racist attitudes and lack of sympathy towards the crap they have had to go through.

 

[Riet]

Wait, it was the convicts fault?

 

[ongitsanjali]

uhh... they were mostly convicts weren't they :S