MedVision ad

the hsc cannot tell you how smart you are. discuss (3 Viewers)

Sweets

objective subjectives
Joined
Aug 20, 2004
Messages
1,150
Location
Somewhere over the rainbow..
Gender
Female
HSC
2005
Airness said:
In the end, however smart you are, if you do things half-heartedly, you can expect half-hearted results. And no one will care when you cry and moan about how unfair life is.
I maintain that there is nothing wrong with bitching and moaning about how unfair life is :p

And in the HSC effort does not always equal outcome. I was half-hearted the whole year, because I didn't really know what I wanted. And I know people who were much more motivated then me and worked really hard but didn't necessarily do as well, for whatever reason. Some people are often just better suited to the type of skills the HSC tests.
 

insert-username

Wandering the Lacuna
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,226
Location
NSW
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
Smart or no, the HSC does arguably provide a standardised way of comparing how much effort people across NSW are willing to put in to secure their future. Which, in a way, is perhaps even more important than intelligence: having the will and determination to apply your intelligence.


I_F
 

blackfriday

Pezzonovante
Joined
Sep 2, 2004
Messages
1,490
Location
in ya mum!
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2005
how 'smart' you are is too subjective. what do you want to do in life, what are you using your 'smarts' for? something like maths measures your aptitude and how you can apply what you learn to different interpretations of a problem. economics sees how you can link cause and effect using rational deduction. if these are seen as measures of intelligence then so be it.

'the hsc cannot tell how smart you are' is bollocks. it can, but not neccessarily.
 

davo_

good kid
Joined
May 13, 2004
Messages
348
Location
Canberra/West Wyalong
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
_dhj_ said:
The example I've given was only meant to address your statement in regard to the formula of success (the "super-essay"), not the general topic of the thread. But what I've said before holds true - if they were smart they would have "played the game".
"Played the game"? That is to say a smart person will do well in HSC no matter what- because correlate exactly? I have mates who left at the end of year 10 to become tradesmen; now they're going to be a lot better off than me in future more than likely. They've played the game pretty well I'd say, and they didn't even do the HSC...
 

poloktim

\(^o^)/
Joined
Jun 15, 2003
Messages
1,323
Location
Wollongong
Gender
Male
HSC
2003
Go to uni and see how smart you become. Seriously, you can do really poorly in your HSC and get a lower UAI than some and discover you're going to get first class honours while those who scored higher are struggling to maintain a P average.

Guess what kiddies, get over the HSC/UAI. By now most of you have been offered a place in university. Your UAI has served its purpose, so let it go. :)
 

Benny1103

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2004
Messages
217
Location
Melbourne, Victoria
Gender
Male
HSC
N/A
When was the last time any of you called/thought someone was stupid? It's a sure bet that when you called/thought that person was stupid, you based it on a very narrow observation. That is, you made your judgment based a single thing they said, or a single thing they did. So what's the difference between that and calling someone stupid because they did crap in the HSC?
 

blackfriday

Pezzonovante
Joined
Sep 2, 2004
Messages
1,490
Location
in ya mum!
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2005
are you trying to take the 'do not judge others' moral high ground? of course you can tell within the first five minutes of meeting someone whether they are an idiot or not.
 

poloktim

\(^o^)/
Joined
Jun 15, 2003
Messages
1,323
Location
Wollongong
Gender
Male
HSC
2003
Benny1103 said:
When was the last time any of you called/thought someone was stupid? It's a sure bet that when you called/thought that person was stupid, you based it on a very narrow observation. That is, you made your judgment based a single thing they said, or a single thing they did. So what's the difference between that and calling someone stupid because they did crap in the HSC?
That's a really naive thing to say.

You're basing all this on your own opinion of what is bright and what is not. You should understand that not everybody wants a spot in uni, and not everybody does their HSC to show off how well they can memorise material. You also seem to be stuck in the mindset that the HSC is the be-all-end-all. It's not. A lot of people discontinue their schooling from year ten, year eleven and during their final year to go off and do something else. They'll also know a lot more about what they do than you would.

If you stopped wasting time thinking about how "stupid" other people are, and spent more time worrying about yourself, you'd be much better off.
 

Benny1103

Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2004
Messages
217
Location
Melbourne, Victoria
Gender
Male
HSC
N/A
Maybe you should actually read what I say. In the paragraph of mine which you quoted, I never referred to what I think is bright and not bright. I simply said that it's a sure bet that that the last time any of you called/thought someone was stupid, you made such a judgment based on a single observation.

Your misinterpretation of the simple message in my post (the part that you quoted) is typical of someone who lets their emotions cloud their judgment when someone makes a comment which strikes their nerve. This impairs the person's ability to actually read what has been said, leading them to butcher my post and make it look as if I said something which I did not say. I do not appreciate it when people do that. This is a discussion. Don't make it personal.

For the record, if I thought the HSC (I did VCE) was the 'be-all-end-all' then I wouldn't be obtaining high scores in Uni.
 

funnybunny

funniest bunny in th land
Joined
Jul 2, 2004
Messages
404
Location
universe realm 23 i.e outta this realm
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
pfft..
of course the uai is correlated 2 intelligence..
yes, it is true that the hsc is a lot of memorisation and regurgitation, but SMART ppl actually think about the future and they realise that getting into the course they desire at uni is a very important step in realising their career goals.

Then they link this with teh fact that u need a uai 2 get into uni and it is competitive. ...therefore, SMART people put a lot of effort into the hsc 2 get a high uai, and eventually get into their desired course... unlike those ppl who do not, and then start complaining...ppl like u, who started this thread..:wave:

So, i guess it's more like if ur smart, then u'll put more effort into getting a higher uai not the other way around....if u get wat i mean..but if u dont, u must hav not gotten a high uai:rofl:
 
Last edited:

goldendawn

ὄσον ζῆς...
Joined
Aug 26, 2004
Messages
1,579
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
In the current WISC test for young adults, I scored in the 99th percentile for verbal skills - that's age equivalent 36. In English Extension 1, the HSC markers gave me an exam result of 35. The HSC indicates a certain range of abilities, and is more suited to specific learning styles. For example, the HSC is ill-suited to "big picture thinkers", those who begin with a fundamental concept or inclusive structure, and then seek details. Also, and quite ironically, in my opinion - the Board of Studies emphasis on "postmodern" theory and practise is tyrannical. It's my opinion that responses endorsing, or simply alluding to "postmodern" relatavism are unfairly preferenced. Alot of it is simple sophistry (also known as bullshitting). Everyone has their strengths and weaknesses. In an attempt to create a 'competitive educational standard', the HSC favours certain strengths. I don't, however, think that it's fair to say that those who received UAI's in the high 90's didn't deserve them; it's more fair to say that many who received lower UAI's deserved better results. At any rate, once you're in your Uni course, the UAI becomes irrelevant. It's not your academic transcript that really matters, anyway. Who stands in the river Styx and proclaims,"You lived well!", or "You lived badly!" based on your intellectual abilities or school marks?
 

SiZmOs

"Shaken, not stirred."
Joined
Jun 5, 2005
Messages
1,493
Location
Bass Hill
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
for this discussion to work, dont we need some things to be clear first?

i) define 'smart'
ii) define 'high uai'
iii) define 'low uai'

doesnt one's ability to 'succeed' also depend on their willingness and perseverance throughout their school life.
i wanted to get into a policing course - something which doesn't really need that high of a UAI, and yet i was considered a 'smart' person at school. because i always did my work and attempted things.
i got my UAI for policing, but only by a point or two...
 

Abtari

Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2004
Messages
604
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
wanton-wonton said:
People who think they're intelligent are never intelligent. (Usually). The opposite also applies.

Anyway, take this for example. A person with a UAI of less than 30 or a person of UAI of 100.

WELL I WONDER WHO IS MORE INTELLIGENT?!?!?!

So yes, to an extent, the HSC does tell how smart one is.
rofl...............................
 

AsyLum

Premium Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2002
Messages
15,899
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
funnybunny said:
pfft..
of course the uai is correlated 2 intelligence..
yes, it is true that the hsc is a lot of memorisation and regurgitation, but SMART ppl actually think about the future and they realise that getting into the course they desire at uni is a very important step in realising their career goals.

Then they link this with teh fact that u need a uai 2 get into uni and it is competitive. ...therefore, SMART people put a lot of effort into the hsc 2 get a high uai, and eventually get into their desired course... unlike those ppl who do not, and then start complaining...ppl like u, who started this thread..:wave:

So, i guess it's more like if ur smart, then u'll put more effort into getting a higher uai not the other way around....if u get wat i mean..but if u dont, u must hav not gotten a high uai:rofl:
A truly smart person would've dropped out at Year Ten, gained themselves an apprenticeship, worked for 4-5 years, gained a good windfall, and lightened the load on their work, possibly gaining a mature age entry into a business degree and furthering their business plan through a range of ideas and concepts through graduate school of business/marketing.

Started their own franchise, invested in property, and retired by the age of 45 with a good financial windfall and an almost self-autonomous franchise.

Being smart has nothing to do with your outlook on life, not everybody gains their dreams and knows their life plans by the age of 16-18, neither does everyone need academic skills or a piece of paper which costs them a leg and an arm to tell them they are intelligent or smart. What your HSC/UAI accords is that you have completed a set of tasks allotted within a year, to a scale of *-100.00 UAI. You can draw conclusions that because student A gained 100.00 UAI that it automatically guarantees they are smart and will succeed is stupid, just as much as saying that student B who got a 60 UAI was a bad student and stupid.

The argument that you have to conform to a worldly set of exams/lessons/restraints, as i have previously explained, fails due to the spoonfeeding nature of the HSC. You DONT have a year to do tasks, you DONT have 4 weeks to complete most 1,000 word essays. You usually work in days and sometimes in hours. The skills are preliminary, and offer a very basic understanding in the general sense. The dux at our school for our year was a hard worker, but i wouldn't call him incredibly smart nor intelligent, hardly compared to another student who played computer games, and practically bludged through 4unit maths and 3unit english without breaking a sweat, and now stands on a perfect HD GPA at uni in a B Comm-Actuarial Studies. He is eloquent, well-read, and also one of the brightest people i have ever met. Meanwhile the other student is on a Credit Average in B Nanotech.

It is incredibly difficult to pinpoint exactly what 'smart' is, especially in an overtly 'postmodern' (a term far outdated) world which seems to rely on an inherently contradictory cycle of relativism, perspectives and some semblance of objectivity.
(And before anyone tries to start a "its just my opinion" debate, please don't, the HSC syllabus on 'post-modernism' is horrid at best and relies too much on a pseudowankery which tries to pose as philo-psychological undertaking in a literary sense.)
 

Not-That-Bright

Andrew Quah
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Messages
12,176
Location
Sydney, Australia.
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
I'm with asylum, it seems our latest HSC Graduates are a bunch of little conformist cunts... They see everything from the perspective of "Do Well in HSC > Do Well At Uni > Do Well at Job > Perfect life" - It is... such a narrow world view, there is so much more out there to fulfill your lives guys.
 

AsyLum

Premium Member
Joined
Nov 13, 2002
Messages
15,899
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Its because most of them havent even stepped into uni yet, soon they'll be broken, dreams crushed, and soon, they too will become jilted with the world :p
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 3)

Top